The resurrection of the body and my fear of God

[Robert_Sock]

Let me begin by saying that the belief that these bodies are evil is a heresy. I therefore view these bodies as good and evil, but mostly evil in this world. The notion that these bodies will be resurrected in the World To Come scares me a lot. I would rather evaporate into nothingness than to come back in this body (as it exists today). Heaven, I would like to believe, is different in that it will be our souls that are preserved and elevated. The good in these bodies is purely for salvation and elevation of the soul. I also realize that the teaching of the Catechism of the Catholic Church views the body and soul as a unity, but again, this causes me to fear God that “salvation” might require me to come back in a wretched body. The notion of the resurrection of the body causes me great depression in this world. Other than that, I think I’m a good Catholic, in communion with God.

 

[FaithJoy]

But, wouldn’t our bodies be “upgraded” into a heavenly body?

 

[Robert_Sock]

But, wouldn’t our bodies be “upgraded” into a heavenly body?

It would take a pretty big upgrade, to the degree that the body would differ considerably from the body as we know it today. For example, would we still have to **** after eating mutilated chicken or cow?

 

[The_Reginator]

We really have no idea of what our resurrected bodies will be like.

We do know, however, that our very souls will have to be purged of all that makes us impure before entering heaven.
I am confident that our Lord will ensure that our resurrected bodies will be suitable for our heavenly souls.

All I can do is profess and believe in the resurrection of the body. The what and the how I leave in God’s more than capable hands.
Is there any reason to doubt that He will provide the bodies we need? These are mysteries to look forward to. God’s love will take care of all.

Dominus vobiscum, Reg.

 

[GEddie]

It would take a pretty big upgrade, to the degree that the body would differ considerably from the body as we know it today. For example, would we still have to **** after eating mutilated chicken or cow?

Dear RS:

We will definitely have a body, that is recognizable as the Human Body of a human being who once lived in this world. Just like our LORD. He walked, spoke, ate, breathed, and was touched after HE came out of death. He was a human being, before and after death; NOT a spirit. We are not spirits and are not intended to be; we are human beings.

Our bodies are not “evil” in any sense. To a great extent, our body is innocent in life. Sin originates in our mind or heart and is executed by the will, only then with the aid of body’s limbs, senses etc; yet we blame our bodies for it, which had the least to do with it? Strange, ISTM.

We need our bodies to experience life: our eyes to see, our noses to smell, our skin to be touched, our limbs to move; even knowing requires a working head. Whatever existence was possible without a body would not be life at all and would certainly NOT be Heavenly!

Your specific question that I quoted has more to do with the mechanism of our bodyhood than with bodyhood itself. In this life, we are biochemical; to stay alive, our bodies must carry out chemical reactions that produce entropy, and so we need to expel that entropy form our beings. In a physical world that did not run on entropy, there would be no need for the **** or the other smelly or nasty aspects of the human body. There also would be no death.

Hard to imagine, but the existence of such a life is no stranger than someone awakening HIMself from being dead. And if you want to spend Eternity with someone who is alive, you are gonna need life yourself; and life is psyche plus BODY!

ICXC NIKA!

 

[Trishie]

Cheer up, Robert, our heavenly bodies will be beautiful. And your body certainly wont be “as it exists today”!

1 Corinthians 12:40 “There are also heavenly bodies and there are earthly bodies; but the splendor of the heavenly bodies is one kind, and the splendor of the earthly bodies is another”.

1 Corinthians 15:42-44 "It is the same way with the resurrection of the dead. Our earthly bodies are planted in the ground when we die, but they will be raised to live forever. Our bodies are buried in brokenness, but they will be raised in glory. They are buried in weakness, but they will be raised in strength. They are buried as natural human bodies, but they will be raised as spiritual bodies. For just as there are natural bodies, there are also spiritual bodies.

2 Corinthians 5:1-5 “For we know that when this earthly tent we live in is taken down (that is, when we die and leave this earthly body), we will have a house in heaven, an eternal body made for us by God himself and not by human hands. We grow weary in our present bodies, and we long to put on our heavenly bodies like new clothing. For we will put on heavenly bodies; we will not be spirits without bodies. 4 While we live in these earthly bodies, we groan and sigh, but it’s not that we want to die and get rid of these bodies that clothe us. Rather, we want to put on our new bodies so that these dying bodies will be swallowed up by life. God himself has prepared us for this, and as a guarantee he has given us his Holy Spirit.”

