The same old stuff

[Nelka]

Discussing Jesus with an atheist the other day and he said, like others always seem to do, about the Catholic Church being rich and killing people in the past and such.

How is it best to combat these?

I said that a lot of the church was given as gifts and not stolen from people as he said.
And the Spanish inquisition and past leaders make it hard even though the atheists seem to forget Stalin and Mao.

I don’t want to be dumbfounded when I have these put to me.

It’s also annoying when they talk over you because they don’t want or like your answers.

How do you get on?

Thanks.

 

[JimR-OCDS]

First off, educate yourself about the History of the Catholic Church. Learn about the dirty laundry as well as the good things.

Then, don’t be afraid to admit to the bad things the Church did in the past.

Being open to the truth will be seen by an atheist as virtuous and will do more in getting him to listen than to throw up mental barriers against what you have to say.

Share your faith in Jesus Christ, first and foremost.

Don’t worry about the other stuff, which doesn’t do much to bring people over to Christ anyway.

More people are converted by seeing the love and compassion of Jesus Christ in a Catholic, than those who have all the right answers to defend the religion.

Always remember, their ignorance is their poverty. Treat them as poor people, not as enemies and you’ll go much further with them.

Jim

 

[franny50]

I think the church commited horrible atrocities in the past,especially with the crusades.Even St Francis of Assisi realized the unjustness of that war,as God told him to “Put down your sword”.But there are many good things about the catholic church,which has served on the mission field,ministered to the poor and sick,housed the orphan,and have taken care of the dying.

 

[Redbaron998]

Most such claims that the Church has been so bad in history are based off of strawmans and characectures rather than facts. An in depth study of history easily shows that despite some bad apples the Church easily claims the moral high ground.

A good places to start is:
7 lies about Catholic History by Diane Moczar

 

[puzzleannie]

same old answer
proof, please, for all allegations, with reliable sources, or there is simply no basis for intelligent discussion

 

[JimR-OCDS]

Most such claims that the Church has been so bad in history are based off of strawmans and characectures rather than facts. An in depth study of history easily shows that despite some bad apples the Church easily claims the moral high ground.

A good places to start is:
7 lies about Catholic History by Diane Moczar

Agreed, but the errors will take first place in the minds of unbelievers.
It’s best to confront the truth and teach without trying to whitewash it.

Papal wars led by Pope’s themselves were part of the dirty history of the Church.

Yes, the Black Legend’s were exaggerations, but real atrocities and injustices were carried out by Church leaders over the course of history.

Heck, in the time of St. Teresa of Avila and St. John of the Cross in the middle of the 16th century, the Bible was only permitted to be printed in Latin.

Also;

In 1559, Fernado Valdes, Supreme Inquisitor, published a list of forbidden books among which were included almost all books dealing with prayer; cherished spiritual books by the most renowned contemporary Spanish authors as well as translations from classic writers, St Borgia, St John of Avila, Lois of Granada, Osuna Tauler, Harphius, and Denis the Carthusian. From “The Collected Works of St. Teresa of Avila,” by Kieran Kavanaugh O.C.D. and Otilio Rodriguez O.C.D. Page 30

The Church grew and in that growth there were growing pains where men did some horrible things in the name of the Church.

It’s far better to accept what was done, and be sure we don’t repeat the mistakes.

Even Pope John Paul II made apologies for the sins members of the Catholic Church did over the course of history.

He wasn’t just trying to be politically correct.

One of my favorite books on Church history is;

“The Power and the Glory of the Catholic Church, a 2000 Year History” by H. W. Crocker, III

I saw him interviewed on EWTN’s “Book Mark.”

This is probably the most fascinating reading on history that I’ve ever experienced.

Jim

 

[PJM]

=Nelka;7815931]Discussing Jesus with an atheist the other day and he said, like others always seem to do, about the Catholic Church being rich and killing people in the past and such.

How is it best to combat these?

I said that a lot of the church was given as gifts and not stolen from people as he said.
And the Spanish inquisition and past leaders make it hard even though the atheists seem to forget Stalin and Mao.

I don’t want to be dumbfounded when I have these put to me.

It’s also annoying when they talk over you because they don’t want or like your answers.

How do you get on?

Thanks.

Ignorance is Contegious!

Try this: My dear friend in Christ: If you can be more specif; then perhaps I can be too? If I don’t know the answer; I’ll get it for you.

GB, Pat