The real first day of the week

[kja]

Is the first day of the week (Sunday) we observe today the same first day of the week that Jesus rose from the dead or has the weekly 7 day cycle changed? Is there any church documentation to confirm either way. Is this issue important to Roman Catholic Christians? Thanks in advance for your response.
Kevin

 

[The_GreyPilgrim]

Is the first day of the week (Sunday) we observe today the same first day of the week that Jesus rose from the dead or has the weekly 7 day cycle changed? Is there any church documentation to confirm either way. Is this issue important to Roman Catholic Christians? Thanks in advance for your response.
Kevin

According to history the day after the Jewish Sabbath was recognized in Roman reckoning as the day of the Sun. The Sabbath being the Roman day of Saturn. As far as I know the 7 day week has been kept in tact because as the Jews celebrated the seven days of creation. The Romans reckoned seven days because by their discovery they only recognized seven heavenly bodies, hence they named the days of the week.

 

[pablope]

Is the first day of the week (Sunday) we observe today the same first day of the week that Jesus rose from the dead or has the weekly 7 day cycle changed? Is there any church documentation to confirm either way. Is this issue important to Roman Catholic Christians? Thanks in advance for your response.
Kevin

The day of the new creation…is the day of the Resurrection…Sunday…of the Day of the Lord…of the new covenant that Jesus established at the Last Supper before the crucifixion.

 

[ConstantineTG]

Is the first day of the week (Sunday) we observe today the same first day of the week that Jesus rose from the dead or has the weekly 7 day cycle changed? Is there any church documentation to confirm either way. Is this issue important to Roman Catholic Christians? Thanks in advance for your response.
Kevin

Sunday is the first day of the week. It is important to all ancient Christians, Catholic and Orthodox. The cycle of days has not changed, Saturday is still the Sabbath, and Sunday is the Lord’s Day.

 

[kja]

The reason I ask is because I have been told by other protestant christians that as a Seventh day Adventist , Im not observing the same seventh day that the jews observed because a jew named Hillel changed the calendar in the fourth century. I was a “mainstream” protestant for fifteen years and found them to be very wishy washy about the day of the week that you go to church. They believe it doesnt matter, its not an issue to God anymore they say. I found them to be wishy washy about a lot of issues. Baptism doesnt matter, communion doesnt matter, obedience to the Ten commandments doesnt matter because once you’re ‘saved’ your ‘saved’. It all just didnt sit right with me because I know that we dont serve a wishy washy God. I stress that this was only my experience with mainstream protestant christianity and dont paint all mainstream protestants with the same brush. Whilst I dont always agree with Catholics , I admire the fact that you what you believe and why you believe it because we dont worship a wishy washy God.

Anyway enough venting my frustrations and back to the topic, I thought that if the calendar was changed and Im not observing the same seventh day that the jews observed, the rest of christianity isnt observing the same first day of the week either so I thought that a major change like this would have been recorded by the Catholic Church. Hope this clarifies my question a bit ore. Again I stress that my experience in mainstream protestantism is my experience only.

 

[pablope]

The reason I ask is because I have been told by other protestant christians that as a Seventh day Adventist , Im not observing the same seventh day that the jews observed because a jew named Hillel changed the calendar in the fourth century.

Could you be more specific and provide sources?

Jews observed (maybe still observes) a different calendar then.

I think all ancient calendars were based on the cycles of the moon and sun, etc.

As science progressed, what was changed was the numbers of days in a year, which was corrected for our times, based on the revolution of the earth around the sun, not necessarily the days of the week.

Whilst I dont always agree with Catholics , I admire the fact that you what you believe and why you believe it because we dont worship a wishy washy God.

 

[Remnant1]

Is the first day of the week (Sunday) we observe today the same first day of the week that Jesus rose from the dead or has the weekly 7 day cycle changed? Is there any church documentation to confirm either way. Is this issue important to Roman Catholic Christians? Thanks in advance for your response.
Kevin

The first day is still the first day. The Sabbath is still the seventh day. Altho the calender has changed the weekly cycle has not. The issue is extremely important.

Eze 20:11 And I gave them my statutes, and shewed them my judgments, which [if] a man do, he shall even live in them.
Eze 20:12 Moreover also I gave them my sabbaths, to be a sign between me and them, that they might know that I [am] the LORD that sanctify them.

The Sabbath is a sign that it is God that sanctifies His people and not man.

 

[Publisher]

The first day of the week follows “the seventh day”. Your faith tradition calls itself “Seventh Day Adventist”. There seven days of the week, the Jewish Sabbath hasn’t ever changed days.

