The reality of healing crystals

[anon91549587]

If quartz has a piezo electric effect when compressed. Does this in any way mean the other crystals can produce a form of energy?

 

[Hedgehog1]

Yesterday the people talking on this post have established that healing through crystals wasn’t actually the crystals but its YOU thats actually doing it, and it’s the placebo effect. The debate now isn’t about the supernatural ability of healing stones but the reconsideration of how we view the placebo effect. I read a study where they found out that the placebo effect released endorphins and dopamine which relieves pain to an extent.

The placebo is your bodies natural response to expectation, and we use things like crystals to sort of have a physical reference to make it easier to expect something to happen. Anything can work, pizza, toilet paper, umbrella, etc. However the reason why its usually crystals is because there is already alot of material written down about them in detail and crystals themselves look pretty.

The debate isn’t whether rocks that have healing powers is according to the catholic faith morals but whether using crystals to harness your brains placebo effect like a “mind over matter” type thing to get positive results for dealing with pain or mental issues is according to catholic faith morals.

 

[blackforest]

As long as you believe that then the placebo should work, which isn’t a deception.

The placebo effect only works with deception. You have to believe it’s working - not try to convince yourself in that belief - in order for it to work.

I thought having awareness of the placebo effect doesn’t necessarily mean the placebo effect wouldn’t take place?

No, awareness of it would defeat the purpose. You can’t outsmart your own brain.

Honestly, this thread sounds more like a bout of self-justification than a genuine inquiry into Catholic teaching, (which we should take for granted opposes placing religious faith in geologic material).

 

[Hedgehog1]

Actually I’ve heard of people people that do outsmart their own brain through meditation. I’m not entirely sure how it works but I believe it’s something along the lines of knowing that if you expect something will happen without doubt, it will happen.

What exactly am I justifying? If you read the original post you would see that it says I quit all forms of new age practice and only have questions regarding it. Why does a discussion have to imply justification? Are we not allowed to talk about things?

 

[BartholomewB]

I’ve been trying to reply to everyone,

Seven hours later, still no reply to my question.

Do you have personal experience of having been cured of some sickness or injury by using crystals? Have you ever tried it? If so, with what results?

 

[blackforest]

What exactly am I justifying? If you read the original post you would see that it says I quit all forms of new age practice and only have questions regarding it. Why does a discussion have to imply justification? Are we not allowed to talk about things?

From your first post:

I am posting this to hopefully gain clarification of the catholic understanding of this.

You’ve heard from both Church teaching and science, and you’re arguing against both. If that’s not self-justification, I don’t know what is. I really don’t know what more would convince you.

 

[Sundiver]

Placebo is a natural ability the mind has, its like the “power of expectation” and “mind over matter”

Good point. I forgot about that. Placebo is used to study medicine.

something to peg to your imagination as a reference point to cause the expecting of the results you want therefore triggering the placebo effect.

Interesting. We do this in other ways besides medical.

This way is purely using the your minds natural ability and nothing to do with new age

This has been researched and studied. Some amazing results have been discovered.

 

[Sundiver]

Hedgehog1:

I’ve been trying to reply to everyone,

Seven hours later, still no reply to my question.

Do you have personal experience of having been cured of some sickness or injury by using crystals? Have you ever tried it? If so, with what results?

If anyone answers this question they might be flagged. However, I can understand that if you don’t have strong faith in the Church, you could wind up confused.

 

[BartholomewB]

However, I can understand that if you don’t have strong faith in the Church, you could wind up confused.

What is there to get confused about? It’s a request for factual information. Did you try it or didn’t you? And if so, did it do any good or didn’t it?

 

[Sundiver]

What is there to get confused about?

The confusion is brought about by the novelty, mystery, and false promise of the New Age movement. There are some who are fledgling in their faith and they could be enamored by the manifestations involving the paranormal. I’m not advocating the New Age movement or that you should go out searching for the manifestation of a specter, or gods and goddesses. I am categorizing and defining what is known in science. There is research that presents facts. Looking at facts can be disturbing to some and could destabilize their faith. With every post on CAF I try to keep that in mind. So, it is a narrow walk.

Did you try it or didn’t you?

I would be completely at ease to talk about this in a forum. Here it is a challenge. If you want to talk about it you might have to start a private blog or go to another forum involving scientific debate.

