The rapture

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michelle_r

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Can someone please explain to me why we as Catholics do not believe in the rapture. In relationship to this, how are we to interpret 1 Thessalonians 4:16-17,

“for the Lord himself, with a word of command, with the voice of an archangel and with the trumpet of God, will come down from heaven, and the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. Thus we shall always be with the Lord.”
 
The verse you quote refers to the public second coming of Jesus - not the (secret) “rapture”. All the evidence suggests that the idea of a rapture of the Faithful **before **the tribulations of the end-times, originated in Protestantism in the personal “Revelation” supposedly had by a scottish girl, Margaret Macdonald, in Port Glasgow, sometime in the 1830s. She spoke of the “secret return” of Jesus for the faithful. This was taken up by an ex-Anglican priest named John Nelson Darby (1800-1882), and found its way into the notes of Schofield reference Bible, which was very influential among Victorian evangelicals.

The problem with this teaching is that it requires a secret. hidden 3rd coming of Christ to “rapture” His Church out of the world prior to a 7 year Tribulation where no one will see Him but those being raptured.

However the bible teaches 2 comings of Christ, not 3. The first has come. The second will be when EVERY eye will see Him come in the clouds . . . There is no teaching in the bible that Christ comes to get His Church and hides Himself from all eyes .
In fact a pre-tribulation “rapture” of Christians is specifically denied in the Gospels.

Matthew 24.7 For nation will rise against nation, and kingdom against kingdom, and there will be famines and earthquakes in various places: 8 all this is but the beginning of the birth-pangs. 9 "Then they will deliver you up to tribulation, and put you to death; and you will be hated by all nations for my name’s sake. 10 And then many will fall away, and betray one another, and hate one another. 11 And many false prophets will arise and lead many astray. 12 And because wickedness is multiplied, most men’s love will grow cold. 13 But he who endures to the end will be saved. 14 And this gospel of the kingdom will be preached throughout the whole world, as a testimony to all nations; and then the end will come. 15 "So when you see the desolating sacrilege spoken of by the prophet Daniel, standing in the holy place (let the reader understand), 16 then let those who are in Judea flee to the mountains; 17 let him who is on the housetop not go down to take what is in his house; 18 and let him who is in the field not turn back to take his mantle. 19 And alas for those who are with child and for those who give suck in those days! 20 Pray that your flight may not be in winter or on a sabbath. 21 For then there will be great tribulation, such as has not been from the beginning of the world until now, no, and never will be. 22 And if those days had not been shortened, no human being would be saved; but for the sake of the elect those days will be shortened.

In other words, the Tribulation is to be shortened for the sake of Christians. Christians will not be raptured away to escape the Tribulation.

23 Then if any one says to you, ‘Lo, here is the Christ!’ or ‘There he is!’ do not believe it. 24 For false Christs and false prophets will arise and show great signs and wonders, so as to lead astray, if possible, even the elect. 25 Lo, I have told you beforehand. 26 So, if they say to you, ‘Lo, he is in the wilderness,’ do not go out; if they say, ‘Lo, he is in the inner rooms,’ do not believe it. 27 For as the lightning comes from the east and shines as far as the west, so will be the coming of the Son of man.

Christ will return only in glory, not secretly. There is only **one **second coming.

28 Wherever the body is, there the eagles will be gathered together. 29 "Immediately after the tribulation of those days the sun will be darkened, and the moon will not give its light, and the stars will fall from heaven, and the powers of the heavens will be shaken; 30 then will appear the sign of the Son of man in heaven, and then all the tribes of the earth will mourn, and they will see the Son of man coming on the clouds of heaven with power and great glory; 31 and he will send out his angels with a loud trumpet call, and they will gather his elect from the four winds, from one end of heaven to the other.

Jesus returns and gathers the elect after the tribulation.
 
The “Rapture” was first taught by a “visionary” in the Plymoth Brethren Church in the 19th century.who had a history of mental illness.
 