 

[twopekinguys]

Is the first day of the week (Sunday) we observe today the same first day of the week that Jesus rose from the dead or has the weekly 7 day cycle changed? Is there any church documentation to confirm either way. Is this issue important to Roman Catholic Christians? Thanks in advance for your response.
Kevin

There is a simple correlation.

As an SDA (Seventh Day Adventist) you celebrate on Saturday. This correlates to the 7th day of the week.

Therefore, Sunday is the 1st day.

 

[Remnant1]

The first day of the week follows “the seventh day”. Your faith tradition calls itself “Seventh Day Adventist”. There seven days of the week, the Jewish Sabbath hasn’t ever changed days.

There is no such thing as “the Jewish Sabbath”

Exodus20
8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
11 For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

 

[DelsonJacobs]

I am a Roman Catholic, but I am also Hebrew.

As a Jew I know a lot about what day is what. I also know very well the teachings of the SDA (they are related to the Jehovah’s Witnesses, and for some crazy reason my family left the Church and I ended up there for a few years as a teenager).

Anyway, for Jews who practice Judaism the first day of the week is the day after the Sabbath. The Sabbath is observed from sundown Friday to sundown Saturday, at least those are the Gentile names of the days we all use today.

This makes Sunday the first day of the week.

Members of my father’s family are said to have become Christians during the time of the apostles. Their practice, as I understand was that though they observed the Sabbath from Friday sundown to Saturday sundown, they observed the day after the Sabbath as the “new day” or “8th day.”

In the form of midrash they were using, these Jews viewed the seven-day week as over. God’s rest for himself was over too. He was now bringing us into his rest through what he had done via the Messiah.

This midrash was developed due to the fact that Jesus rose on the day after the Sabbath. God, in these early Jewish-Christian’s minds, was creating new life now. (Matthew 28:1) God in a sense was working again, making us into new creations, and with sin defeated we humans could rest.–2 Corinthians 5:17, Hebrews 4:9.

This new day of rest, being the day after the Sabbath, was adopted as the “new Sabbath” with totally new meanings. The old Sabbath does not make anyone alive. Even our Lord was in the grave during the old Sabbath. On the new Sabbath our Lord was alive and gave us proofs of his life. He also gave us freedom from sin.–Compare John 20:19-20.

All this began on the first day of the Jewish week, what the Gentiles call “Sunday.”

From this the Catholic Church and most all Protestants observe Sunday, not as the Sabbath of the Mosaic Law–a Sabbath where no one comes to life–but the Sabbath of our Lord, a Sabbath where there is new life.–Matthew 12:18.

New life, new day. Also new practices.

As Jews my family living in Jerusalem would have already followed Jewish customs on Saturday. When Sunday came, as Jewish-Christians, they saw that as something different, something that the old Sabbath under the Law of Moses was just a shadow of. This practice of the Jewish-Christians later became official doctrine and practice in the Catholic Church.–Hebrews 10:1.

 

[pablope]

There is no such thing as “the Jewish Sabbath”

Exodus20
8 Remember the sabbath day, to keep it holy.
9 Six days shalt thou labour, and do all thy work:
10 But the seventh day is the sabbath of the Lord thy God: in it thou shalt not do any work, thou, nor thy son, nor thy daughter, thy manservant, nor thy maidservant, nor thy cattle, nor thy stranger that is within thy gates:
11 For in six days the Lord made heaven and earth, the sea, and all that in them is, and rested the seventh day: wherefore the Lord blessed the sabbath day, and hallowed it.

But Christianity is not under the Old Covenant…it is under the New Covenenant…we are a new creation borne on the Resurrection of Christ, hence we celebrate the day of the new creation.

Here is my question…what or where did the SDA get its authority to tell everyone to go back to practicing the Jewish sabath as a day of worship under the new covenant?

Who told the SDA to do this?

 

[pablope]

I am a Roman Catholic, but I am also Hebrew.

This new day of rest, being the day after the Sabbath, was adopted as the “new Sabbath” with totally new meanings. The old Sabbath does not make anyone alive. Even our Lord was in the grave during the old Sabbath. On the new Sabbath our Lord was alive and gave us proofs of his life. He also gave us freedom from sin.–Compare John 20:19-20.

All this began on the first day of the Jewish week, what the Gentiles call “Sunday.”

From this the Catholic Church and most all Protestants observe Sunday, not as the Sabbath of the Mosaic Law–a Sabbath where no one comes to life–but the Sabbath of our Lord, a Sabbath where there is new life.–Matthew 12:18.

New life, new day. Also new practices.