Robert you didn’t elaborate on the second part of your thread title, ‘fear of God’. I suspect that you may not very good at valuing yourself with the love with which God loved you into existence. Otherwise you mightn’t be somewhat fearful of God. I think perhaps you’re rather hard on yourself sometimes. If I were there I’d be busy arguing you out of that! My personal impulse when people indicate stuff like that is to say, God willing and if possible, I’ll be there somewhere near Jesus when you die, smiling at you and holding out my hand to you as a sister in the Lord. God willing, it’s possible I guess. But in any case, at the end when you face God who is so full of personal love for you, you’ll melt and wonder how on earth you could ever possibly have had the least “fear of God”
.

 

[Robert_Sock]

If I hear people correctly we should not take the “resurrection of the body” literally, but that we will have newly created, glorified bodies. This is comforting!

 

[Robert_Sock]

Trishie,

Thank you for the quotes from Corinthians! They were very helpful.

Unlike depression, anxiety and despair, which I do suffer from, I view the fear of God as something positive:

*The beginning of wisdom is fear of God

– Proverbs 1:7
*

 

[Katholish]

If I hear people correctly we should not take the “resurrection of the body” literally, but that we will have newly created, glorified bodies. This is comforting!

That is not what previous posters have implied, as it is contrary to what the Church teaches. We will receive the same bodies that we had while on earth, but those bodies will be purified and glorified. The example given was of Christ’s own body. He rose from the tomb in the same body that He died in, but it was glorified and had certain properties that normal earthly bodies do not (for instance, the ability to pass through walls). However, he also proved that even though the body seemed different in many ways, it was the same body. He eat and drank, but he also had Thomas put his hands in the wound in his side and had him place in finger in the nail marks.

We are not souls which inhabit a body. We are our bodies just as we are our souls, and neither part of man can fully exist without the other. Since the soul is the form of the body, the body is the way it is because of the soul. The body is not good and evil, but is intrinsically good. After the Sin of Adam and Eve, the body is inclined toward evil and is in a fallen condition, but this is also true of the soul.

Adam and Eve’s bodies were beautiful and good before the fall, and the bodies of the elect with regain that former beauty and even surpass it.

 

[Bill_Cherry]

All very interesting.

In Luke 20:34 Jesus tells us that we will not have bodies like we do on earth. (hence, ‘till death do us part’) All through out the new testament it is stated that we will not have physical bodies. "God is Spirit, and those that worship will worship Him in Spirit(and in truth). Is this like school spirit? I don’t think so. It is common knowledge that we are Body, soul, and spirit; in the image of God who is also Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

Jesus even tells us that unless a seed dies and falls to the ground it bears no fruit. And then there are the two women at the well, one is taken the other is left behind. " How will we know this?" He is asked." Where the Eagles gather there the bodies will lie"
Do you think that this means both women are dead and the ‘unsaved’ womans body is left alone? I think it means one woman died and one didn’t.

Our attachment to the flesh prevents us from realizing ourselves as separate from our bodies. And many of you may have even experience OBE’s, which would sound like the realm of the occult. But many Saints are reported to exhibit bi-location and even Paul talks about a man he knew who was taken into a level of heaven “whether in the body or out I do not know”. John in revelations talks about being in the spirit on the Lords day. Do you think he was just jumping around going “rah-rah-rah?” and how many visions and revelations are received in dreams?

We are going to have different bodies.Even after Jesus conquered death, when he was walking on the road the disciples did not recognize him. Mary did not recognize him at the sepulcher.All things will be returned to the original state before the fall and our glorified bodies will be different than the bodies we have now. And we may not recognize our own bodies. That is what I believe.

Interesting, but not important.

 

[chaunceygardner]

In Luke 20:34 Jesus tells us that we will not have bodies like we do on earth. (hence, ‘till death do us part’) All through out the new testament it is stated that we will not have physical bodies. "God is Spirit, and those that worship will worship Him in Spirit(and in truth)…

We are going to have different bodies.Even after Jesus conquered death, when he was walking on the road the disciples did not recognize him. Mary did not recognize him at the sepulcher.All things will be returned to the original state before the fall and our glorified bodies will be different than the bodies we have now. And we may not recognize our own bodies. That is what I believe.

