The Risen Jesus

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Easter_Joey

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  1. In the Mass we participate in the re-presentation of Christ’s sacrifice on the cross, which is made present to us by the Eucharist.
  2. The sacrifice which merits our redemption is Jesus’ life. The cross is the place where the sacrifice is complete and so the Father accepts the Son’s offering, establishing an everlasting covenant.
  3. In the Eucharist, we receive the glorified and risen Jesus.
So does this mean in his risen state Jesus eternally re-presents the sacrifice he offered on the cross? Like just by the fact of his existence as Risen Lord, for instance he’s just walking on the beach in Galilee, re-presents the sacrifice?

Does this make sense and sound right, or am i off base and someone please correct my mistake! 🙂
 
Does it help to understand that the Mass is outside of time?
So, yes, we are at Calvary during the Sacrifice of the Mass.
You seem to have a pretty good grasp of the mystery which is best entered into rather than explained. We are being saved each and every time the Mass is celebrated anywhere on earth until the end of time.
Calvary would have no meaning without the Resurrection.
 
And just to add it is Christ’s risen and glorified body that we receive. The Mass crosses all sorts of time boundaries. We are present:

At the Last Supper
At the crucifixion
At the Resurrection

And people don’t want to go to Mass. WOW! :eek:
 
DebChris said:
Does it help to understand that the Mass is outside of time?
So, yes, we are at Calvary during the Sacrifice of the Mass.
You seem to have a pretty good grasp of the mystery which is best entered into rather than explained. We are being saved each and every time the Mass is celebrated anywhere on earth until the end of time.
Calvary would have no meaning without the Resurrection.
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Easter_Joey said:
So does this mean in his risen state Jesus eternally re-presents the sacrifice he offered on the cross?
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No. Jesus presented himself as sacrifice ONCE for all (Hebrews 10:10).

In the Catholic view, this means that the sacrifice of Christ is eternal, and may be re-presented by Our Lord’s priests (whose duty is mainly to offer sacrifice). Thus, we may ALL partake of this sacrifice - not as some theatrical recreation of an ancient historic event, but something that actually happens in real-time in our presence. It is something real, not merely a symbol or a ritual.

Jesus does not re-present himself. Our Catholic priests, acting in his place, do this (by his order, and with his authority - “Do this in commemoration of me”).

It is a subtle, but important difference.
 
DavidFilmer said:
No. Jesus presented himself as sacrifice ONCE for all (Hebrews 10:10).

In the Catholic view, this means that the sacrifice of Christ is eternal, and may be re-presented by Our Lord’s priests (whose duty is mainly to offer sacrifice). Thus, we may ALL partake of this sacrifice - not as some theatrical recreation of an ancient historic event, but something that actually happens in real-time in our presence. It is something real, not merely a symbol or a ritual.

Jesus does not re-present himself. Our Catholic priests, acting in his place, do this (by his order, and with his authority - “Do this in commemoration of me”).

It is a subtle, but important difference.
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I’m not following you. The priests re-present the sacrifice because they act “in the person of Christ”. So it is really Jesus (who is risen) working through them. I don’t get your explanation as to how my post #1 denies Jesus was sacrificed once and for all.:confused:
 
Easter_Joey said:
I’m not following you. The priests re-present the sacrifice because they act “in the person of Christ”.
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Let’s see if I can avoid making a heretic of myself…

It’s the same sacrifice. The sacrifice of Jesus is eternal, and for everyone. The sacrifice itself has already been made and will never be made again.

The priest does not act in the person of Christ in making the sacrifice (the priest is not put on the Cross, as Jesus was).

The priest acts in the person of Christ by making the Body and Blood present and giving them to us, just as Jesus gave Eucharist to the Apostles at the Last Supper.

What Jesus did at the Last Supper is what the priest does in the Mass. What Jesus did the next day, he did alone, and the priest doesn’t do that.
 
Easter_Joey said:
  1. In the Mass we participate in the re-presentation of Christ’s sacrifice on the cross, which is made present to us by the Eucharist.
  2. The sacrifice which merits our redemption is Jesus’ life. The cross is the place where the sacrifice is complete and so the Father accepts the Son’s offering, establishing an everlasting covenant.
  3. In the Eucharist, we receive the glorified and risen Jesus.
So does this mean in his risen state Jesus eternally re-presents the sacrifice he offered on the cross? Like just by the fact of his existence as Risen Lord, for instance he’s just walking on the beach in Galilee, re-presents the sacrifice?

Does this make sense and sound right, or am i off base and someone please correct my mistake! 🙂
Click to expand...
I think I understand what you’re getting at, and if I’m right, then the answer to your question is yes.

