The purpose of the Last Supper was to socialize?

[jmcrae]

In another thread, Dorothy said this:

I respectfully disagree. Jesus purposely wanted His last supper (the Mass) to be a social event. Jesus gathered His disciples together (forming a social bond – a discipleship). He could have chosen to meet His disciples individually but He didn’t. He must have wanted it to be a social gathering where each individual felt part of a group, a sense of belonging, a feeling of inclusion. What better way to achieve this than the breaking of bread and drinking of wine (a last supper/ meal/ party). This mergence of love and fellowship mirrored an integral part of His metaphorical message of sacrifice.

This is such a total misunderstanding of what was going on at the Last Supper that it’s difficult to know where to begin.

First, Jesus was already with the Disciples - they could have gone out for dinner anywhere. Jesus had specific reasons for choosing the Upper Room, and for selecting only the 12 to go there with Him.

Second, it wasn’t just any meal; it was the Passover Supper. You can read about what they were probably doing up there in Exodus 12 - read the entire chapter; it’s very interesting.

Third, it wasn’t random. Jesus knew that He had only hours to live, and that He needed to establish the Sacraments of the Church as quickly as possible.

Several things occurred at the Last Supper, but most importantly for us, Jesus instituted the Mass and established the Christian priesthood.

It wasn’t about socializing or about feeling good - it was about following God’s directive to sacrifice the lamb in remembrance of the deliverance from Egypt, and Jesus causing the disciples to know (though not yet understand, since the events hadn’t happened yet) that He was the ultimate Lamb of Sacrifice, and that they were to eat and drink of His body and blood, soul and divinity, as though it were the meat of the Lamb of the Passover Sacrifice.

While there is certainly a communal element to the Mass, as to all aspects of the Church, I don’t think that Jesus’ primary purpose in gathering the Disciples together on His last day of life was purely social entertainment.

 

[brotherhrolf]

I’m having a little bit of trouble picking my jaw off the floor. Socialize? On Passover - a high holy day for Our Lord and His disciples? Anyone reading the Holy Week narratives in the Gospels would immediately note the extensive religious preparations necessary. I wonder if she has ever experienced a Seder Supper for non-Jews. I have. Anyone experiencing a Seder will immediately recognize Our Lord’s intentions and I don’t think socializing was among them.

It is quite clear what Jesus’ intentions were and socializing is so far off the radar screen, it’s not even remotely funny. I don’t know what to say. How can anyone read the synoptic Gospels much less John’s account and come up with socializing? :bigyikes:

 

[Tantum_ergo]

Well, I think that quite a few people have been emphasizing the “social meal” aspect of the Mass for the last 30 odd years or so. Only lately–God be thanked–have we begun to reclaim the sacred, the mystical, the sacrificial and the eternal from the ‘spirit of Vatican 2 kumbaya share the meal fellowship groupie’ crowd. (P.S. This does not mean that anyone who believes that the Mass is, in part anyway, a real meal is wrong or that fellowship is wrong etc. It does mean that claiming that the purpose of the Last Supper, or the Mass is purely or primarily for ‘socialization’ is putting the emPHAsis on the wrong sylLABle. . . and thus throwing Christian teaching out of whack.)

 

[dorothy_smith]

It wasn’t about socializing or about feeling good -

Heavens above! - you will probably want to edit out the word ‘socializing’.

I said that socialising is an integral part of the Mass not the sole purpose for it. I believe that Jesus intended it that way.

 

[porthos11]

Heavens above! - you will probably want to edit out the word ‘socializing’.

I said that socialising is an integral part of the Mass not the sole purpose for it. I believe that Jesus intended it that way.

Right. With words like “One of you will betray me” and “I have to leave you” and “My soul is sorrowful unto death” (ok, that came after, but during the same night).

 

[dorothy_smith]

Right. With words like “One of you will betray me” and “I have to leave you” and “My soul is sorrowful unto death” (ok, that came after, but during the same night).

Take it easy my friend. Let us other each other the sign of peace. Peace be with you.

