The power of the Psalms

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NotWorthy said:
Yes, provided we are properly focusing on the mysteries.

Many non-Catholic Christians feel that the Catholic Faith is full of empty rituals. The Mass and the Rosary are the two best examples of this being completely false… or completely true.
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Good point. Same with the many rituals that Jews practice. They can be empty and pointless or they can be an opportunity to bring oneself closer the Ineffable Presence.
 
NotWorthy said:
That’s interesting. A priest, one who introduced me to the daily recitations of the Psalms, told me that if we were to lose the entire Old Testament, but retain the Psalms, we could pretty much reconstruct the entire Old Testament.

I’d like your thoughts on that.
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Sounds good to me. I do know that much of the Talmud refers to verses of Psalm to provide authority for many of our laws, and those verses are always (or almost always) accompanied by supporting scripture. So I think each verse can be used to link to a piece of scripture.

On a more metaphorical approach, I do believe that the Psalms cover a great deal and teach much of what is taught in scripture.
 
The majority of the songs in Handel’s Messiah are either quotes from the Psalms or Isaiah. What a beautiful masterpiece that is! 🙂 🙂
 
I did some research, and here is what I found out about the disturbing psalms.
Imprecatory psalms are those those psalms that contain curses or prayers for the punishment of the psalmist’s enemies. To imprecate means to invoke evil upon, or curse. Psalms 7, 35, 55, 58, 59, 69, 79, 109, 137 and 139 all contain prayers for God’s judgment on the psalmist’s enemies. Example imprecatory statements from the Psalms follow:

• Psalm 55:15 - Let death take my enemies by surprise; let them go down alive to the grave.

• Psalm 58:6 - O God, break the teeth in their mouths.

• Psalm 69:28 - May they be blotted out of the book of life and not be listed with the righteous.

• Psalm 109:9 - May his children be fatherless and his wife a widow.

• Psalm 137:9 - How blessed will be the one who seizes your infants and dashes them against the rocks.

“While these psalms are not positive and pious, they are honest expressions of pain in the face of grief and endings. We should not attempt to Christianize them by pretending they are something they are not. Yet neither can we exclude them as sub-Christian. Rather we need to take them seiously as a valid biblical response to God in paryer from the depths of our humanity. Since we accept these psalms as scripture for th church, we need to allow them to inform our theology rather thatn using our theology to change the psalms.” From “INTRODUCING THE PSALMS” by Dennis Bractcher.
 
CHRISTINE77 said:
I did some research, and here is what I found out about the disturbing psalms.
Imprecatory psalms are those those psalms that contain curses or prayers for the punishment of the psalmist’s enemies. To imprecate means to invoke evil upon, or curse. Psalms 7, 35, 55, 58, 59, 69, 79, 109, 137 and 139 all contain prayers for God’s judgment on the psalmist’s enemies. Example imprecatory statements from the Psalms follow:

• Psalm 55:15 - Let death take my enemies by surprise; let them go down alive to the grave.

• Psalm 58:6 - O God, break the teeth in their mouths.

• Psalm 69:28 - May they be blotted out of the book of life and not be listed with the righteous.

• Psalm 109:9 - May his children be fatherless and his wife a widow.

• Psalm 137:9 - How blessed will be the one who seizes your infants and dashes them against the rocks.

“While these psalms are not positive and pious, they are honest expressions of pain in the face of grief and endings. We should not attempt to Christianize them by pretending they are something they are not. Yet neither can we exclude them as sub-Christian. Rather we need to take them seiously as a valid biblical response to God in paryer from the depths of our humanity. Since we accept these psalms as scripture for th church, we need to allow them to inform our theology rather thatn using our theology to change the psalms.” From “INTRODUCING THE PSALMS” by Dennis Bractcher.
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Thanks Christine!

I will indeed look into these studies. Dennis Bractcher’s book - is that good?

Regarding his phrase, “they are honest expressions of pain in the face of grief and endings…” I refer you back to the comment I made on a previous post that a priest once told me I don’t relate to the Book of Job very well because I haven’t had many hardships or disappointments in my life. This may be the same reason that these imprecatory psalms don’t do much for me.
 
Of course, to those that say All Scripture is Inspired by God and that we should treat all the Psalms with equal prayer and meditation, how many plaques on people’s walls have you seen of Psalm 58? 😉

Are they as many as there are of Psalm 23?
 
