The Quality of the Celebration of the Mass has Slowly Improved at my Parish

[JMMJ]

I agree. Different Strokes for different folks. It is the name of the game.

 

[angel12]

Were you not alluding to criticism of priests for certain liturgical practices?

I was, quite obviously, referring to constant and frequently unwarranted criticism, with little regard to whether those practices are allowed by the GIRM.
Sorry if that’s too fine a distinction. Many here clearly understood what I was saying.

 

[JulianN]

or 20 years, instead of seeking out one without the listed abuses?

Most of what was listed was an option – not an abuse. But I concur about finding another parish. Two of the parishes nearest me have switched to all organ music, a lot of Latin, Mass ad orientem. I’ve had to start driving about 30 minutes to a parish where I feel genuinely and prayerfully engaged in the celebration of the Mass.

 

[0331]

Sounds a bit pedantic: I’m talking about priests getting criticized, and you’re also talking about priests getting criticized, but there’s a distinction somewhere that lots of people get, but I shouldn’t psychoanalyze your post in order to find the distinction…

 

[MagdalenaRita]

These are all good and positive changes. Restoring the sacredness of the Mass and sanctuary are always good things.
Sadly our sanctuary gets used as a passageway to parts of the Church also. I’m not sure how we could change it.

 

[Ostiarius]

Sadly our sanctuary gets used as a passageway to parts of the Church also.

The pastor has to set a policy and then enforce it. There is a parish here locally where the pastor simply locked the door from the sacristy to the sanctuary. The set-up was done using a cart. The sacristans didn’t mind. It saved them trips. They would set up the cart, push it outside and then back in the church and then into the sanctuary.

The pastor also stopped the sacristy from acting as a lounge, which also helped a great deal.

 

[Ostiarius]

It’s sad to see some being so defensive here. This was meant to be a positive thread.

That said I wonder how many people have stopped attending Mass on Sundays or left the Church altogether because the Mass was celebrated with such little care, such little effort in their former parishes?

This isn’t always about mere Mass preferences. It runs much deeper and wider than that. Acknowledging that fact is important if a parish, and indeed the Church wishes to improve, and be the means in which souls partake of God’s grace and ultimately get to Heaven.

 

[MagdalenaRita]

I completely agree with you.

Though my thought when reading the OP never went to blaming a priest. Many of the things listed above could very well be due to parishioners. Some priests hands are tied and as we have seen lately, they are let go if they try to make any positive changes.
I think we should look at the OP positively and maybe they are praising their priest for doing a good job and restoring sacredness to their parish.
They are talking about a 20 year span.

 

[CilladeRoma]

It’s sad to see some being so defensive here. This was meant to be a positive thread.

You say that, yet more than once you have called your priests motives and intentions into question.
That is why people are upset.

 

[OraLabora]

All axiomatic… It takes a real toll however when a pastor clearly does his best to “optimize” the Mass in terms of keeping it as short as possible. Disheartening actually. Terrible.

You arre clearing inferring that the priest had negative reasons for choosing the perfectly licit options that he did. In short, you are casting aspersions on him.

That’s clericalism: that a layman shouldn’t question the motives and intentions of priests, just because they are priests.

No, it is simply good Christian charity to assume someone is doing something legitimate for the right reasons.

To go around saying that a priest is choosing X or Y option because he wants to shorten the Mass, is simply calumny.

That may not be his reason for choosing X or Y option. Or maybe he does want to shorten the Mass because he needs to shorten the Mass, for example he has to celebrate another Mass across town and has to drive or take the bus to it. Or he has a health problem that makes it tough for him to stand for long periods of time.

I was taught, as a Christian, that you always assumed someone was doing something for the right motives, at least if it was something licit, but that one doesn’t like. We’re not talking about the motives of a drug dealer here, but of a priest exercising option in the Roman Missal that the rubrics say are his to choose!

 

[DeniseNY]

To go around saying that a priest is choosing X or Y option because he wants to shorten the Mass, is simply calumny.

And that people are being driven from the church because of it.

 

[tafan2]

Here in the US, I find the situation very regional. Within the course of a given year, I will probably attend Mass at 15 or 20 parishes in our diocese. All of them are well done. BTW For Sunday’s, The Confiteor is almost universal. Quality of music selection does vary a lot.
Now, I also travel to the Midwest once or twice a year. It oftens, not always, feels like a time machine back to 1995.

One thing I do wish, for Sunday masses, I wish the first Eucharistic prayer would be more often (at least once in a while).

 

[MagdalenaRita]

So everyone upset and some yelling, if the original posters priest posted this thread and stated these are the changes our parish has made in the last 20 or so years to improve our parish, would you still be yelling?

Maybe the OP is grateful for the work of their priests over the last 20 years.

 

[MagdalenaRita]

I guess I’m just wondering how do we know if they did or not. Maybe they have thanked the priest. Maybe they do know the full story. Maybe the problem in the past was parishioners. All the post was about was her parish improvements over the last 20 or so years. That’s a good thing and it could be due to some good priests and the OP is grateful.
I dont believe they deserved the yelling seen in some of these comments.

