The Real Presence and Anthropology

[Immotus]

Not too long ago, whilst conversing on the Eucharist, an acquaintance of mine (whom is herself a lecturer in Anthropology) mentioned that the idea of consuming someone and thereby ritually having part in them is very ancient and very common in its occurrence - especially in what she called witchcraft. There was no argument presented here explicitly, but I think it was implied that the Christian idea of receiving Christ in the Eucharist is just another manifestation of this age old component of general human witchcraft and superstition. Thus, there is implied that it carries no more water than the other ritual consumptions… I would very much like to hear some responses.

 

[Seekingthetruth]

There’s something I always like to use in cases like this “if you’re objection/argument can be easily refuted by saying so what, it’s not a good objection”

There may have been ancient cultures that practiced cannibalism in an attempt to gain their opponents power or whatever. So what? How would that make christianity any less true? There would be no reason a group of Jews would begin that practice, especially when it was explicitly forbade.

 

[Camehome4john6]

Christ’s sacrificial death and the Last Supper were foreshadowed in the Old Testament in the Passover meal. The lamb had to die. The lamb had to be eaten. The Eucharist is a participation in the mystery of that sacrifice. It has nothing to do with having the person a part of them through ingestion. Christ never said eat my flesh and I’ll always be a part of you physically.

 

[Immotus]

Thank you for the reply, it is greatly appreciated. I myself felt as though (should an argument have been made by the young lady in question) it would have been guilty of the genetic fallacy. Nonetheless, for some odd reason, once a tenet of Christian faith is tied (even remotely) to a precursor which is explicitly pagan there is some natural repulsion, some innate distrust that springs up… and this I believe is quite effectively met with your “so what?”. So you have my thanks.

 

[Immotus]

Very useful observation, many thanks.

 

[Seekingthetruth]

Christ’s sacrificial death and the Last Supper were foreshadowed in the Old Testament in the Passover meal. The lamb had to die. The lamb had to be eaten.

Exactly! I think it was Augustine who said “Novum Testamentum in Vetere latet, Vetus Testamentum in Novo patet” and i think that is made clear here!

 

[Margaret_Ann]

St. Justin Martyr and the early Catholic apologists hashed this out when Romans accused them of cannibalism.

 

[Seekingthetruth]

St. Justin Martyr and the early Catholic apologists hashed this out when Romans accused them of cannibalism.

And what skeptics don’t understand is there is no objection that’s hasn’t already been addressed ad nauseam over the past 2000 years

 

[Gorgias]

an acquaintance of mine (whom is herself a lecturer in Anthropology) mentioned that the idea of consuming someone and thereby ritually having part in them is very ancient and very common in its occurrence - especially in what she called witchcraft .

Except that this is a definition of literally eating physical flesh – that is, ‘cannibalism’ – and this is not what the Eucharist is nor what the Church practices.

 

[MCA]

I would say no catholic or lutheran would say they are eating Jesus, but by eating the accidents which have the substance changed they are PARTAKING (that is important word not the word eating) in the divine nature. Eating is just the method to partake in his nature.

Plus even tho my pesonal view of the real presence is reformed, I would say that no catholic would say the substance of the accidents are the flesh and Blood of Jesus of Nazareth, but The FLESH AND BLOOD OF THE RISEN JESUS.

Question would come: What about the Last Supper? As Tim Staples said, God had the power to make it present the future.

It makes a big difference because his body is not human like adam or human like us but glorified via the ressurrection.

 

[irenaeuslyons]

As I recall, Jesus says several times that we must eat (“phago”) his flesh to gain eternal life (which literally means “to chew”). When the Jews further question and doubt his teaching, Jesus uses an even more severe verb (“trogo”) which literally means “to gnaw or crunch".

I take him at his word.