I would agree; our essence in heaven will be nothing like our physical bodies. Those, like every thing else that is physical material, are of this earth and universe, and are finite and temporary. What we will be after we die is pure spirit, and the “body” we will have will neither resemble our current one (or past one, or future one) nor contain one atom of physical matter, nor be part of this universe. Based on the laws of physics (instituted by God?), to think otherwise is to put a limited, finite existence to “eternity” and “heaven”.

 

[Bill_Cherry]

I would agree;.

Thanks. But this does raise a question as to those who were taken into heaven while presumably alive. Such as Our Lady, and Enoch, Methuselah? I do not understand this. I believe it. But, I do not understand it.

 

[GEddie]

I would agree; our essence in heaven will be nothing like our physical bodies. Those, like every thing else that is physical material, are of this earth and universe, and are finite and temporary. What we will be after we die is pure spirit, and the “body” we will have will neither resemble our current one (or past one, or future one) nor contain one atom of physical matter, nor be part of this universe. Based on the laws of physics (instituted by God?), to think otherwise is to put a limited, finite existence to “eternity” and “heaven”.

No, we are not going to be spirits. We will remain human beings, as our LORD did. And like HIM, the design of our form will be in essence like the body we now know; just as Thomas was able to touch HIS hands and feet.

I agree that the material will be changed, as will the mechanism of life. But the idea that we are, or will become “spirits” (except potentially as a temporary punishment) is foreign to Scripture and to human nature. Body is not something we wear like clothing, body is intrinsic to who we are.

ICXC NIKA.

 

[Bill_Cherry]

I would agree; our essence in heaven will be nothing like our physical bodies. Those, like every thing else that is physical material, are of this earth and universe, and are finite and temporary. What we will be after we die is pure spirit, and the “body” we will have will neither resemble our current one (or past one, or future one) nor contain one atom of physical matter, nor be part of this universe. Based on the laws of physics (instituted by God?), to think otherwise is to put a limited, finite existence to “eternity” and “heaven”.

No, we are not going to be spirits. We will remain human beings, as our LORD did. And like HIM, the design of our form will be in essence like the body we now know; just as Thomas was able to touch HIS hands and feet.

I agree that the material will be changed, as will the mechanism of life. But the idea that we are, or will become “spirits” (except potentially as a temporary punishment) is foreign to Scripture and to human nature. Body is not something we wear like clothing, body is intrinsic to who we are.

ICXC NIKA.

A mystery for sure. I THINK, not entirely SURE, but it may be sort of intra-dimensional. (Science and the Church are not in conflict). Science has shown at least 11 dimensions. It is all so very interesting. But what about those who were assumed into heaven,uh, ‘prematurely’, so to speak? Not that it is important as an article of faith.

 

[GEddie]

All very interesting.

In Luke 20:34 Jesus tells us that we will not have bodies like we do on earth. (hence, ‘till death do us part’)

Strange that you believe that, given that HE resumed HIS own Human Body when HE emerged from death!

All through out the new testament it is stated that we will not have physical bodies.

No, it is not. It is said that HE will raise us up. Now what is raised? The same that was laid down. The HUMAN BODY.

"God is Spirit, and those that worship will worship Him in Spirit(and in truth). Is this like school spirit? I don’t think so. It is common knowledge that we are Body, soul, and spirit; in the image of God who is also Father, Son and Holy Spirit.

No, it is not school spirit; and no, it is not debodied “human spirits,” either. HE is not referring to death in this verse at all. The reference is to the Holy Spirit! There is no temple in Old Jerusalem any more, nor do we go to the mountain in Samaria; rather, we serve GOD in our cities, and in our bodies, via the Holy Spirit.

Jesus even tells us that unless a seed dies and falls to the ground it bears no fruit.

This is not about human death, unless maybe our LORD’s Himself. Human death is in itself not fruitful, it is hideous and wasteful. But when our LORD submitted to it, HE breathed forth the Holy Spirit.

And then there are the two women at the well, one is taken the other is left behind. " How will we know this?" He is asked." Where the Eagles gather there the bodies will lie"
Do you think that this means both women are dead and the ‘unsaved’ womans body is left alone?

I have never heard that explanation given for this verse.
Dead bodies are not taken into Heaven, because they are corrupt.

I think it means one woman died and one didn’t.

Our attachment to the flesh prevents us from realizing ourselves as separate from our bodies.

