The Quran corrects previous scriptures

[FaithofAbraham]

At best this is your personal interpretation but it’s still vague. I’m undecided on the Melchizedek - Jesus correlation, but I certainly disagree on the rest.

It’s really Paul’s interpretation if anyone’s. Much of Hebrews is about Jesus being a priest like Melchizedek.

Hebrews 6:20 Whither the forerunner is for us entered, even Jesus, made an high priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.

The Church is a body of Christ, pure and simple.

What do you mean by Jews in the Church? A complete Jews are ones that accept Christ; the others are one who don’t and still waiting for the Messiah. Jesus blood line comes from Abraham but that because of the promise of God.

There are Jews who accept Jesus, then there are Gentiles who accept Jesus. Jews follow all of Torah, Gentiles just follow some of it as commanded in Acts. Like not eating blood which was a command from the start to Noah.

There is nothing specific about Ishmael except for traditional belief that his descendants are the present day Arabs and those people residing in the Arabian peninsula.

I don’t know what to say but your idea is very unconventional. Are you Christian, Unitarian or Muslim? I mean, it would be easier for us to carry on the discussion if we understand your position better.

God bless.

Ishmael is the Gentile half of Abraham, the Jewish half is Isaac.

I’m Muslim. I would be Jewish if I thought I could live up to the task of observing Torah, maybe someday if I feel more committed.

 

[inJESUS]

There is nothing specific about Ishmael except for traditional belief that his descendants are the present day Arabs and those people residing in the Arabian peninsula.

 

[ralphinal]

FoA,

I am sorry that I was not more clear in my post. Melchizedek was not of the same tribe as Abraham. He was preist-king of Salem (now Jerusalem). Salem could be translated as peace, so he was High Priest and King of Peace (type of Christ in that way as well). My point is that to be of the Order of Melchizedek does not require anything of your bloodline. Once we are in Christ, there is no more Jew or Greek, Slave or Free. The associations of Ishmael and Isaac are not really involved in this. When Paul said that he was priest forever in the Order, he was refering to the offering that Jesus made at the last supper, not anything about who anyone’s ancester was.

 

[FaithofAbraham]

FoA,

I am sorry that I was not more clear in my post. Melchizedek was not of the same tribe as Abraham. He was preist-king of Salem (now Jerusalem). Salem could be translated as peace, so he was High Priest and King of Peace (type of Christ in that way as well). My point is that to be of the Order of Melchizedek does not require anything of your bloodline. Once we are in Christ, there is no more Jew or Greek, Slave or Free. The associations of Ishmael and Isaac are not really involved in this. When Paul said that he was priest forever in the Order, he was refering to the offering that Jesus made at the last supper, not anything about who anyone’s ancester was.

Melchizedek was a Gentile priest of God, opposed to a Jewish Levite priest. For Jesus it requires that he be Jewish and his bloodline be David since the Messiah is Melchizedek as foretold in Psalms, and in Ezekiel where he makes atonement for the people.

So we go:

Mechizedek Gentile
Abraham
Isaac Jew
Jacob Israel
Melchizedek Jesus Jew
Abraham’s Promise
Isaac Jew & Ishmael Gentile
Israel

And it loops from there to eternity, Jews and Gentiles receiving Abraham’s promise of Israel under Jesus.

 

[Reuben_J]

Hi, peace to you.

It’s really Paul’s interpretation if anyone’s. Much of Hebrews is about Jesus being a priest like Melchizedek.

Hebrews 6:20 Whither the forerunner is for us entered, even Jesus, made an high priest for ever after the order of Melchisedec.

There is no evident to suggest that Paul wrote the letter to the Hebrews.

Jesus as high priest after the order of Melchizedek is to denote that he is for all nations and for all times. In other word, he is divine.

There are Jews who accept Jesus, then there are Gentiles who accept Jesus. Jews follow all of Torah, Gentiles just follow some of it as commanded in Acts. Like not eating blood which was a command from the start to Noah.

Half truth and therefore not an accurate picture of a Christian. I mentioned about the complete Jew, the one who accepts Jesus. He is now a Christian but he does not need to undergo some of the initiations that are required in order to be a Christian. Baptism is one example.

Drinking blood and such are laws which are now no more important because Christians have a new law that’s being written in their hearts. What does it matter if one is circumcised but does not have love in his heart?

Ishmael is the Gentile half of Abraham, the Jewish half is Isaac.

