The sin that cannot be forgiven

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Thankful10 said:
Reconciliation should be needed once in a person’s life time.
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Just as I thought: another anti-Catholic in not-very-good disguise. Pope-bashing. It’s the chic winter sport, I guess.

You won’t get much traction here, but go ahead and knock yourself out. Happy New Year.
 
God doesn’t want us to sin, but He knows our weakness and that we do sin… so in His mercy, He has provided us with the Sacrament of Reconciliation 🙂 who are we to argue with God? He knows that it takes a time/effort for a person to learn to not sin. Eventually, we’ll all be perfect, but this is a journey, not something that happens in an instant. Conversion is only the beginning.
 
Sailor_Kenshin said:
Anyone can pull Scripture out of context and point to it to say: “Look! My private revelations come from God!”

Alas, this is the danger found in Sola Scriptura: each man his own little church.
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You’re right. The Protestants have over 30,000 different churches (denominations)!!!

It’s mind-boggling.:eek:
 
Thankful10,

Are you claming that today, if a Christian deliberately sins after Baptism, they have no hope of forgiveness?

if so, why not start a thread on that, “can a Christian who sins be forgiven if said sin is done deliberately after they have been regenerated?”
 
Monica4316 said:
God doesn’t want us to sin, but He knows our weakness and that we do sin… so in His mercy, He has provided us with the Sacrament of Reconciliation 🙂 who are we to argue with God? He knows that it takes a time/effort for a person to learn to not sin. Eventually, we’ll all be perfect, but this is a journey, not something that happens in an instant. Conversion is only the beginning.
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Let me ask you something. How many Christians do you know of the live a sinless life? How long does one stay a baby Christian? God killed Ananias and Sapphira for lying. If they were still baby Christian then they would have been forgiven. Christianity was still in its early stage so Ananias and Sapphira did not have to long to mature.

Why do you think if takes so long for Christians today to mature?
 
yoopersenior said:
You’re right. The Protestants have over 30,000 different churches (denominations)!!!

It’s mind-boggling.:eek:
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**Read what Paul had to say, and this is why you don’t understand and it is so mind-boggling. It is spiritual and if one is spiritual it becomes understandable. **

**(1 Corinthians 2:716)”The hidden wisdom of God which we teach in our mysteries is the wisdom that God predestined to be for our glory before the ages began. It is a wisdom that none of the masters of this age have ever known, or they would not have crucified the Lord of Glory, **we teach what scripture called the things that no eye has seen and no ear has heard, things beyond the mind ****of man,/B] all that God has prepared for those who love him.These are the very things that God has revealed to us through the Spirit, for the Spirit reaches the depths of everything, even the depths of God After all, the depths of a man can only be known by his own spirit, not by any other man, and in the same way the depths of God can only be known by the Spirit of God. Now instead of the spirit of the world, we have received the Spirit that comes from God, to teach us to understand the gifts that he has given us. Therefore we teach, not in the way in which philosophy is taught, but in the way that the Spirit teaches us: we teach spiritual things spiritually. An unspiritual person is one who does not accept anything of the Spirit of God: he sees it all as nonsense; it is beyond his understanding because it can only be understood by means of the Spirit. A spiritual man, on the other hand, is able to judge the value of everything, and his own value is not to be judged by other men. As scripture says;’ who can know the mind of the Lord, so who can teach him?’ But we are those who have the mind of Christ.”
 
LionHeart777 said:
Thankful10,

Are you claming that today, if a Christian deliberately sins after Baptism, they have no hope of forgiveness?

if so, why not start a thread on that, “can a Christian who sins be forgiven if said sin is done deliberately after they have been regenerated?”
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What I am saying is that a mature Christian who knows God will not sin. The following verse explains it very well. Now people who can’t seen to mature, have interpreted this verse to mean that it only means a person who continually sins. This verse does not say that, and that is the wrong understanding.

(Hebrews 10:26-31) “If, after we have been given knowledge of the truth, we should deliberately commit any sins, then there is no longer any sacrifice for them. There is left only the dreadful prospect of judgment and of the fiery wrath that is to devour your enemies. Anyone who disregards the Law of Moses is ruthlessly put to death on the word of two witnesses or three; and you may be sure that anyone who tramples on the Son of God, and who treats the blood of the covenant which sanctified him as if it were not holy, and who insults the Spirit of grace, will be condemned to a far severer punishment. We are all aware who it was that said: Vengeance is mine; I will vindicate his people. It is a dreadful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.”

(Acts 5:1-11) The Fraud of Ananias and Sapphira:
 
Thankful10 said:
What I am saying is that a mature Christian who knows God will not sin. The following verse explains it very well. Now people who can’t seen to mature, have interpreted this verse to mean that it only means a person who continually sins. This verse does not say that, and that is the wrong understanding.

(Hebrews 10:26-31) “If, after we have been given knowledge of the truth, we should deliberately commit any sins, then there is no longer any sacrifice for them. There is left only the dreadful prospect of judgment and of the fiery wrath that is to devour your enemies. Anyone who disregards the Law of Moses is ruthlessly put to death on the word of two witnesses or three; and you may be sure that anyone who tramples on the Son of God, and who treats the blood of the covenant which sanctified him as if it were not holy, and who insults the Spirit of grace, will be condemned to a far severer punishment. We are all aware who it was that said: Vengeance is mine; I will vindicate his people. It is a dreadful thing to fall into the hands of the living God.”

(Acts 5:1-11) The Fraud of Ananias and Sapphira:
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This means that if, he sins willingly, and keeps sinning so, there is no salvation for him.
 
This is only strengthening my faith in the Church Christ established here on earth.

