The problem with Fatima

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JoshuaIsLord said:
The Popes defiled the wishes of the Blessed Mother by not releasing it in it’s entirety in 1960.
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The whole thing is a private revelation, so perhaps the Popes you mention just don’t believe in Fatima… which would be just fine.
 
Fatima is considered to be the most important apparition from heaven in the 2000 year history of the Catholic Church .
 
Carmel said:
Fatima is considered to be the most important apparition from heaven in the 2000 year history of the Catholic Church .
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I find this a little dubious given that Lourdes is actually the apparition that you see represented at every single Marian shrine and at many churches as well.

Fatima is important, yes, but every time Mary graces us with her presence, it’s important, and she has done this many times even if you just go by “Vatican approved” apparitions.
 
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It worries me that Amelia was sentenced to purgatory for such a long time -this was back when there was no TV, porn, celebrity culture, abortion etc if she was friends with Lucia’s family, she was probably devout
 
There is a contradiction between what the Blessed Mother told the visionaries and what Lucia wrote in her fourth memoir concerning Amilia. She wrote that Amelia would remain in purgatory until the end of the world, but in their testimony after the apparitions ended, the Blessed Mother never told the three children how long Amilia would be there.

Jim
 
simonjosiah1 said:
It worries me that Amelia was sentenced to purgatory for such a long time -this was back when there was no TV, porn, celebrity culture, abortion etc
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You need to correct this line of thinking that you have expressed both here and on the other thread, that if there is “no TV, porn, celebrity culture” there is somehow less sin. And do you honestly think women didn’t abort babies before the Roe v. Wade era? There were all sorts of folk remedy abortifacients and physical things to do to try to get rid of your baby. Women who didn’t want the baby they were carrying, or who had gotten pregnant out of wedlock etc. would go looking for this type of “assistance”.

Human nature was no different back then than it was today. People masturbated, fornicated, committed adultery, committed lust in their hearts, had bestial sex with animals, looked at porn when they could get it (yes, porn existed back then as someone else has already told you), went dancing, drank alcohol, wore suggestive clothing (that may look conservative to us now but was suggestive for the time and place), blasphemed God, did not practice their faith, did not believe in God, were mean to their family members and neighbors, spread gossip, stole money and goods, cheated each other in business, took advantage of others, were greedy and selfish, ignored the needs of the poor…JUST LIKE THEY DO NOW.

You do not need a TV or a magazine full of Kardashian pictures to bring on this behavior. It is how people act naturally if they do not strive to love God and their neighbor more.

In the case of the girl who went to Purgatory, she had supposedly had some illicit involvement with a man. Which is not far-fetched as people, including girls, including girls who went to church, had sex drives back in those days too.
 
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Our Lady told the children in 1917 that the current World War 1 would soon come to an end, but that if men (people) did not improve that another and more terrible war would soon begin. There would be lights in the sky (Aurora Borealis ) shortly before to herald that war. These Northern Lights were seen all over Europe just before outbreak of WW2.
The surviving visionary Sr. Lucia, received further visits from Our Lady . She gave Sr. Lucia a message for the Pope which was to be made public to the whole world by 1960 at the latest.
Mary also requested the consecration of Russia to Her Immaculate Heart. This Consecration was to be effected by the Pope acting in unison with all the bishops. She told Sister Lucia that if her requests were not heeded that Russia would spread her errors throughout the world. This has happened.
Pope St. John Paul 2 credited Our Lady with saving his life when Ali Agka attempted to assassinate him at close range. He, (Pope John Paul ) made a pilgrimage to Fatima on the anniversary the following year, to thank Mary for saving his life.
People need to realise that Mary didn’t just decide to come down to earth with this message for the Church . She was sent by God.
When questioned about the non-release of the Fatima Secret at a press conference in Fulda in 1980 Pope John Paul 2 replied " It should be sufficient for all Christians to know this - If there is a message in which it is written that the oceans will flood whole areas of the earth, and that from one moment to the next, millions of people will perish, truly the publication of such a message is no longer something to be so much desired "
He also referred to another aspect of the unpublished Third Secret " Given the seriousness of the contents, my predecessor in the Petrine Office preferred to postpone publication so as not to encourage the world powers of Communism to make certain moves "
 
Carmel said:
The surviving visionary Sr. Lucia, received further visits from Our Lady . She gave Sr. Lucia a message for the Pope which was to be made public to the whole world by 1960 at the latest.
Mary also requested the consecration of Russia to Her Immaculate Heart. This Consecration was to be effected by the Pope acting in unison with all the bishops. She told Sister Lucia that if her requests were not heeded that Russia would spread her errors throughout the world. This has happened.
Pope St. John Paul 2 credited Our Lady with saving his life when Ali Agka attempted to assassinate him at close range. He, (Pope John Paul ) made a pilgrimage to Fatima on the anniversary the following year, to thank Mary for saving his life.
People need to realise that Mary didn’t just decide to come down to earth with this message for the Church . She was sent by God.
When questioned about the non-release of the Fatima Secret at a press conference in Fulda in 1980 Pope John Paul 2 replied " It should be sufficient for all Christians to know this - If there is a message in which it is written that the oceans will flood whole areas of the earth, and that from one moment to the next, millions of people will perish, truly the publication of such a message is no longer something to be so much desired "
He also referred to another aspect of the unpublished Third Secret " Given the seriousness of the contents, my predecessor in the Petrine Office preferred to postpone publication so as not to encourage the world powers of Communism to make certain moves "
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The Church approved the Fatima revelations reviewed prior to 1930. Subsequent revelations, much of which were revealed in the 1940s or later, are not part of the approved private revelation, nor are letters, diaries and secrets revealed later.
Russia was consecrated. That was completed.
Quotations from St. JP II should be given with a source.
 
russia was never consecrated, she said if it had there would be peace
 
How about Our Lady of Guadalupe? Her apparition
resulted in 6 MILLION aztecs converted to Catholic
-ism within six years!! Her Name was probably a
Spanish mis-spelling of the aztec word “Coatlallope”
which means “One who treads on snakes”.
 
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According to Sister Lucia herself, the Consecration was fulfilled.
 
if it was done, it was done late, russia had already spread her errors
 
if it was done, it was done late, russia had already spread her errors
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It was done by St. John Paul II in 1984, just before
Russia crumbled, first when the Berlin Wall came
down followed by the revolt in Poland and a myster-
ious explosion which crippled the Soviet Navy!
 
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I’m sure that information may be useful to someone on this thread, but I already knew about Fatima.
And while I think it is an important apparition, like I said, every time Our Lady appears it is important.
She is “sent by God” every time.
I do not see Fatima as being particularly more important than Lourdes, or Kibeho, or Beauraing.
 
The Church itself says it was compete. If you trust the Magisterium to approve Fatima at all or for that matter the gospel of Luke you can trust that it is completed.
 
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Tis_Bearself said:
And while I think it is an important apparition, like I said, every time Our Lady appears it is important.
She is “sent by God” every time.
I do not see Fatima as being particularly more important than Lourdes, or Kibeho, or Beauraing.
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Of course her “appearances” in Israel being by far the most important. It is the only Marian actions and words in Public Revelation.
 
Yes, but those were not apparitions - that was the human Mary existing in her life on earth. Catholics are required to believe in Mary’s life on earth and her birth of Jesus, etc.

So I would not include them in a list with apparitions, which Catholics are free to not believe. Don’t want to muddy the waters for people not familiar with Mariology.
 
Ok but many don’t realize the public Revelation and the Magisterium to be more important than private ones.
 
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