Jesus is indivisible, and by virtue of the Hypostatic Union, His resurrected body and His pre-resurrected body exist at once, eternally, and always have. This is revealed in the Transfiguration, wherein the boundaries of time are, for a moment, lessened.

We receive in the Eucharist, Christ, whole and indivisible. This sacrifice that He offers to the Father, He offers always, eternally. So yes, while He walked along the beach in Galilee, He offers this One Sacrifice.
 
DavidFilmer said:
Let’s see if I can avoid making a heretic of myself…

It’s the same sacrifice. The sacrifice of Jesus is eternal, and for everyone. The sacrifice itself has already been made and will never be made again.

The priest does not act in the person of Christ in making the sacrifice (the priest is not put on the Cross, as Jesus was).

The priest acts in the person of Christ by making the Body and Blood present and giving them to us, just as Jesus gave Eucharist to the Apostles at the Last Supper.

What Jesus did at the Last Supper is what the priest does in the Mass. What Jesus did the next day, he did alone, and the priest doesn’t do that.
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But the sacrifice of the Mass and the sacrifice of the Cross are the same sacrifice.

Garrigou-Lagrange I believe stated something about change being significant in the offering of a sacrifice. So in the Cross the change was abandoning his life in obedience to God, and in the Mass he becomes present to offer his same love under the appearance of bread and wine (the change being before transubstantiation his love wasn’t offered under the appearance of that specific host).

So I suppose the change is what makes the same sacrifice present, otherwise it seems to me the Mass is no different from a Communion service.

A new theory I have is the sacrifice of the Cross is made present at the moment of the resurrection since it involves a significant change in the humanity of Jesus. The Mass is after all the memorial of the death and resurrection of Christ.

I’m a little confused. Thank God he understands my weakness
 
Easter_Joey said:
So does this mean in his risen state Jesus eternally re-presents the sacrifice he offered on the cross? Like just by the fact of his existence as Risen Lord, for instance he’s just walking on the beach in Galilee, re-presents the sacrifice?

Does this make sense and sound right, or am i off base and someone please correct my mistake! 🙂
Click to expand...
CcC 1689 says “In the Eucharist, the Church expresses her efficacious communion with the departed: offering to the Father in the Holy Spirit the sacrifice of the death and resurrection of Christ, she asks to purify his child of his sins and their consequences”. This identifies the resurrection with the sacrifice of the cross. BUt I think I’m wrong above suggesting Jesus eternally re-presents the sacrifice, since then the sacrifice of the Mass would be offered as long as the Eucharist exists, so it wouldn’t make much sense to say “The Mass is ended”. Also I read something by Pere Garrigou-Lagrange that makes my post above not sound right.
 
Easter_Joey said:
CcC 1689 says “In the Eucharist, the Church expresses her efficacious communion with the departed: offering to the Father in the Holy Spirit the sacrifice of the death and resurrection of Christ, she asks to purify his child of his sins and their consequences”. This identifies the resurrection with the sacrifice of the cross. BUt I think I’m wrong above suggesting Jesus eternally re-presents the sacrifice, since then the sacrifice of the Mass would be offered as long as the Eucharist exists, so it wouldn’t make much sense to say “The Mass is ended”. Also I read something by Pere Garrigou-Lagrange that makes my post above not sound right.
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You are not wrong since the Mass does indeed take place outside of time. What is “ended” is the celebration for that particular day, to include the Liturgy of the Word, the readings that we have heard. Mass comes from the Latin Missa, which means to be sent forth which is why the priest says, “Go to love and serve the Lord.” After Mass we are sent forth to reflect God’s grace. The Mass is not the end, but the beginning.
The priests of the O.T. stood day after day sacrificing for the forgiveness of sins, but their sacrifices were imperfect. The Sacrifice of the Cross was the one perfect and eternal sacrifice. It cannot be repeated.
 
DebChris said:
You are not wrong since the Mass does indeed take place outside of time. What is “ended” is the celebration for that particular day, to include the Liturgy of the Word, the readings that we have heard. Mass comes from the Latin Missa, which means to be sent forth which is why the priest says, “Go to love and serve the Lord.” After Mass we are sent forth to reflect God’s grace. The Mass is not the end, but the beginning.
The priests of the O.T. stood day after day sacrificing for the forgiveness of sins, but their sacrifices were imperfect. The Sacrifice of the Cross was the one perfect and eternal sacrifice. It cannot be repeated.
Click to expand...
I’ll just say it’s a mystery beyond my comprehension. 🙂
 
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