 

[BartholomewB]

If you don’t want to post an answer here on the open thread, you can send me a PM. It’s basically just answering Yes or No to two questions, though a possible noncommittal answer might be something like “It was a long time ago and I don’t remember.” In any case, I was addressing the question to the OP, @Hedgehog1.

It’s no harder than answering a similar question such as, for instance, “Did you ever wear bifocal glasses?” or “Did you ever take an aspirin for a headache?”

 

[Inquiry]

[

So my question now is, since placebos are a natural phenomenon, if using a fake pill to trigger the placebo effect isn’t wrong, what would be inherently wrong with using rocks?

With magic and alternative medicine the issue is not just what the treatment physically does but what it opens you up to.

Since crystal healing, as I understand it, is based on a presumed property of rocks and does not call on an outside power, there is not much danger of opening the door to a demon…

Except I don’t know enough about crystal healing to say for sure that’s how they are used. Good judgement is required. And this may just be bad luck on my part, but good judgement is not a trait I’ve seen in many people who buy into crystal healing.

 

[GraceJ]

If I understand correctly, this thread is about the use of crystals not in alternative healing, New Age stuff, but as possibly having undiscovered scientific effects. As well as the placebo effect.

On one hand, I doubt that crystals have a scientific healing effect that science has not uncovered- at least not physically. I can see great potential for people using crystals as objects on which to concentrate or otherwise deal with mental/emotional/psychological issues. For instance, someone with anxiety focusing on a crystal in order to calm down. At the same time, this sort of thing could also work with a more appropriate Catholic material such as saints medals, or other religious symbols.

 

[Hedgehog1]

I can see great potential for people using crystals as objects on which to concentrate or otherwise deal with mental/emotional/psychological issues. For instance, someone with anxiety focusing on a crystal in order to calm down. At the same time, this sort of thing could also work with a more appropriate Catholic material such as saints medals, or other religious symbols.

This is pretty much what I’m trying to say. But I think it’s crystals and not other things like toilet paper and pizza because crystals themsleves look pretty and have alot of information written down about them regarding certain properties.

I think saint medals and Christian symbolism can be the same thing, as they are spiritual symbols and we think of them as different than any other object or symbol.

 

[BartholomewB]

If I understand correctly, this thread is about the use of crystals not in alternative healing, New Age stuff, but as possibly having undiscovered scientific effects. As well as the placebo effect.

Yes, but I think it’s also about the straightforward question of whether they do any good, quite independently of the question of how it works. Do you know anyone who has ever tried this kind of cure, either to treat an injury or a sickness of some kind? If so, how effective was it?

 

[StudentMI]

Is anyone else reminded of the crystals in the time machine from Napoleon Dynamite?

 

[franklinstower]

i was a practicing crystal healer for a few years before i became Catholic and let all of that go.

you have said that you are not speaking of New Age beliefs on this topic but i am unaware of any teachings about the use of crystals that are not heavily backed by new age beliefs and it is 100% certain that esoteric energies and beings and a New Age world view are a part of the entire teaching around them.

i can see where you are coming from though about placebo and i have often wondered the same thing. i wonder what purpose Jesus had using his spit and clay making mud to help heal a mans eyes. i see that as Jesus using the placebo effect to help that man have faith.

lets say crystals are just rocks and they have no connection to the spiritual and they have no connection to undiscovered physical energies either. if that is the case then they seem to have a pretty strong placebo effect on human beings.

i gave up the use of them for a few reasons. one is that most other people who are into crystals are coming from a New Age belief system and that is dangerous. another reason is that once i divorced myself from wanting metaphysical energies other than God in my life i was no longer willing to risk using them and having even a little of that influence seep through into my life. i also tried just seeing them as a placebo but found that once i took that step then they were just rocks and held no value anymore.

 

[Hedgehog1]

i gave up the use of them for a few reasons. one is that most other people who are into crystals are coming from a New Age belief system and that is dangerous. another reason is that once i divorced myself from wanting metaphysical energies other than God in my life i was no longer willing to risk using them and having even a little of that influence seep through into my life. i also tried just seeing them as a placebo but found that once i took that step then they were just rocks and held no value anymore.

If they are just a placebo, then you know that they aren’t supernatural powers, just natural powers. So why do you see a harm or fear in using them?

 

[ReaderT]

i wonder what purpose Jesus had using his spit and clay making mud to help heal a mans eyes.

The same as when he formed Adam from clay - the Creator spat, made clay, and formed the man a new eye.