The problem of redemptive suffering

[bennyboy92]

Hello

I am a lapsed catholic who basically lost faith now due to what I feel is an irrefutable flaw in the teaching of suffering. these are:

1. The element of coercion - obviously, coercion and love cannot exist together. Let’s say that somebody is born with an extremely painful disability like Adam Maier Clayton (and advocate of euthanasia in Canada.) They did not choose to have a horrendous disease that causes them to suffer for the rest of their lives. Obviously I am not advocating suicide as most of the time mental problems can be treated with therapy/antidepressants but in some cases people suffer from devastating conditions like Adam where there is no hope of getting better, modern science simply isn’t there yet. In these cases I believe it would be cruel to deprive people of their choice to die.

Now let’s say that a devout Christian has a similar condition yet the only thing keeping him alive is the fear of hell/purgatory if he decides to commit suicide/choose euthanasia. Obviously, the problem here is that the threat of punishment act as an act of coercion. The person was not chosen to be born, and did not choose to have this disease but is essentially forced to endure it against their will, without having a choice whether they want to carry on or not. This is in my opinion a complete deprivation of freedom and liberty and is essentially slavery.

The second argument: Suffering.

The argument against euthanasia is that people are sometimes supposed to suffer and take up their crosses to share in Jesus’s suffering/reduce their time in purgatory/help others in purgatory or earth with their suffering. So euthanasia/suicide is like running away from suffering.

Now here’s the problem that seems to be a very confusing, contradictionary approach to suffering:

There seems to be a widespread view among the saints, and certain passages in the bible that suffering is good.

(Consider it joy when you face trials (James 1:2)

“If angels were capable of envy, they would envy us for two things: The gift of Communion and for suffering” - Faustina

“There is something beautiful about the poor accepting their lot and suffering it like Christs passion”-St Theresa

if suffering is so beneficial, if we get enormous rewards in heaven for enduring it then what is the point of preventing it at all? What is the point of providing critical support for people with serious difficulties that can prevent severe suffering and suicidal thoguhts? Wouldn’t it just lengthen their time in purgatory if they lived a life of ease and comfort after getting the help they need to get rid of their paid (yes, one of my old religious education books said that by suffering we can reduce time in purgatory).

Obviously i guess very few christians would think we should not help sufferers relieve their pain. It is universally accepted that helping others in relieving their suffering is good and even in the bible So if the suffering are supposed to be helped, then why is there a teaching that suffering must be embraced?

.

 

[CatholicSpirit]

What I suggest you do, is take a look at one of our basic tenets, that Vatican.va has Vatican II writings available to you for reflection and speaking to a priest about what your interpretation is.

Look around 2282 here:

http://www.vatican.va/archive/ccc_css/archive/catechism/p3s2c2a5.htm

And yes, what the saints say also carries weight, good job researching their words. Now mix the two… and speak to a priest about your findings!

 

[0Scarlett_nidiyilii]

We live in a broken, fallen world.
We don’t get to pick our crosses.
And yes, it hurts.

At the same time, we have a God who did not merely sit up there in Heaven watching us suffer.
Jesus was born like us and suffered along with us.

And we can apply our sufferings like a prayer for others.

I’m not saying this makes it all feel better. Suffering does not feel good.
It’s great that you’re asking the questions and trying to work it all out.

I’ll remwmber you in my prayer today for your uplifting and for your suffering loved ones.
ray:t2:

 

[Limoncello4021]

One of the reasons I believe so strongly in the Catholic Church is its theology of redemptive suffering. We all suffer, morally, physically, mentally, emotionally. Some people seem to receive more suffering than others. Thank God we have the ability to make something worthwhile and positive of our suffering! Jesus showed us the way; no one has suffered as much as He did. Without redemptive suffering, suffering is often just hopeless pain.

 

[Start]

Killing people isn’t an acceptable way to help people out of their suffering.

 

[otrrl]

I’ve seen people in tremendous pain. The worst physical pain I had was a kidney stone – twice so far. Had pancreatitis three times, too, very painful.

It is beyond common experience to encounter someone with this genetically based disease and pain. Although the church does not approve of euthanasia, we are not to judge the actions of others. Paragraph 1735 of the CCC discusses the conditions which lessen or eliminate culpability for what is objectively a grave action. This is a statement that looks like legalism, but it is about the mercy of God.

Also, it would be unethical to withhold pain medication from a person who needs it. Burn victims are put into induced comas while they heal.

 

[TheLittleLady]

The argument against euthanasia is that people are sometimes supposed to suffer and take up their crosses to share in Jesus’s suffering/reduce their time in purgatory/help others in purgatory or earth with their suffering. So euthanasia/suicide is like running away from suffering.

This is not the reason that euthanasia is sin.

Every life belongs to God. HE determines when we die. We are not permitted to play God. “Thou shalt not kill” applies to killing ourselves or killing someone who is suffering.