This statement is misleading and therefore wrong. There were no Gentiles at the time of Abraham. There is no distinct discrimination as to who are the decendants of Isaac or Ishmael. This is not about bloodline but rather about believers. One is a Christian if one believes in Jesus; a non-Christian, if one does not.

Insomuch that the bloodline is important, is to fulfill God’s promise that the Messiah would be from the decendants of Abraham by virtue of their covenant.

I’m Muslim. I would be Jewish if I thought I could live up to the task of observing Torah, maybe someday if I feel more committed.

Thanks for revealing yourself. I appreciate that.

I suggest you stay Muslim and be a good one at it.

May God bless you.

Reuben.

 

[Reuben_J]

how if Arabs existed before Ishmael?

Exactly.

Anyway you also got the Edomites, the Moabites, the Ammonites and the Midianites.

It is always a suspect if someone claims that Ishmael was an ancestor for just one race that’s in existence today. Nothing to support that conclusion actually, but more a way of justification to politically elevate the particular race!

I don’t see any significant about traces of Ishmael in modern days other than the above justification.

 

[Reuben_J]

Have a nice weekend in the days ahead. I’ll be away for a while.

Reuben.

 

[FaithofAbraham]

Hi, peace to you.
There is no evident to suggest that Paul wrote the letter to the Hebrews.

That’s been the traditional view since ancient manuscripts noted it was, though modern scholars say maybe not, but a member of his community. I believe it is Paul too, but we can just say it’s an idea from the NT.

Jesus as high priest after the order of Melchizedek is to denote that he is for all nations and for all times. In other word, he is divine.

Well, for all nations, maybe not for all times since Levites handled atonement for Jews. Now Jesus handles it for everyone.

Half truth and therefore not an accurate picture of a Christian. I mentioned about the complete Jew, the one who accepts Jesus. He is now a Christian but he does not need to undergo some of the initiations that are required in order to be a Christian. Baptism is one example.

Drinking blood and such are laws which are now no more important because Christians have a new law that’s being written in their hearts. What does it matter if one is circumcised but does not have love in his heart?

But that you have love doesn’t mean you can forsake the commands either.

Acts 15:19-20 Wherefore my sentence is, that we trouble not them, which from among the Gentiles are turned to God: But that we write unto them, that they abstain from pollutions of idols, and from fornication, and from things strangled, and from blood.

The Law that is written in our hearts is when Satan is destroyed by Jesus and there is no more sin, then everyone will always just do the right thing. That hasn’t happened yet. The New Covenant is fully in place when children’s teeth are no longer set on edge by their fathers, and the curse of death on Adam is lifted from all of humanity. So that all happens here:

Revelation 21:4 And God shall wipe away all tears from their eyes; and there shall be no more death, neither sorrow, nor crying, neither shall there be any more pain: for the former things are passed away.

And the Old Covenant Laws for Jews remain in effect until that time.

Matthew 5:18 For verily I say unto you, Till heaven and earth pass, one jot or one tittle shall in no wise pass from the law, till all be fulfilled.

This statement is misleading and therefore wrong. There were no Gentiles at the time of Abraham. There is no distinct discrimination as to who are the decendants of Isaac or Ishmael. This is not about bloodline but rather about believers. One is a Christian if one believes in Jesus; a non-Christian, if one does not.

Everyone was a Gentile at the time of Abraham since there were no such thing as Jews. However the Jews came from Isaac and in that sense he symbolizes them, while the Ishmael line remained Gentile. Symbolically they represent Jews and grafted Gentiles who receive the promise of their father Abraham.

 

[De_Maria]

The Qur’an was NOT sent as an erratum i.e. it is not meant to correct errors by the author but rather, it was sent as a Criterion i.e. to distinguish between truth and falsehood and thereby enable believers to know and recognise the corruption that earlier scriptures had been subjected to throughout history until the Qur’an was revealed.

So when the Quran says that Christians should obey their own Scriptures and they would be safe, it really didn’t mean it?

Sincerely,

De Maria

 

[hamba2han]

So when the Quran says that Christians should obey their own Scriptures and they would be safe, it really didn’t mean it?

Where does the Qur’an say this?

 

[inJESUS]

Where does the Qur’an say this?

you are nothing if you do not obey the Torah and Injil ecc ecc…if thry are corrupt, how will they possibly be able to obey them?

 

[De_Maria]

Where does the Qur’an say this?

