The RAPTURE and CHURCH FATHERS

[CATHOLICHEAD]

Was arguing with a Protestant and he threw out a few things at me(we were speaking about the Rapture). He said that the view of the Premillenial Rapture was held by early Church Fathers Irenaeus, Papias, and a few others. He said it DID NOT barely sprout up with Darby, but has it’s roots in the very early church. How do I answer this? Is this true?

I’d appreciate any response. Thanks!

 

[DavidFilmer]

CATHOLICHEAD:

…He said that the view of the Premillenial Rapture was held by early Church Fathers Irenaeus, Papias, and a few others. He said it DID NOT barely sprout up with Darby, but has it’s roots in the very early church. How do I answer this?

If these Fathers said it, we ought to be able to read it. So ask him to give you a citation (the writings of the ECFs are available (free) on-line at ccel.org/fathers2.

But, no, it’s not true. He may be confusing “rapture” theology with Premillennialism (which really has nothing to do with the “rapture”). Premillennialism was a common viewpoint in the pre-Nicene era, but the idea fell out of favor until about 1970, when it was picked up again mostly by protestants (the Church has never taken a position on the nature or timing of the “Millennium,” but most Catholic theologians support amillennialalism).

The so-called “Pre-Trib” rapture theology was invented in the 1830’s by John Nelson Darby (who founded the Plymouth Brethren church and also invented a theological system called Dispensationalism).

Darby’s teaching were picked up by C. I. Scofield, who promoted the view in the footnotes of his Scofield Reference Bible. This Bible proved to be VERY popular. Many readers uncritically accepted Scofield’s footnotes.

If your friend wishes to establish a common pre-Trib rapture theology among the Early Church Fathers, all he needs to do is show you the citations. But he can’t.

 

[trumpet152]

Well put, David.

I agree. He’s probably confusing Premillennialism with the “pre-trib” rapture. These are two different issues. I also suggest that you ask him to show you some references to this in the Church Fathers. I did this with a Protestant on this same issue about 2 months ago. He still can’t find anything.

 

[Fidelis]

This is a pretty common ploy to legitimize a modern theology by appealing to something similar sounding that some of the ECF’s thought. The most important things to keep in mind are that a) though the ECF’s are helpful in showing how the early Church developed it’s teaching, they are not in themselves infallible; b) There was a lot of disagreement among the ECFs about this. The Church did not hold an official opinion at the time, so they were free to speculate; c) The fact that the ECF’s thought the Second Coming would be in the year 1000 only shows how mistaken they were on this specific point of speculation. And so is your friend.

 

[puzzleannie]

CATHOLICHEAD:

Was arguing with a Protestant and he threw out a few things at me(we were speaking about the Rapture). He said that the view of the Premillenial Rapture was held by early Church Fathers Irenaeus, Papias, and a few others. He said it DID NOT barely sprout up with Darby, but has it’s roots in the very early church. How do I answer this? Is this true?

I’d appreciate any response. Thanks!

the burden of proof is on your friend to provide sources for the alleged teachings by the early Fathers of the Church supporting the specific idea of the Rapture as it is articulated by its 19th c. proponents. Until he does, offer no arguement or rebuttal because there is nothing to discuss.

 

[John_Joseph]

As already noted, Irenaeus, was a premillennialist, he was not a believer in some sort of rapture. Furthermore, Irenaeus wasn’t a very good premillennialist:

“For in as many days as this world was made, in so many thousand years shall it be concluded. And for this reason the Scripture says: “Thus the heaven and the earth were finished, and all their adornment. And God brought to a conclusion upon the sixth day the works that He had made; and God rested upon the seventh day from all His works.” This is an account of the things formerly created, as also it is a prophecy of what is to come. For the day of the Lord is as a thousand years; and in six days created things were completed: it is evident, therefore, that they will come to an end at the sixth thousand year.”

Source: ccel.org/fathers2/ANF-01/anf01-63.htm#P9283_2709558

This would have put the end of the world around 1000AD. You should ask your friend why he would use Irenaeus’ incorrect premillennialist claims to support his.