1 Thessalonians 4:16-17,

“for the Lord himself, with a word of command, with the voice of an archangel and with the trumpet of God, will come down from heaven, and the dead in Christ will rise first. Then we who are alive, who are left, will be caught up together with them in the clouds to meet the Lord in the air. Thus we shall always be with the Lord.”
Where does it say anything about a rapture? This is about the Parousia. This is when Christ will Come in Glory to judge the Living and the Dead and claim His Kingdom and that kingtom will have no end. The Church has been telling the Faithful about this since the beginning and you can read what the Christian teaching on this has always been.

The ‘rapture’ is an invention of the 19th centry, there is no mention of the rapture before that.
 
Beyond biblical scriptures, the Rapture is against the core theology of the Church. The Church is hear to help the sick, we are all called to tend to the needy. To state that the best of the Church will be whisked away to heaven while the rest of humanity scab away on Earth is not compatible IMHO.
 
I just meant that I know this is the verse that people quote when trying to prove the rapture is something that is going to happen. I was looking for an appropriate response to these people. Axion reminded me of some things that I had learned in the past regarding this issue. Thank you! I will study up on it so I can be better prepared when this issue comes up with my non-Catholic brethren.
 
Thank you Jermosh. That’s a good point of view also.

Michelle r
 
All the evidence suggests that the idea of a rapture of the Faithful **before **the tribulations of the end-times, originated in Protestantism in the personal “Revelation” supposedly had by a scottish girl, Margaret Macdonald, in Port Glasgow, sometime in the 1830s. She spoke of the “secret return” of Jesus for the faithful. This was taken up by an ex-Anglican priest named John Nelson Darby (1800-1882), and found its way into the notes of Schofield reference Bible, which was very influential among Victorian evangelicals.
The “Rapture” was first taught by a “visionary” in the Plymoth Brethren Church in the 19th century.who had a history of mental illness.
It’s not surprising to me that The Protestants get themselves into this sort of nonsense when one considers that they have been getting by with a secret-magisterium for 500 years. As best I can tell the Protestant magisterium is nothing more more than what few men happen to be working the Protestant Bible Publishing Printing Press when the order runs come in to print out a fresh batch of bibles and somone picks up the latest hysteria and puts it into the translation notes. 😃

James
 
1 Thessalonians 4:16-17 deals with Christs return and the resurrection of the dead, not the Rapture. All the apostle says is that Jesus will return and all will know it, and then the dead will be raised and those who are still alive on the earth will be taken to heaven body and soul. There is no tribulation that follows that event, because the tribulation had already began when the apostle wrote his letter and, gathering from the fact that he doesn’t mention it, he understood that.

You will also get pointed to Matthew 24, but the things that Jesus describes in Matthew 24 are happening and have been happening. And when he talks about one being left behind and one being taken-- this is where they mostly get the idea of Rapture from (Matthew 24:40-41)–, pay close attention to the text prior to that. The ones that are taken are the evil ones, not the good ones. Above it, in Matthew 24:37-39, Jesus says it ‘will be like in the days of Noah’. It was the bad people who were swept away by the flood, not the good people. This also is found in Luke 17:26-37, and if you look you will see in Luke 17:37 it says the disciples asked where they will be taken:

'And answering they said to Him, “Where, Lord?” And He said to them, “Where the body is, there also the vultures will be gathered.”

I don’t know about you, but I sure do hope I get “left behind”. 😃
 
If you are interested in this subject you should check out Paul Thigpen’s book The Rapture Trap.
 
The “Rapture” was first taught by a “visionary” in the Plymoth Brethren Church in the 19th century.who had a history of mental illness.
Wow! I’m surprised you actually make a reference to the Plymouth Brethren! There are teachings of the Church that were first articulated by Origin; even though he was later condemned as a heretic, the church does not reject absolutely everything that he taught. What’s the big deal about being “caught up” to meet the Lord in the air? That alone does not make us hyper ultra dispensationalists! :eek:
 
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