9/ In the following verses we see Jews and Christians are urged to teach the truth of their scriptures and to obey them: Say: “O People of the Scripture! Stress not in your religion other than the truth” (5:77 MP/80 AYA). Do ye enjoin right conduct on the people, and forget (to practice it) yourselves, and yet ye study the Scripture? (2:44 AYA). Christians and Jews could not teach and obey their scriptures if their scriptures were corrupted.
answering-islam.org/Green/onbible.htm

Sincerely,

De Maria

 

[paarsurrey]

The Quran corrects previous scriptures

Hi

I feel that my Catholic friends feel difficulty in comprehending as to how Quran descending 600 years after Jesus and 2000 years after Moses could correct/edit the mistakes of OTBible and NTBible. What is the source?

It is very easy to understand my friend. GodAllahYHWH talks to His ProphetsMessengers like Krishna, Buddha, Zoroaster, Abraham, Moses, Jesus and Muhammad; and He revealed certain things to them for the guidance of the humanity at large.

The common source of their knowledge was/is GodAllahYHWH. He revealed everything to Muhammad directly, so Muhammad need not read OTBible or NTBible or any other book; he gained knowledge about JesusYeshuaIssa and Mary from the original source of All-Knowing GodAllahYHWH; this is my understanding, and I think it is not difficult to understand.

The corrections has not been made by Muhammad but GodAllahYHWH himself who knows for certain when and where and why a mistake was made and as to how it should be corrected so that the humanity is benefitted.

Thanks

 

[De_Maria]

The Quran corrects previous scriptures

Hi

I feel that my Catholic friends feel difficulty in comprehending as to how Quran descending 600 years after Jesus and 2000 years after Moses could correct/edit the mistakes of OTBible and NTBible. What is the source?

It is very easy to understand my friend. GodAllahYHWH talks to His ProphetsMessengers like Krishna, Buddha, Zoroaster, Abraham, Moses, Jesus and Muhammad; and He revealed certain things to them for the guidance of the humanity at large.

The common source of their knowledge was/is GodAllahYHWH. He revealed everything to Muhammad directly, so Muhammad need not read OTBible or NTBible or any other book; he gained knowledge about JesusYeshuaIssa and Mary from the original source of All-Knowing GodAllahYHWH; this is my understanding, and I think it is not difficult to understand.

The corrections has not been made by Muhammad but GodAllahYHWH himself who knows for certain when and where and why a mistake was made and as to how it should be corrected so that the humanity is benefitted.

Thanks

No. We have trouble understanding how you can believe all that blubber without one shred of evidence.

Sincerely,

De Maria

 

[carus]

What did the Quran correct about the title Son of God? nothing. Allah gave a dozen verse talking about women and children to refute it and Muslims, till now, think the title is physical. In other words, Allah did not correct but created a flawed argument.

What did the Quran correct about Jesus’ crucifixion? nothing. Some Muslims think someone else died, others think Jesus was crucified yet did not die, others think there was no crucifixion at all. Huge differences from a single Quranic verse. So what did the Quran clear or correct? nothing. It created confusion and yet calls Jews and Christians (who were never confused in the first place) as “in doubt” about the crucifixion, when fact is, only Muslims have been in doubt till the present day.

What did the Quran correct about the belief that Jesus is God? nothing. It says that since he ate food, he is no divine. But hey, we believe He was human as well.Pretty poor argument from an all-knowing deity.
Or, it says we believe that God is Jesus, which is a flawed argument since we already know that the Father is not Jesus.

Hellow Frend!
I do consider all of my Frends who answered in ragard to your question, and the discussion went on leaving your questions behind, Well at the moment I’m providing you answers of only a few of your questions in regard to Jesus Only at the moment and soon I’ll come with the answers to the rest of your questions, And I’m answering in my own manner coming to the point from where it started, So here it goes…
1st of all my answer is only worth if you’re ready to believe in it and not to mislead anyone, and i want it go smooth in the manner of arguments with the solid proofs from the Holy Book Qura’n and Qura’n to be the word of Allah i’ve given my Statements in the tread of the Topic “the quran”,
Well about the above mentioned questions of your are all true, in your way of thinking, and i can see that how far you lie from the truth, with no personal attack my frend, I hope that you know that We Muslims Believe in the Same God Whom you believe, Whom Jesus, Muses, Abraham, Isaac, Jonah, Noah etc. represented. So I’ve found all the proofs you need as answer as Allah did correct the previous scriptures in the Holy Book Qura’n.
Well We Muslims have following Belief.
As in that Jesus is not the Son of Allah(God), He was Only the Messenger of Allah (God), And he was Neither Crucified and Nor Died on the Cross… Well as Evidence I give you the Explanation from the following…