God created us to know, serve and love him on earth, and to be happy with him in Heaven. But IF there is no forgiveness, this makes no sense.

God knows human weakness, and so does Jesus. There are many, many holes in the arguments posted here against Catholic teachings, not the least of which is that they have little logic and less common sense.
 
Sailor_Kenshin said:
Holy Mother Church teaches forgiveness is possible EVEN for mortal sin.
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I believe Holy Mother the Church is wrong then and so does one of her saints.

The following is a letter by Saint. Maximus the Confessor and it explains in a very unique way what I have been saying, that people who know God do not sin.

The manner of birth from God within us is two-fold: the one bestows the grace of adoption, which is entirely present in potency in those who are born of God; the other introduces, wholly by active exertion, that grace which deliberately reorients the entire free choice of the one being born of God toward the God who gives birth. The first bears the grace, present in potency through faith alone; but the second, beyond, also engenders in the knower the sublimely divine likeness of the One known, that likeness being effected precisely through knowledge. Therefore the first manner of birth is observed in some because their will, not yet fully detached from its propensity to the flesh, has yet to be wholly endowed with the Spirit by participation in the divine mysteries that are made known through active endeavor. The inclination to sin does not disappear as long as they will it. For the Spirit does not give birth to an unwilling will, but converts the willing will toward deification. (So a person doesn’t stop sinning just because they will not to sin.) Whoever has participated in this deification through cognizance experience is incapable of reverting from right discernment in truth, once he has achieved this in action, to something else besides, which only pretends to be that same discernment. (Once a person comes to know God, through the Holy Spirit, they are incapable of reverting to their sinful ways.) It is like the eye, which, once it has looked upon the sun, cannot mistake it for the moon or any of the other stars in the heavens. With those undergoing the (second mode of) birth, the Holy Spirit takes the whole of their free choice and translates it completely from earth to heaven, and, through the true knowledge acquired by exertion, transfigures the mind with the blessed light rays of our God and Father, such that the mind is deemed another “God,” insofar as in its habitude if experiences, by grace, that which God himself does not experience but “is” in his very essence. With those undergoing this second mode of baptism, their free choice clearly becomes sinless in virtue and knowledge, as they are unable to negate what they have actively discerned through experience. So even if we have the Spirit of adoption, who is himself the Seed for enduring those begotten (through baptism) with the likeness of the Sower, but do not present him with a will cleansed of any inclination or disposition to something else, we therefore, even after being born of water and Spirit (Jn 3:5), willingly sin. But were we to prepare our will with knowledge to receive the operation of these agents-water and Spirit, I mean-then the mystical water would, through our practical life, cleanse our conscience, and the life-giving Spirit would bring about unchanging perfection of the good in us through knowledge acquired in experience. Precisely for that reason he leaves, to each of us who are still able to sin, the sheer desire to surrender our whole selves willing to the Spirit.

St. Maximus the Confessor
 
Where specifically does St. Maximus declare that one cannot be forgiven of their sin, if done deliberately?
 
Thankful10 said:
Did you read:St. Maximus the Confessor ???
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You submit yourself to the laws of whatever land in which you reside. You did not write the laws, and may not understand them, but you rely on judges and others learned in the law to interpret them and carry them out.

Yet for the most crucial law of all, you thumb your nose at authority.
 
Exodus20:7

You shall not take the name of the Lord, your God , in vain. For the Lord will not leave unpunished him who takes His name in vain.
 
LionHeart777 said:
Where specifically does St. Maximus declare that one cannot be forgiven of their sin, if done deliberately?
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He did not need to address the issue of what happens to those who know God and yet deliberately commit sin, because the way he understood it a person who knows God will never deliberately sin, so it was not an issue with him. Most of the Bible writers were not quite so sure as he was. Maybe for good reason, they were closer to what had happened to Ananias, and his wife Sapphira. Now John may have been just as sure. (1 John 3: 3 - 9) “Surely everyone who entertains this hope must purify himself, must try to be as pure as Christ. Any one who sins at all breaks the law, because to sin is to break the law. Now you know that **He appeared in order to abolish sin, and that in Him there is no sin; anyone who lives in God does not sin, and anyone who sins has never seen Him or known Him. ** My children do not let anyone lead you astray; to live a holy life is to be holy just as He is holy; to lead a sinful life is to belong to the Devil, since the Devil was a sinner from the beginning. It was to undo all that the Devil has done that the Son of God appeared. No one who has been begotten by God sins: because God’s seed remains inside him, he cannot sin when he has been begotten by God.”
 
rdscheirer said:
Exodus20:7

You shall not take the name of the Lord, your God , in vain. For the Lord will not leave unpunished him who takes His name in vain.
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Does this commandment still hold true today, or has it been thrown out? I ask this because I notice that in some novels written by an American Irish Catholic priest, and in some plays performed at Catholic schools, there appears to be a violation of this rule.
 
Sailor_Kenshin said:
You submit yourself to the laws of whatever land in which you reside. You did not write the laws, and may not understand them, but you rely on judges and others learned in the law to interpret them and carry them out.

Yet for the most crucial law of all, you thumb your nose at authority.
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(1Timothy 1:8-11) “We know, of course, that the Law is good, but only provided it is treated like any law, in the understanding that laws are not framed for people who are good. On the contrary, they are for criminals and revolutionaries, for the irreligious and the wicked, for the sacrilegious and the irreverent; they are for people who kill their fathers or mothers and for murderers, for those who are immoral with women or with boys or with men, for liars and for perjurers and for everything else that is contrary to the sound teachings that goes with the Good News of the glory of the blessed God, the gospel that was entrusted to me.”
 
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