The Pope, Our God and Allah

[Jaguar]

Obviously, he was praying to our God and not Allah, a few months back, or was he — since he stated we and the Muslims believe in the one true God? Please explain!

 

[havemercy]

Benedict was praying to God: Father, Son, and Holy Spirit.
The Muslims were not.
Therefore Benedict was not praying to Allah.

 

[Nita]

Christians, Jews, and Moslems believe there is only one God; that He is our Creator and Creator of the universe. So, when they pray to the one God who created the universe and all that is in it, they are praying to the same God.

It is the same God.
It is our degree of knowledge about Him, our understandings of His attributes that differ.

If two separate people call you on the phone and one of them thinks you’re 20 years old and single, while the other thinks you’re 30 years old and married, their knowledge and understanding of who you are is different, but they have both “talked” (prayed) to the “same person” (you).

Nita

 

[GandalfTheWhite]

Do you know that some Easter Rite Catholics, which are based around Arabic language (I don’t remember which ones), also say Allah? Allah means God in Arabic.

 

[Verbum]

Hi Gandalf,

The Maronites use Arabic and call God Allah.Allah means “God” in Arabic. The root for Allah is the same as that for the Hebrew equivalent for God : El, as in Israel, Gabriel, etc.

Verbum

 

[Mannyfit75]

Hi Gandalf,

The Maronites use Arabic and call God Allah.Allah means “God” in Arabic. The root for Allah is the same as that for the Hebrew equivalent for God : El, as in Israel, Gabriel, etc.

Verbum

I know an Iraq Caldean in Abu Guraib and he called our God Allah, and he is Catholic. He speaks Arabic.

 

[rwoehmke]

Can there be more than one “God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob”?

 

[Mannyfit75]

Can there be more than one “God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob”?

There is only One God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob.

 

[Gara3987]

The Jewish god and Allah are not the Catholic God, if they were then the Muslims and Jews would say in their Language; Father Son and Holy Ghost. You may want to check out what this Priest has to say from :
(this site will provide you all the information that you are loking for)
trosch.org/bks/islm/allah_false_god.html

Basically it would be a Singular god versus collective God, this information is from Father Trosch.

The singular Allah versus the collective known as The Holy Trinity

    Allah, a mythological construct; a non motivated purposeless imaginary existence.  To formulate the concept of Allah one must be able to imagine an intellectual being having existence in a complete void –no light, no darkness, no walls, floors or ceilings, nothing to indicate that he is floating or not floating, no identity (that which separates one thing or person from another) and nothing to identify with other than itself, without need for language or reason for thought.  Then, out of nowhere so to speak, being motivated to create.  The fact is that the inspiration for the background of Islamic beliefs is Judeo-Christian teachings that have in part been deleted and then added to in accordance with the desires and purposes of Mohammed.

* Fear of religious freedom – Islam a religion unable to reasonably or theologically support its beliefs and often resorts to intimidation to gain and keep its members.
* Muslim Suicide Bombing (an activity condemning the bomber and all participants to eternal damnation) is a satanic inspiration – Brainwashed persons not only murder themselves but commonly include randomly selected innocent victims.
          Islam uses the argument that if some of a people have guilt, then all associated with that some are guilty.  The antithesis of this would be that if some muslims are guilty of terrorism, that is, wanton murder, then all of Islam is guilty - if not directly guilty then by omission through failure to directly oppose and punish offenders, or at the very least openly declare that they are under eternal condemnation and separated (excommunicated) from Islam.

    On the other hand one can imagine a Trinity of unlimited Beings –each entirely different than the others, aware of the existence of the others, each intelligent in his own right– that are motivated to a common purpose of existence and subsequently create limited intellectual beings in their image after their likeness, who would recognize them as primary and necessary beings termed and referred to by the collective term, God.

        Trinity: a collection of three different uniquely identifiable beings having a constructive, purposeful, interrelated, and intermingled existence.  The Holy Trinity is clearly the superior form of foundation for human existence.  [various terms use to identity a group of beings:  God, army, fraternity, congress, pride, flock, pack, etc.]

    Allah is a false god, a human construct created in the imagination of Mohammed who may have had the idea of eliminating all but one pagan god having the purpose of obtaining peace among members of related families often opposed to each other in frequent tribal wars.  Additional motivation for unity was developed by directing the arabs' warlike tendencies towards conquest of those not of their association.

