The Problem of God's Omniscience

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If God is omniscient, as in, if He knows everything that can be known, isn’t he incapable of creative thought?

If he is incapable, how does this affect our understanding of God’s nature? If he’s not incapable, how is he not?
 
Hi Marc,

It depends on how you’re using, “creative.” God is omniscient and wills things to exist, so in that obvious sense He is creative. However, if by, “creative,” you mean coming up with something that had not yet been thought of, then God is not creative in that latter sense. This isn’t an imperfection, though, since creativity is only a relative perfection for those who (like us) do not know everything.

We sometimes run into the same type of question whenever it’s stated, “God has no potentiality.” Does this imply that God is impotent? No, because God simply has every power there is, and there is no need for Him to grow in power. Potentiality, like creativity, are good for finite entities to have, but they wouldn’t be marks of the divine perfection.
 
If God is omniscient, as in, if He knows everything that can be known, isn’t he incapable of creative thought?

If he is incapable, how does this affect our understanding of God’s nature? If he’s not incapable, how is he not?
traditionally, God’s knowledge is creative. For God’s knowledge of something is what makes it what it is. For God to “discover” something, as the previous poster mentioned, would involve imperfection insofar as it would make God less than fully actual (again, traditionally, God is fully Act and there is no potency in God).

Or to put it slightly differently, because God is One, Knowing and Doing are one and the same thing in God and in fact are God. There is no distinction between God and God’s attributes or between the various attributes themselves (which in turn are identical with God).
 
It would be wrong to say God is incapable of creativity; that would be mistakenly be attributing creation to a process of the intellect.

As God has an infinite intellect; he cannot create something per se in terms of it as an idea or soforth; however in terms of praxis and creation God can manifest thing’s to be; and thus be creative.

He is also able to direct his will towards objects of the intellect thus manifesting them in creation; this can be equated to or understood as creative thought; not so much that he is thinking something new; but that he is thinking to put that thing into existence.

However; such speculation necessarily for means of understanding analagorically interprets God’s attributes singly against the presmises of Divine Simplicity.

Knowing God’s Divine Simplicity; we can see that as his will is identical to his thought; and that his praxis is identical to his will; and that his praxis is creative; he is per se creative; thus it is not wrong to say that his intellect is creative - because his intellect cannot be distinguished practically from him (only analagorically).
 
If God is omniscient, as in, if He knows everything that can be known, isn’t he incapable of creative thought?

If he is incapable, how does this affect our understanding of God’s nature? If he’s not incapable, how is he not?/QUOTE

you are talking about the unimaginably eternal potentiality of what God has created that we are oblivious to.

Or…

What He is still creating that we would never imagine if we were to live for eons of eons.

Or…

How long did God - in eternity - take to decide to create heaven, the angels, the universe, humans, planets etc etc. Did He always know that this would be the creation that He would create.??? Of course!!!
 
God is so creative! Just look at everything! Look at all the creatures he made, look at the beauty of the skies, the colors of a rainbow. The fact that humans have so much creativity shows the creativity of God. Someone was given the capability by God to paint a painting. And that Painting is evidence not only of the person’s creativity but of God who gave the person that creativity. But the most beautiful things are that which is unseen.
 
Hi Marc,

It depends on how you’re using, “creative.” God is omniscient and wills things to exist, so in that obvious sense He is creative. However, if by, “creative,” you mean coming up with something that had not yet been thought of, then God is not creative in that latter sense. This isn’t an imperfection, though, since creativity is only a relative perfection for those who (like us) do not know everything.

We sometimes run into the same type of question whenever it’s stated, “God has no potentiality.” Does this imply that God is impotent? No, because God simply has every power there is, and there is no need for Him to grow in power. Potentiality, like creativity, are good for finite entities to have, but they wouldn’t be marks of the divine perfection.
Excellent post.
 
However, if by “creative” you mean coming up with something that had not yet been thought of, then God is not creative in that latter sense. This isn’t an imperfection, though, since creativity is only a relative perfection for those who (like us) do not know everything.
Seconded 👍
 
If God is omniscient, as in, if He knows everything that can be known, isn’t he incapable of creative thought?

If he is incapable, how does this affect our understanding of God’s nature? If he’s not incapable, how is he not?
Whether you realized this problem yourself or picked it up from one of my long since closed threads (e.g: Can God Think) on the issue is no matter. Your question poses a valid contradiction.

The definition of create, for this purpose, is to make something which has never been made, or to think of something which has never been previously thought of. In this sense, some humans are occasionally creative.

I regard local creativity in the same sense as global creativity. That is, if you come up which an idea which you did not previously know, it is creative, even if someone else already thought of it. Obviously the issue of local vs. global creativity does not apply to God.

If God is genuinely omniscient, He is incapable of creative thought of any sort.

One poster has wisely accepted this simple logic, but dealt with it by belittling the concept that the human ability to create is unimportant to God. Given that the only characteristic which separates man from chimpanzees is creativity, I take his belittlement as a very serious attenuation of God, Who, in the poster’s context, is closer in abilities to a chimpanzee than to man.

In case it is not obvious, I reject that argument. I regard God as many orders of magnitude superior to man, in all respects.

Moreover, an argument commonly used in attempts to convert atheists comes from the remarkable evidence from creation, the beauty of flowers, the complexity of various critters, etc. Those arguments have always worked for me. Well, how can we even be talking about “creation” if God cannot create?

Why call God our Creator if God cannot create? That is absurd!