As Jews my family living in Jerusalem would have already followed Jewish customs on Saturday. When Sunday came, as Jewish-Christians, they saw that as something different, something that the old Sabbath under the Law of Moses was just a shadow of. This practice of the Jewish-Christians later became official doctrine and practice in the Catholic Church.–Hebrews 10:1.

I hope you do not mind if I borrow your explanation of the new sabbath…

I like your insight here…which is what i am trying to get across Remnant1:

God, in these early Jewish-Christian’s minds, was creating new life now. (Matthew 28:1) God in a sense was working again, making us into new creations, and with sin defeated we humans could rest.–2 Corinthians 5:17, Hebrews 4:9.

This new day of rest, being the day after the Sabbath, was adopted as the “new Sabbath” with totally new meanings. The old Sabbath does not make anyone alive. Even our Lord was in the grave during the old Sabbath. On the new Sabbath our Lord was alive and gave us proofs of his life. He also gave us freedom from sin.–Compare John 20:19-20.

All this began on the first day of the Jewish week, what the Gentiles call “Sunday.”

From this the Catholic Church and most all Protestants observe Sunday, not as the Sabbath of the Mosaic Law–a Sabbath where no one comes to life–but the Sabbath of our Lord, a Sabbath where there is new life.–Matthew 12:18.

 

[CarolNoel]

I am a Roman Catholic, but I am also Hebrew.

As a Jew I know a lot about what day is what. I also know very well the teachings of the SDA (they are related to the Jehovah’s Witnesses, and for some crazy reason my family left the Church and I ended up there for a few years as a teenager).

Anyway, for Jews who practice Judaism the first day of the week is the day after the Sabbath. The Sabbath is observed from sundown Friday to sundown Saturday, at least those are the Gentile names of the days we all use today.

This makes Sunday the first day of the week.

Members of my father’s family are said to have become Christians during the time of the apostles. Their practice, as I understand was that though they observed the Sabbath from Friday sundown to Saturday sundown, they observed the day after the Sabbath as the “new day” or “8th day.”

In the form of midrash they were using, these Jews viewed the seven-day week as over. God’s rest for himself was over too. He was now bringing us into his rest through what he had done via the Messiah.

This midrash was developed due to the fact that Jesus rose on the day after the Sabbath. God, in these early Jewish-Christian’s minds, was creating new life now. (Matthew 28:1) God in a sense was working again, making us into new creations, and with sin defeated we humans could rest.–2 Corinthians 5:17, Hebrews 4:9.

This new day of rest, being the day after the Sabbath, was adopted as the “new Sabbath” with totally new meanings. The old Sabbath does not make anyone alive. Even our Lord was in the grave during the old Sabbath. On the new Sabbath our Lord was alive and gave us proofs of his life. He also gave us freedom from sin.–Compare John 20:19-20.

All this began on the first day of the Jewish week, what the Gentiles call “Sunday.”

From this the Catholic Church and most all Protestants observe Sunday, not as the Sabbath of the Mosaic Law–a Sabbath where no one comes to life–but the Sabbath of our Lord, a Sabbath where there is new life.–Matthew 12:18.

New life, new day. Also new practices.

As Jews my family living in Jerusalem would have already followed Jewish customs on Saturday. When Sunday came, as Jewish-Christians, they saw that as something different, something that the old Sabbath under the Law of Moses was just a shadow of. This practice of the Jewish-Christians later became official doctrine and practice in the Catholic Church.–Hebrews 10:1.

Great explanation! Thanks.

 

[Remnant1]

But Christianity is not under the Old Covenant…it is under the New Covenenant…we are a new creation borne on the Resurrection of Christ, hence we celebrate the day of the new creation.

Here is my question…what or where did the SDA get its authority to tell everyone to go back to practicing the Jewish sabath as a day of worship under the new covenant?

Who told the SDA to do this?

My authority comes from the word of God. There is not a shred of evidence that God has in any way changed the Sabbath because of Jesus rising on the first day. In fact we can and I do say that Jesus confirmed the Sabbath day by resting in the grave. I would like to know what you mean by the “Old Covenant”.

 

[Remnant1]

I hope you do not mind if I borrow your explanation of the new sabbath…

I like your insight here…which is what i am trying to get across Remnant1:

God, in these early Jewish-Christian’s minds, was creating new life now. (Matthew 28:1) God in a sense was working again, making us into new creations, and with sin defeated we humans could rest.–2 Corinthians 5:17, Hebrews 4:9.

This new day of rest, being the day after the Sabbath, was adopted as the “new Sabbath” with totally new meanings. The old Sabbath does not make anyone alive. Even our Lord was in the grave during the old Sabbath. On the new Sabbath our Lord was alive and gave us proofs of his life. He also gave us freedom from sin.–Compare John 20:19-20.