NotWorthy said:
Of course, to those that say All Scripture is Inspired by God and that we should treat all the Psalms with equal prayer and meditation, how many plaques on people’s walls have you seen of Psalm 58? 😉

Are they as many as there are of Psalm 23?
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I doubt it!:rotfl:
 
NotWorthy said:
Of course, to those that say All Scripture is Inspired by God and that we should treat all the Psalms with equal prayer and meditation, how many plaques on people’s walls have you seen of Psalm 58? 😉

Are they as many as there are of Psalm 23?
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Psalm 23 is also Psalm 22 in the Douay-Rheims so in modern Bibles you could say it is more, but in the case of the Douay-Rheims, it would be the same amount of plaques on the walls. Watch how you address the Psalms in their numbers
 
NotWorthy said:
Thanks Christine!

I will indeed look into these studies. Dennis Bractcher’s book - is that good?

Regarding his phrase, “they are honest expressions of pain in the face of grief and endings…” I refer you back to the comment I made on a previous post that a priest once told me I don’t relate to the Book of Job very well because I haven’t had many hardships or disappointments in my life. This may be the same reason that these imprecatory psalms don’t do much for me.
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I actually just found an article by Bratcher on the internet. But this thread has made me very interested in learning more about the psalms. Basically there are 3 types: Laments, Thanksgiving (or Todah) and Hymnic. They span a huge history, from 1100 BC (29) to 400 BC (119).

Personally, I love the Book of Job, it’s so full of everything, like the way his friends think they know all the answers, how he argues and complains to God, and how God finally responds: “who claims to know me?”. (I like Tobit too though). The Bible is full of amazing and wonderful things!
 
tobinatorstark said:
Psalm 23 is also Psalm 22 in the Douay-Rheims so in modern Bibles you could say it is more, but in the case of the Douay-Rheims, it would be the same amount of plaques on the walls. Watch how you address the Psalms in their numbers
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I go by the Catholic Lectionary.

But point taken.
 
CHRISTINE77 said:
Personally, I love the Book of Job, it’s so full of everything, like the way his friends think they know all the answers, how he argues and complains to God, and how God finally responds: “who claims to know me?”. (I like Tobit too though). The Bible is full of amazing and wonderful things!
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Now see. This is where I have the problem. When I read Job, its like I’m watching an old Archie Bunker’s “All in the Family” episode, but without the jokes. Once you take out the jokes, its basically 30 minutes of arguing. I get that same feeling after reading Job.
 
NotWorthy said:
Now see. This is where I have the problem. When I read Job, its like I’m watching an old Archie Bunker’s “All in the Family” episode, but without the jokes. Once you take out the jokes, its basically 30 minutes of arguing. I get that same feeling after reading Job.
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Actually, I think there is humor in it. A lot of the Old Testament is very funny.🙂
 
tobinatorstark said:
Psalm 23 is also Psalm 22 in the Douay-Rheims so in modern Bibles you could say it is more, but in the case of the Douay-Rheims, it would be the same amount of plaques on the walls. Watch how you address the Psalms in their numbers
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Which one is missing in Douay-Rheims? Or is one combined with another?
 
CHRISTINE77 said:
Which one is missing in Douay-Rheims? Or is one combined with another?
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Psalm 9 and 10 are combined in the Douay and is divided in the NAB They do join back together later on. I am looking for the thread that gave me what the psalms joined it back together. The end result is the same. 150 Psalms
 
might I add that the Douay-Rheims follows that which is in the Latin Vulgate. One is the Greek and the other is the Hebrew
 
tobinatorstark said:
Psalm 9 and 10 are combined in the Douay and is divided in the NAB They do join back together later on. I am looking for the thread that gave me what the psalms joined it back together. The end result is the same. 150 Psalms
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The RSV-CE contains both sets of numbering - this would give you the info I think you are seeking.
 
CHRISTINE77 said:
Actually, I think there is humor in it. A lot of the Old Testament is very funny.🙂
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Yes, the OT can be quite humorous. I think of Aaron telling Moses that he through all this gold jewelry into the fire, and out came the calf. That cracks me up. Or adding saying, “It the woman that you gave me that caused me to eat the apple”. But Job? its just some old guys arguing.

Note: I know its much more than that, but I don’t get it.
 
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