Given the validity of the contradiction, God either creates or is not omniscient. As I’ve noted previously, I opt for non-omniscience.

This solves lots of problems, and answers old biblical questions like, “Why did God create man in the first place if He knew how awful man would turn out?” The new answer is, He did not know how man would turn out.

Non-omniscience provides a wonderfully logical explanation for the facts of evolution which is far superior to Darwinism. Six-day creationism was invented in the context of an omniscient God— since God knew how to create every aspect of the universe and biological life before He began, naturally He would have done it quickly. A day or two for plants and critters should have been plenty.

However, if God is not omniscient, He probably did not know the first thing about how to create biological life when He undertook the project, and had to figure it out. The process of engineering millions of beasties with different characteristics and different jobs to do, then getting them to function in ecological balance with one another, seems a sufficiently daunting challenge to have taken a non-omnipotent God a few hundred million years.

On the other hand, the proposition that an omniscient God would have taken that much time is impossible to justify competently, and is the kind of absurdity that drives logical people to atheism.

It can also be helpful to consider this issue in the context of the old slogan, “God created man in His own image?” Man is material, God is allegedly a spirit. God is brilliant, and by comparison, the combined intelligences of all humans produce an I.Q. infinitely smaller than God’s. God can create an entire universe with acts of His will, whereas man cannot create anything without bodies and tools. What aspect of man is in any way comparable to an aspect of God, other than creativity?
 
The definition of create, for this purpose, is to think of something which has never been previously thought of. In this sense, some humans are occasionally creative.

I regard local creativity in the same sense as global creativity. That is, if you come up which an idea which you did not previously know, it is creative, even if someone else already thought of it. Obviously the issue of local vs. global creativity does not apply to God.

If God is genuinely omniscient, He is incapable of creative thought of any sort.

One poster has wisely accepted this simple logic, but dealt with it by belittling the concept that the human ability to create is unimportant to God. Given that the only characteristic which separates man from chimpanzees is creativity, I take his belittlement as a very serious attenuation of God, Who, in the poster’s context, is closer in abilities to a chimpanzee than to man.

In case it is not obvious, I reject that argument. I regard God as many orders of magnitude superior to man, in all respects.
I have editted your post. You were conflating two issues: creative thought and creative action. Since the OP only referred to creative thought vs God’s omniscience, I have deleted all your references to creative action. So, I respond:

My dad made a humourous little quip a short while ago, “Why is it that when bread goes stale it gets hard, but when crackers go stale they get soft?” The clear answer is that “stale” is a single word that describes two different processes.

In the same way, “uncreative” is a single word that can either describe a monkey, who is uncreative because he knows nothing, or it can describe God, who is uncreative because he knows everything.

I requote:
It depends on how you’re using, “creative.” God is omniscient and wills things to exist, so in that obvious sense He is creative. However, if by, “creative,” you mean coming up with something that had not yet been thought of, then God is not creative in that latter sense. This isn’t an imperfection, though, since creativity is only a relative perfection for those who (like us) do not know everything.

We sometimes run into the same type of question whenever it’s stated, “God has no potentiality.” Does this imply that God is impotent? No, because God simply has every power there is, and there is no need for Him to grow in power. Potentiality, like creativity, are good for finite entities to have, but they wouldn’t be marks of the divine perfection.
 
I have editted your post. You were conflating two issues: creative thought and creative action. Since the OP only referred to creative thought vs God’s omniscience, I have deleted all your references to creative action. So, I respond:

My dad made a humourous little quip a short while ago, “Why is it that when bread goes stale it gets hard, but when crackers go stale they get soft?” The clear answer is that “stale” is a single word that describes two different processes.

In the same way, “uncreative” is a single word that can either describe a monkey, who is uncreative because he knows nothing, or it can describe God, who is uncreative because he knows everything.

I requote:
Do not requote me again. Enjoy your crackers.
 
If God is omniscient, as in, if He knows everything that can be known, isn’t he incapable of creative thought?

If he is incapable, how does this affect our understanding of God’s nature? If he’s not incapable, how is he not?
my own idea of God says that Divinity is the essence of the nature of the universe. That is, what makes You up, at its innermost nature, is Divine. If you can be creative, then Divinity can be creative.

This is how god can be Omniscient (as he makes up everything) and creative.
 
If God is omniscient, as in, if He knows everything that can be known, isn’t he incapable of creative thought?

If he is incapable, how does this affect our understanding of God’s nature? If he’s not incapable, how is he not?
Wouldn’t He ALREADY know that creative thought?
 
So how is it creative?
A creative thought does not mean a “new” thought, though. If this is the case, yours is really a “time” issue, then. I think this is all thoroughly answered by divine simplicity, but I am not too well-versed on this subject.
 
A creative thought does not mean a “new” thought, though. If this is the case, yours is really a “time” issue, then. I think this is all thoroughly answered by divine simplicity, but I am not too well-versed on this subject.
To create something, it must not exist, and then exist because of something you actively did to create it.

If God already knows a creative thought, it follows that it always existed, and thus that he didn’t create it.
 
To create something, it must not exist, and then exist because of something you actively did to create it.

If God already knows a creative thought, it follows that it always existed, and thus that he didn’t create it.
I thought we were talking about creative knowledge, not creative action.
 
We are. Thus, if God already knows a creative THOUGHT, then he didn’t create it.
I guess the problem here stems from the notion of eternity and simplicity. I once read a very good article on it, maybe I can find it.
 
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