Because we are made to be attached to our flesh, just like our head to our shoulders; and we are NOT separate from our bodies. If we ever experienced that, it would be as a temporary punishment. We do not have bodies; we are our bodies.

And many of you may have even experience OBE’s, which would sound like the realm of the occult. But many Saints are reported to exhibit bi-location and even Paul talks about a man he knew who was taken into a level of heaven “whether in the body or out I do not know”.

He wasn’t sure if he was in his body. But if he were without a body, he would have known it at once; it would have been “Why can’t I see, why can’t I move, why don’t I remember anything, what is happening to me!!!”

He may have been out of body; but the fact he “heard” anything at all proves he had a body during the experience. Ears are part of our body, as is our head’s auditory memory.

John in revelations talks about being in the spirit on the Lords day. Do you think he was just jumping around going “rah-rah-rah?” and how many visions and revelations are received in dreams?

Well, God does use dreams for this purpose. Consider the wise men who were warned in dreams not to go back to King Herod.

And no, people did not go rah-rah in the year 100; they did, however, experience the Holy Spirit!

We are going to have different bodies.Even after Jesus conquered death, when he was walking on the road the disciples did not recognize him. Mary did not recognize him at the sepulcher.All things will be returned to the original state before the fall and our glorified bodies will be different than the bodies we have now. And we may not recognize our own bodies. That is what I believe.

Will there be mirrors in Eternity? will we be looking at our own bodies? Maybe not. But we will “recognize” our bodies, because they will be perfectly fitted around our own minds, so as to be an extension of our mind: we will think with our bodies and move with our minds. And,of course, with no possibility of separation or death.

Interesting, but not important.

ICXC NIKA!

 

[Bill_Cherry]

GEddie
interesting. Thank you.

 

[Robert_Sock]

I don’t want to be resurrected in this body. I want my soul to go to Heaven and cleave to God. This is what our Jewish brothers and sisters believe eventually happens (Chabad).

So too, I’m leaving open the option that our souls will someday cleave to God, without a body.

 

[GEddie]

I don’t want to be resurrected in this body. I want my soul to go to Heaven and cleave to God. This is what our Jewish brothers and sisters believe eventually happens (Chabad).

So too, I’m leaving open the option that our souls will someday cleave to God, without a body.

Not me. No, no, 10 E12 times, no!!!

I want to see our LORD; for that, I will need my eyes.

I want to embrace HIM, for that, I need my arms.

I want to converse with HIM, for that, I need my voice, and my hearing.

I want to FEEL HIS touch and be embraced by HIM and breathe with HIM. For that I need my skin, my form, my BODY.

I want to know HIM. For that, I will still need my head.

You can look forward to being a bodiless wisp of nothing, formless, unseeing and unknowing, if you choose. Such a prospect is totally hideous for me. The bodily Resurrection is what makes life–everlasting desirable.

ICXC NIKA.

 

[The_Reginator]

The resurrection of the body helps illustrate how incredibly important we are to our Creator.

Just think of this.
God created the entire universe. All the material He required for the ‘big bang’ had to be made by him. Time itself did not exist until He created it.
Out of all this enormous cosmos, when He created Man He created us in His own image. He breathed His very Spirit into us.
GOD HIMSELF took a human body – the Holy Ghost impregnated His chosen Woman in order to become Man.
The second person of the Holy Trinity taught us as a Man. He suffered for us as a Man. He died for us as a Man.
But that 's not all.
NOW HE SITS AT THE FATHER’S RIGHT HAND WITH HIS RISEN (human) BODY.

To my mind, as my kids would say, THAT’S AWESOME!!!

If a human body is good enough for Jesus, it’s good enough for me!!

Just imagine that. Christ Himself has His resurrected body!!!

 

[Robert_Sock]

Not me. No, no, 10 E12 times, no!!!

I want to see our LORD; for that, I will need my eyes.

I want to embrace HIM, for that, I need my arms.

I want to converse with HIM, for that, I need my voice, and my hearing.

I want to FEEL HIS touch and be embraced by HIM and breathe with HIM. For that I need my skin, my form, my BODY.

I want to know HIM. For that, I will still need my head.

You can look forward to being a bodiless wisp of nothing, formless, unseeing and unknowing, if you choose. Such a prospect is totally hideous for me. The bodily Resurrection is what makes life–everlasting desirable.

ICXC NIKA.

Thank you for your responses! I feel better about things. Whatever will be will be.