Surah Al-Imran Chapter (3:55)

And (remember) when Allâh said: “O 'Iesa (Jesus)! I will take you and raise you to Myself and clear you [of the forged statement that 'Iesa (Jesus) is Allâh’s son] of those who disbelieve, and I will make those who follow you (Monotheists, who worship none but Allâh) superior to those who disbelieve [in the Oneness of Allâh, or disbelieve in some of His Messengers, e.g. Muhammad SAW, 'Iesa (Jesus), Mûsa (Moses), etc., or in His Holy Books, e.g. the Taurât (Torah), the Injeel (Gospel), the Qur’ân] till the Day of Resurrection[10]. Then you will return to Me and I will judge between you in the matters in which you used to dispute.”

And more is here from Surah An-Nisa chapter (4:156-7)

And because of their (Jews) disbelief and uttering against Maryam (Mary <>Ç <> ) a grave false charge (that she has committed illegal sexual intercourse);

And because of their saying (in boast), “We killed Messiah 'Iesa (Jesus), son of Maryam (Mary), the Messenger of Allâh,” - but they killed him not, nor crucified him, but the resemblance of 'Iesa (Jesus) was put over another man (and they killed that man), and those who differ therein are full of doubts. They have no (certain) knowledge, they follow nothing but conjecture. For surely; they killed him not *:

Now i give you that Jesus Never Said that He’s Son of Allah (The Only God) from Surah Ma’idah Chapter (5:116-7)

And (remember) when Allâh will say (on the Day of Resurrection): "O 'Iesa (Jesus), son of Maryam (Mary)! Did you say unto men: ‘Worship me and my mother as two gods besides Allâh?’ " He will say: "Glory be to You! It was not for me to say what I had no right (to say). Had I said such a thing, You would surely have known it. You know what is in my innerself though I do not know what is in Yours, truly, You, only You, are the AllKnower of all that is hidden and unseen.

"Never did I say to them aught except what You (Allâh) did command me to say: ‘Worship Allâh, my Lord and your Lord.’ And I was a witness over them while I dwelt amongst them, but when You took me up, You were the Watcher over them, and You are a Witness to all things. (This is a great admonition and warning to the Christians of the whole world).

And now from Surah Maryam known to you as Mary Chapter (19:30,33,35)
(19:30)
“He 'Iesa (Jesus)] said: Verily! I am a slave of Allâh, He has given me the Scripture and made me a Prophet;]”
(19:33)
“And Salâm (peace) be upon me the day I was born, and the day I die, and the day I shall be raised alive!”
(19:35)
It befits not (the Majesty of) Allâh that He should beget a son [this refers to the slander of Christians against Allâh, by saying that 'Iesa (Jesus) is the son of Allâh]. Glorified (and Exalted be He above all that they associate with Him). When He decrees a thing, He only says to it, “Be!” and it is]
Well I hope I’ve answered the Questions you posed… If Humans strive to believe in it… I may give you more on this, If it doesn’t make it clear to you…
Happy Endings… *

 

[tomshaikh]

Salaam Hamab2,

You explain very nicely to injesus. You do not have to explain everything coz it is a saying that “for wiseman there is pointing is enough for him” and i am happy that you have over come to the nick injesus. What ever you try to say is correct and i am also as a muslim will answer this.

Quran is not revealed for particularly to correct torah and bible. and torah and bible is for children of israel guidance. But Quran is for whole wide world. Get advantage before its too late. It is saying that it will be vanished from every body heart and mind before judgement day. And enough is enough with God/Allah as he didn’t like the disbeliever and God/Allah showed his ?(one of the 99 names i donot know i have to picked up and i donot want to say anger or something but anywayz) on people who didn’t believed in his verses and Allah told in Quran openly about disbeliver like people see the movie FITNA. Next thread mine will be on 99 Names of Allah/God.and i read in bible some where that after punishment of Nuh(Noah) people. Allah/God promises not to show his ? to next generation after NUH until judgement day.

So my friends Allah/God is giving you guyz so many loose rope like when you fall down from mountain with rope. So now it will be anytime when it will be tangled or cut the rope.and i.e, JUDGEMENT DAY