 

[RobertAdams]

I disagree. For 90% of parishes optimizing for brevity is going to be the single best “optimization” one can make. Its far easier to deliver a good 3 minute sermon than a good 20 minute one. For most people it’s easier to immerse onself and focus for 45-50 minutes than for 60-75.

A couple of your dislikes ( liturgical dancing & congas) are also typically eliminated (thankfully) by a short mass.

Not opposed to a long Liturgy, but most would be more efficacious if shorter.

 

[PetraG]

Ensuring at least 2 candles are immediately next to altar. No more games of having one candle near the altar and one near the ambo – which some here called the “altar of the word.”

I agree that amateur “liturgists” should not try to “improve” on the prescriptions laid down by the Church for the arrangement of churches, the choice of furnishings, or for the celebration of the Holy Mass.

Just to clarify, however: the ambo does have a particular dignity among the furnishings of a church and the GIRM makes it very clear that the ambo is not to be treated as a common lectern (any more than that altar is to be treated as a big table or the sanctuary is to be treated as if it were some sort of “stage”):

The Ambo

309. The dignity of the Word of God requires that in the church there be a suitable place from which it may be proclaimed and toward which the attention of the faithful naturally turns during the Liturgy of the Word.(116)

It is appropriate that generally this place be a stationary ambo and not simply a movable lectern. The ambo must be located in keeping with the design of each church in such a way that the ordained ministers and readers may be clearly seen and heard by the faithful.

From the ambo only the readings, the Responsorial Psalm, and the Easter Proclamation (Exsultet) are to be proclaimed; likewise it may be used for giving the Homily and for announcing the intentions of the Universal Prayer. The dignity of the ambo requires that only a minister of the word should stand at it.

It is appropriate that before being put into liturgical use a new ambo be blessed according to the rite described in the Roman Ritual.(117)

We have to be very careful that we do not give credence to the idea that the Liturgy of the Eucharist is in some danger of neglect if we give proper attention to the Liturgy of the Word.

CCC 1346 The liturgy of the Eucharist unfolds according to a fundamental structure which has been preserved throughout the centuries down to our own day. It displays two great parts that form a fundamental unity:
- the gathering, the liturgy of the Word, with readings, homily and general intercessions;
- the liturgy of the Eucharist, with the presentation of the bread and wine, the consecratory thanksgiving, and communion.
The liturgy of the Word and liturgy of the Eucharist together form “one single act of worship”;[170]
The Eucharistic table set for us is the table both of the Word of God and of the Body of the Lord.[171]

If there are to be any announcements made in the church that cannot be accomplished without a lectern, the church ought to have a lectern other than the ambo for that function. By the placement, construction and restricted use of the ambo it should be very clear that the ambo has the special dignity that belongs to it because of its place in the Mass whereas any lectern or lecterns deemed necessary for other uses are just common book or music stands.

 

[PetraG]

I disagree. For 90% of parishes optimizing for brevity is going to be the single best “optimization” one can make. Its far easier to deliver a good 3 minute sermon than a good 20 minute one. For most people it’s easier to immerse onself and focus for 45-50 minutes than for 60-75.

A couple of your dislikes ( liturgical dancing & congas) are also typically eliminated (thankfully) by a short mass.

Not opposed to a long Liturgy, but most would be more efficacious if shorter.

I remember my dad loved this story: A young priest took his first assignment as associate at a large parish. He was surprised when he first used the ambo to see that it had a whiskey jigger on it. He asked the pastor about this, and the pastor said, “It pays to have a reminder that a good homily is like good whiskey. You don’t want to be stingy with it, but there does get to be a point where pouring out more is just a waste of really good stuff.”

Having said that, writing remarks that cover three readings in three minutes is actually more difficult to accomplish than having a somewhat longer time to develop the thoughts being delivered. That leaves a lot of real estate, however, between three minutes and 20 minutes.

The structure of the homily is very important in helping the listeners remember the main points. Ten minutes that are structured so that the material can be recalled in a coherent way is far better than five minutes that ramble around from point to point with no particular structure or any unifying main point.

 

[angel12]

Sounds a bit pedantic: I’m talking about priests getting criticized, and you’re also talking about priests getting criticized, but there’s a distinction somewhere that lots of people get, but I shouldn’t psychoanalyze your post in order to find the distinction…

No, I said posts don’t need to be psychoanalyzed to find non-existent “hidden” meanings. It’s right there in my post.
Please stop trying to put words in my mouth.

 

[angel12]

I never said one shouldn’t question. One should if there is a legitimate reason to.

What I did say is one should not call into question the intentions or motives of the decision -maker when the decision maker is making decisions that are valid and licit.

I think we need to give up here. 0331 is determined to find things in our posts that aren’t there.

 

[tafan2]

Having said that, writing remarks that cover three readings in three minutes is actually more difficult to accomplish than having a somewhat longer time to develop the thoughts being delivered. That leaves a lot of real estate, however, between three minutes and 20 minutes.

20 minute homily is too long, always in my opinion. For a Sunday mass, 10 minutes is the longest it should be. A deacon told me once they are told that 8 is optimal in their training.