    External peace and freedom of religion is not of Islam.  At its very root of formation was opposition to other forms of worship.  In the long term they only submitted to peace when they were not strong enough to conquer.  While customs vary from tribe to tribe, Islam's existence is based upon fear and brain washing, even among their own, as illustrated in the extreme beliefs and practices of Afghanistan's Taliban.

 

[Timmy_Z]

Steve and John both claim to know a man named Tony. Steve tells you Tony is an elderly, thin black man. John tells you Tony is a newborn asian boy. It is obvious Steve and John know a different Tony.

Christians describe God as trinitarian and muslims describe god differently. They obviously know/believe different gods.

Did the pope really pray with muslims or to their false god recently? Please clarify.

-Tim

 

[Mannyfit75]

Steve and John both claim to know a man named Tony. Steve tells you Tony is an elderly, thin black man. John tells you Tony is a newborn asian boy. It is obvious Steve and John know a different Tony.

Christians describe God as trinitarian and muslims describe god differently. They obviously know/believe different gods.

Did the pope really pray with muslims or to their false god recently? Please clarify.

-Tim

Muslim basic belief there is One God. They are correct. There is indeed one God.

However, the Muslim religion does not contain the fullness of truth.

The only One God who we believe is the God of Abraham. The Triune God, which we Christian profess.

The Pope prayed to One God.

Please understand that Christian Arabs called our God Allah. Is the Christian Arab worshipping a different God than Western Christian?

Wikipedia;

Allah is the Arabic language word for “God.” However, it should be noted that the word literally means “The One to be worshipped”[1][2]. It is best known in the West for its use in the Muslim holy book, the Qur’an, which is an Arabic work. However, the word is the common term for God used by all Arabic speakers, whatever their religion, including Arab Christians and Jews. Consequently, the word is used in Arabic translations of Tanakh and the Gospels, as well as in Indonesian and old Turkish translations of the Bible. Arabic speakers of all faiths use the word “Allah” to mean “God”.

In Islam, Allah is the One and Only God (without any partner) 112:1, the supreme Creator, the God of Abraham, Isaac, and Jacob, as well as of Jesus and Muhammad. Islamic scholars often translate “Allāh” directly into English as “God.” This is consistent with the word’s etymological derivation (see Etymology below). However, some scholars infer that “Allāh” should not be translated, arguing that “Allāh” is a special and glorified term whose use should be preserved. This is a significant issue when translating the Qur’an.

I my own remarks the beliefs of Islam is in deep conflict with the pillars of Christianity. The Pope in his life is a Christian man. Yes, he prayed with the Muslim Immams, but who are you to judge what is in his heart?

Unless you are God himself, you know have to judge him wrongly.

Pope Benedict XVI to this day has not profess the Islamic faith if he did, he would be committing heresy contrary to the belief of Catholic Christianity.

I would be careful for any Non-Catholic to judge a Pope when he prays with a Non-Christian.

The Pope prayed with in the Jewish Synogugue in Rome. Is he committing heresy?

This past Sunday I went to a Non-Denomination Church. I did not part take in their prayer but pray silently in my heart. I could not take part because I am Catholic. If I had choice to pray in their service I would sing the hyms praising Jesus.

When the pastor offer an alter call, I did not go because I would abandon my Catholic faith.

Likewise, the Pope pray in his own way. Don’t judge.

I must confess to you. I was extremely Anti-Protestant Catholic. Since I went to the service. I admire them, but I will not be a Protestant. I find something lacking in the Protestant doctrines so I remain Catholic.

The Pope know what he is doing.

 

[GandalfTheWhite]

Steve and John both claim to know a man named Tony. Steve tells you Tony is an elderly, thin black man. John tells you Tony is a newborn asian boy. It is obvious Steve and John know a different Tony.

Christians describe God as trinitarian and muslims describe god differently. They obviously know/believe different gods.

-Tim

No

It’s more like this: Friends A and B are neighbors and both claim to know the man Tonny - the Tonny that goes to church every Sunday and that passes their house every day to buy ice cream in the local shop.

A describes Tonny as an elderly white man and B describes Tonny as an middle-aged Asian man. A is right.

Now, when A says that he would like to meet Tonny, is he referring to the Tonny in question? Yes, of course. How about B? If B says to A that they should invite Tonny for dinner is he referring to a different person? Again, of course he isn’t. He is still speaking about the same person - the one who goes to church every Sunday and that passes their house every day. B is only misguided about who Tonny actually is while A holds the “fullness of truth”.