 

[dorothy_smith]

Dear Jmcrae

I’d appreciate it if you would change the title of the thread “The purpose of the Last Supper was to socialize?” It is misleading and makes me feel uncomfortable. Thanks

 

[Hesychios]

I’d appreciate it if you would change the title of the thread “The purpose of the Last Supper was to socialize?” It is misleading and makes me feel uncomfortable. Thanks

I agree with you. It is a complete distortion of the sense of your posted ideas.

It seems to me a lot of people have forgotten that we are supposed to be COMMUNITY. Perhaps worshipping in parishes with 5000 families has that effect on some people.

*Michael
*

 

[brotherhrolf]

I agree with you. It is a complete distortion of the sense of your posted ideas.

It seems to me a lot of people have forgotten that we are supposed to be COMMUNITY. Perhaps worshipping in parishes with 5000 families has that effect on some people.

Michael

Just an idle thought, Michael. One wonders how Father Ambrose would feel about this. I somehow can’t think of Father Ambrose believing that the Eucharist was solely born out of sense of community. This is contrary to scripture. Think carefully about this my friend.

Michael, run this post by Father Ambrose. * Do you honestly think he’s going to agree with you? I simply can’t imagine.*

I would be MOST interested to hear Fr. Ambrose’s comments about the first Eucharist being a “social” event. Oh, and lest it be forgotten, when I joined my cathedral choir and cathedral parish back in 83, we had less than 150 families and have only about 1200 now. And we think we’re doing splendidly.

 

[Lil_M]

I have to agree with Jmcrae. The Last Supper was a solemn occasion about instituting the Eucharist, not a get-together. As such, I have never approached the Mass as a social function. I am glad to see friends and family there but they are not the reason why we gather.

 

[jay29]

Jesus was simply INSTRUCTING His apostles how to celebrate His death and Resurection until He comes again. It wasn’t a kumby ya event.

 

[Caesar]

Read the sections on the Last Supper from The Dolorous Passion of Our Lord Jesus Christ by Blessed Anne Katherine Emmerich, a stigmatic who recieved visions of the last hours of Our Lord before His death. Read this and then come and say the Last Supper was a mere social event.

 

[rwoehmke]

Ya mean he didn’t say, “Come on guys, take off your sandals, kick back and enjoy a few brewskis and pretzels. I got a big job comin up. Then you’re gonna have to pick up the slack. ?” Amazing! Yes, I am always amazed how one sided we can get about the significance of the Mass. A social event? I think not! A communal event and a true sacrifice? Yes! The Last Supper an event where Jesus instituted the priesthood? I think by that time their calling and formation was already well along. Institution of the Eucharist, yes. The Finale? I vote for Pentecost.

 

[Hesychios]

Glory to Jesus Christ!

Hello brother,

Just an idle thought, Michael. One wonders how Father Ambrose would feel about this. I somehow can’t think of Father Ambrose believing that the Eucharist was solely born out of sense of community. This is contrary to scripture. Think carefully about this my friend.

No one has said solely, that is a misreading of the point.

Nevertheless, they (at the Last Supper) were a community, this was no gathering of strangers.

If you are interested in Father Ambroses viewpoint, why don’t you PM him? Shall we drag Father Serpa in for his viewpoint?

Michael, run this post by Father Ambrose. * Do you honestly think he’s going to agree with you? I simply can’t imagine.*

I would be MOST interested to hear Fr. Ambrose’s comments about the first Eucharist being a “social” event.

Again, ask him, not me. We are saved in community, we do not separate the Sacrifice from the community. This is why we have never had the phenomena of private Masses or Chantry priests in the East, without the community the liturgy is not happening.

We don’t have special ‘Masses’ for children or other groups selected out of the natural gathering. We do not split the congregation up with more than one liturgy on a Sunday (where it happens it is a temporary exception). We strongly emphasize the gathering of the community outside of the Divine Liturgy. All this specifically to build and maintain a sense of community, socialization is important.

Have you ever exchanged a ‘kiss of peace’ with a fellow Roman Catholic? In my parish it happens all the time, and not just at one point in the liturgy but as soon as we see each other.