All this began on the first day of the Jewish week, what the Gentiles call “Sunday.”

From this the Catholic Church and most all Protestants observe Sunday, not as the Sabbath of the Mosaic Law–a Sabbath where no one comes to life–but the Sabbath of our Lord, a Sabbath where there is new life.–Matthew 12:18.

Did you read this pablope?

Eze 20:11 And I gave them my statutes, and shewed them my judgments, which [if] a man do, he shall even live in them.
Eze 20:12 Moreover also I gave them my sabbaths, to be a sign between me and them, that they might know that I [am] the LORD that sanctify them.

Are you saying that the Lord no longer uses the Sabbath as a “sign between me and them, that they might know that I [am] the LORD that sanctify them”. Are you saying that the Sabbath day was changed? If so were can I find this change?

Psalm 89:34
My covenant will I not break, nor alter the thing that is gone out of my lips.

 

[DelsonJacobs]

My authority comes from the word of God. There is not a shred of evidence that God has in any way changed the Sabbath because of Jesus rising on the first day. In fact we can and I do say that Jesus confirmed the Sabbath day by resting in the grave. I would like to know what you mean by the “Old Covenant”.

Catholics do not base their religion on what is written in the Mosaic Law.

Your beliefs are based on a book. Our religion is not based on a book but on a Person, Jesus Christ, the Word of God incarnate.

You say “my authority comes from.” We do not have authority that comes from us. Our authority is a Person, again Christ.

The book, known as the Bible, is based on our religion which is a reflection of our faith. But it cannot be read alone (anyone who reads a reflection will get things backward, will they not?).

So that is why we can agree that we disagree.

Your way is that a written work is the basis for your faith. But our religion dates back to the days before Christ inspired us to write down the Scriptures. We walked and talked with Jesus, not just read about him. He literally founded our Church.

If you believe that this written work is such an authority, read this work for yourself about our way to life. It is not just what you find written. In fact you can be saved without what is written, for Jesus declares: “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me,” not ‘no one comes to the Father except through what is written.’–John 14:6.

So it is okay with us for you to believe what you do. We have more than a written authority to base our faith on. Our faith and teachings come from Jesus.

 

[Remnant1]

Catholics do not base their religion on what is written in the Mosaic Law.

So Catholics don’t believe in the ten commandments and are free to sin? correct?
1Jn.3
Whosoever committeth sin transgresseth also the law: for sin is the transgression of the law.

Your beliefs are based on a book. Our religion is not based on a book but on a Person, Jesus Christ, the Word of God incarnate.

The person Jesus Christ is manifest in His word,the bible.
Jn.5
39 Search the scriptures; for in them ye think ye have eternal life: and they are they which testify of me.

You say “my authority comes from.” We do not have authority that comes from us. Our authority is a Person, again Christ.

If you are going to twist my words you should not include “comes from”. What I said was
“My authority comes from the word of God.”, not from myself.

The book, known as the Bible, is based on our religion which is a reflection of our faith. But it cannot be read alone (anyone who reads a reflection will get things backward, will they not?).

I didn’t think there were any Catholics around when the old testament was written. What do we have to read with it?

So that is why we can agree that we disagree.

I agree.

Your way is that a written work is the basis for your faith.

That written work was inspired by and written about God’s plan manifest in His son Jesus.

But our religion dates back to the days before Christ inspired us to write down the Scriptures. We walked and talked with Jesus, not just read about him. He literally founded our Church.

You must be really old.

If you believe that this written work is such an authority, read this work for yourself about our way to life. It is not just what you find written. In fact you can be saved without what is written, for Jesus declares: “I am the way and the truth and the life. No one comes to the Father except through me,” not ‘no one comes to the Father except through what is written.’–John 14:6.

How would you know this if it was not written down?

So it is okay with us for you to believe what you do. We have more than a written authority to base our faith on. Our faith and teachings come from Jesus.

And that is found someplace other than the bible?

God is love
Remnant1

 

[kja]

thankyou to all for your responses but I didnt want to turn this into a debate about the sabbath verses sunday as this issue is already settled in my mind and I know the issue is already settled in your mind. I left another forum called carm because of the disgusting behaviour particularly by protestants towards catholics. I publicly voiced my disgust of this behaviour by protestants on the catholic forum on carm and received the same treatment for it. I am hoping this forum will be a breath of fresh air for me. I simply wanted to know if the church had any written documentation to support the illedged change of the weekly cycle and if it was important to catholics that they observe the same sunday as the first century.
Your brother in Christ Kevin

 

[kja]

Could you be more specific and provide sources?

try googling the words Hillel fourth century calendar.

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