Now the same thing applies to Muslims and Jews. Muslims still believe in our God, however they are very much wrong about who he actually is. They hold a very distorted version of his identity. However Allah is still the One God who spoke to Abraham, sent Jesus etc.

In case of Jews the case is even clearer. They believe in the One God as he revealed to them in the OT. Can one say that Jews during OT time worshiped a different God? Can we say that they actually sacrificed to a false God? They didn’t believe in Trinity yet Trinity is eternal. It wasn’t created for the NT times. So once again Jews believe in God but they don’t hold the fullness of truth about him because they reject the the Good News and Teachings that came later on.

Did the pope really pray with muslims or to their false god recently? Please clarify.

He did pray with along side with Muslims but not to a false God. He certainly prayed to One God - God the Father, God the Father and God the Holly Spirit. In a sense, the Muslims prayed to him as well, but unfortunately not knowing that they perception of him is very different from the reality.

 

[GandalfTheWhite]

Gara3987: I disagree with the article you posted and I outlined the reasons.

One thing I want to note - the site from which you quoted the article is heretical and full of conspiracy theories. It’s almost like a “catholic” younger brother of Jack Chick. Funny, your profile says that you’re a Roman Catholic, yet you quote from an article which on the bottom claims that John Paul II was an anti-christ and “is not only a heretic, but an anti-Christ subject to eternal condemnation”. However that’s not it. It gets even better once you start browsing around the site. Along the many things the site claims tobacco growers, cigarette manufacturers and distributors deserve death penalty, that our current pope Benedict XVI should resign, or that he is part of the the Illuminati’s so called “One World Religion” movement, that has connections to Satanism etc.

 

[Nita]

The Jewish god and Allah are not the Catholic God, if they were then the Muslims and Jews would say in their Language; Father Son and Holy Ghost. You may want to check out what this Priest has to say from :
(this site will provide you all the information that you are loking for)
trosch.org/bks/islm/allah_false_god.html

Do you realize that you’re asserting the God revealed in the Old Testament, the one worshipped by the Jews, is not really God?; that He is not the same God that is further revealed in the New Testament?

Nita

 

[Verbum]

Hi Gara,

Gandalf has the right idea. Since there is only one God, whoever believes in one God, Creator of all things believes in the same God as we do.

You should not confuse worshipping God with the knowledge that one might have about God. The Muslims and Jews do not know as much as we do about God. But that does not change the fact, that they worship the only God, the true One.

Verbum

 

[Timmy_Z]

Is this the official (infallible?) view of the RCC?

 

[Mannyfit75]

Is this the official (infallible?) view of the RCC?

That there is Only One God. Yes, that is the Truth.

 

[Nita]

Is this the official (infallible?) view of the RCC?

An easy way to know what the Catholic Church teaches is to purchase a copy of “The Catechism of the Catholic Church”. Price is very reasonable. Or you can look it up online.

Nita

 

[Timmy_Z]

(a little more specific this time)

Is it the official (infallible?) view of the RCC that muslims and Christians, despite their mutually exclusive views, pray to the same god?

whoever believes in one God, Creator of all things believes in the same God as we do.

Or those who pray to false gods are being deceived and worshipping other spiritual entities.

-Tim

 

[Nita]

(a little more specific this time)

Is it the official (infallible?) view of the RCC that muslims and Christians, despite their mutually exclusive views, pray to the same god?

Or those who pray to false gods are being deceived and worshipping other spiritual entities.

-Tim

Yes. The following is from the Vatican II Document titled “Lumen Gentium”:

“16. Finally, those who have not yet received the Gospel are related to the People of God in various ways. There is, first, that people to which the covenants and promises were made, and from which Christ was born according to the flesh (cf. Rom. 9:4-5): in view of the divine choice, they are a people most dear for the sake of the fathers, for the gifts of God are without repentance (cf. Rom. 11:29). But the plan of salvation also includes those who acknowledge the Creator, in the first place amongst whom are the Moslems: these profess to hold the faith of Abraham, and together with us they adore the one, merciful God, mankind’s judge on the last day. …”

There was no separate ex cathedra pronouncement (extremely rare occurance) on the Moslems by the Pope. Rather, it is part of the official teaching of the Magisterium (Pope and all the bishops) and is therefore considered infallible. I’m sure you can find the document on line if you’d like to read it in its entirety.

Hope this answers your question.

Nita