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Oh, and lest it be forgotten, when I joined my cathedral choir and cathedral parish back in 83, we had less than 150 families and have only about 1200 now. And we think we’re doing splendidly.

Congratulations, just remember it is not merely a numbers game, these are souls you care for. They need to be (and feel) plugged in or you will find some of them dropping away unnoticed. It’s a problem we all must wrangle with but it is particularly difficult in the larger parishes.
*
Michael*

 

[Hesychios]

Read the sections on the Last Supper from The Dolorous Passion of Our Lord Jesus Christ by Blessed Anne Katherine Emmerich, a stigmatic who recieved visions of the last hours of Our Lord before His death. Read this and then come and say the Last Supper was a mere social event.

A few points to bring up here:

• The Dolorous Passion is a work of fiction.
• No one (as far as I know) has stated that the Last Supper was MERELY a social gathering.
• They were all intimate associates, friends and fellow travelors.
  The words MERELY and SOLELY are inventions of the respondents here.

 

[Al_Masetti]

Is this thread because someone decided that in all the photographs that were taken at the Last Supper, all the dinner guests are posed all along ONE SIDE OF THE TABLE?

 

[Catholic90]

Is this thread because someone decided that in all the photographs that were taken at the Last Supper, all the dinner guests are posed all along ONE SIDE OF THE TABLE?

Funny…no one has ever found that camera!

 

[puzzleannie]

of course it was, that’s why Jesus ran it like your average Youth Group rally, beginning with an ice-breaker, the washing of the apostles’ feet.

never underestimate the human capacity to read scripture and find exactly what they are looking for, even without twisting the words to suit their own agenda.

 

[dorothy_smith]

I agree with you. It is a complete distortion of the sense of your posted ideas.

*Michael
*

Michael, thank you for your help.

The replies to this thread has been very distressful for me. People are being deliberately obtuse to what I have said. I feel like I am being group bullied:

It wasn’t about socializing or about feeling good -

It is quite clear what Jesus’ intentions were and socializing is so far off the radar screen, it’s not even remotely funny.

or the Mass is purely or primarily for ‘socialization’ is putting the emPHAsis on the wrong sylLABle. . . and thus throwing Christian teaching out of whack.)

I have to agree with Jmcrae. The Last Supper was a solemn occasion about instituting the Eucharist, not a get-together.

Ya mean he didn’t say, "Come on guys, take off your sandals, kick back and enjoy a few brewskis and pretzels. I got a big job comin up.

The quotes above are intentionally misrepresenting what i have said about the Mass and the spirit of community.

 

[Tantum_ergo]

The quotes above are intentionally misrepresenting what i have said about the Mass and the spirit of community.

Hang on there, Dorothy.

**Intentionally **misrepresenting? Group bullying?

I respectfully disagree here. No one denies (and all of us on your ‘quote hit list’ above have said either on this thread or the original) that ‘community’ can exist in conjunction with the Mass.

But–a Mass is a ‘valid’ Mass when it is spoken by one priest alone–with nobody else. If community was a primary or major focus **of ** Mass, why would this be so?

If Jesus meant the Mass to be used as a method of socialization, why not have one of the requirements be that it must **always ** be celebrated in community?

Not that I am denigrating ‘community’ or saying that it isn’t important that we celebrate Mass as a community. But socialization isn’t the primary purpose.

Nobody is ‘ganging up on you’–we’re merely trying (in dialogue to be sure) to understand exactly what you are saying, and to express, according to our understanding of church teachings (in review of church documents etc.) any ‘disconnect’ that we perceive. Obviously we could be ‘wrong’ in our perception of what you’re saying but ‘right’ in our exposition of what the Church teaches. IOW, you could be thinking and believing exactly what we’re saying the Church teaches but expressing it in a way that either you, or we, or both, have difficulty interpreting. And if that is the case, then surely we will be able to come to a clear understanding and agreement–right?

So–let’s review then. What exactly do you say about Mass and community?