There’s no Pelagius or semi-Pelagius of Catholic theology; in fact, Augustine, a Catholic bishop and Doctor of Church whom wrote against the heretic himself and his writings shaped the Council of Orange and the Council of Trent:
See source
Please help me understand what you meant that “Jesus - he IS the Church” What exactly do you mean by that comment?
If anyone makes the assistance of grace depend on the humility or obedience of man and does not agree that it is a gift of grace itself that we are obedient and humble, he contradicts the Apostle who says, “What have you that you did not receive?” (1 Cor. 4:7), and, “But by the grace of God I am what I am” (1 Cor. 15:10). If anyone affirms that we can form any right opinion or make any right choice which relates to the salvation of eternal life, or that we can be saved by assent to the preaching of the gospel through our natural powers without the effectual work of the Holy Spirit, who makes all whom He calls gladly and willingly assent to and believe in the truth, he is led astray from the plain teaching of Scripture by exalting the natural ability of man, and does not understand the voice of God who says in the Gospel, “For apart from me you can do nothing” (John 15:5), and the word of the Apostle, “Not that we are competent of ourselves to claim anything as coming from us; our competence is from God” (2 Cor. 3:5).
This is great Adam, have you had a change of heart in your theology? I thought I remembered you saying that man does not have free will, in other words he cannot choose whether to cooperate with God or not.I think your post is completely solid and biblical, which glorifies God. I’ve met other grounded Catholics who think just like you. If you carry your belief to the final conclusion, I think we can both agree that our views can give God all the glory in what He has done for us in Christ Jesus. It’s all of grace brother to the praise of His glorious grace!
Soli Deo gloria (“glory to God alone”)
:knight1::hug1::harp:
You have been putting words in my mouth for months. You try to anticipate what I am going to say in light of your understanding of Calvinism. Yet, you will find that most of my words do not state what you think I would have posted. I think the problem you appear to have is a lack of understanding of Calvinism.
Why don’t you answer my question instead of attacking me personally? BTW…I have not been on these boards for months.
Again, this your perception but it is not so. There is no dichotomy imposing between Catholics and Jesus and it certainly isn’t the Church. Furthermore, many Catholics here like PRMerger, have told you about the Eucharist which is the Body, Soul, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Jesus Christ.I’ve been on Catholic Answers since August. It seems that most of the postings by Catholics are not about the person of Jesus Christ. Rather, the postings are about the Catholic Church.We are to proclaim Him, the head of the church. It seems many Catholics rather proclaim the body instead of the head.
Yes, really. If you look at Guan’s post, this Muslim is having a personal experience with the Lord.
Absolutely! Great grist for another thread.
No, she has the authority to proclaim what they mean by what is written.
Not at all! However, they can find the fullness of what He has brought to us there.
The question would be, on what basis did Jesus withdraw His promise to preserve them into truth,and what ailment afflicted the Holy Spirit that He was unable to prevent them from continuing this mistake. He seemed to have sufficient ability to demonstrate with Ananias and Sapphira…why did He fail after that? However, that discussion is also outside the scope of the thread.
God is able to work fullness anytime, anywhere. He has promised to do that through His Church.
Catholics have always affirmed that man cannot be saved by himself; hence grace is unmerited God-given gift that he cannot earn. Since this is a gift, man can freely chose to not accept it and turn away from God. As Augustine said, God created us without our consent and he will not save us without our consent.
This description seems to fit perfectly with the four seeds/soils parable.
You accuse me of putting words in your mouth and not understanding Calvinism. One thing is for certain; one of us does not understand Calvinism.
Hi Adam,
We don’t have to match exactly to rejoice in the Lord together as Christian siblings. Nor do I only fellowship who those who see things exactly like I do. I am a Calvinist but not a staunch die hard Calvinist because I know all Christians know in part. As I posted many times, Calvinism is not the gospel. When I follow Ryan’s posts in regards to “efficacious grace”, it is my understanding that he is saying that the elect of God are receiving “efficacious grace”, whereas the non-elect do not. Is efficacious grace required to preserve to the end? I have understood it to be an affirmative yes. From my own mindset, I can even accept this as a positive -negative schema of double-predestination. You don’t have to like it, but that’s what I see. I don’t see it like you do, that you have to be a Calvinist or a Catholic, or whatever. I see two humanities, those united to Adam and those united to the 2nd Adam (Christ) by the grace of God alone….to the praise of His glorious grace. If this kind of Catholic theology can get you to the same mindset as I see it, then we can rejoice together in what God has done for His chosen ones (vessels of His mercy). I believe in remnant theology which crosses denominational lines.
A Catholic Calvinist in one who leans more to a Thomist and Augustinian position in regards to predestination, election, free will, and view of grace than the other end of the spectrum within allowable Catholic views as being Catholic.
We are certainly in agreement that God has sovereignty over His creatures, and also that He makes structure in which we can be healthy, happy, and whole.
People can keep the 10 commandments, by grace through faith, now as before. It is possible to keep His commandments, and some did so. For those who fell short, there was built into them a system of atonement and forgiveness. It was not an eternal plan, but it enabled those under the Law to function under it, even after they violated it. God most certainly expected them to keep the Law, and when they failed, to make atonement through the priesthood.
I think you are just diverting the focus here, 2nd. My question is, what is it about God’s revelation to us so far in human history that leads you to beleive He would give us commandments that He does not expect us to follow? Are you really going to support that God did not expect the Jews to keep the Law.
With all due respect, my brother in the Lord, it was YOU I was "talking back " to, not God!
We certainly give God all the glory but he shares it with us! In other words, God allows us to participate in our salvation. I suspect we disagree on this aspect. Please correct me if I am wrong. To qualify this statement I would say, we cannot do anything without God. Man does not merit even a small portion of his salvation apart from grace. But God graciously enables us to merit salvation through cooperation. God initiates, enables, and sustains; we cooperate.I think your post is completely solid and biblical, which glorifies God. I’ve met other grounded Catholics who think just like you. If you carry your belief to the final conclusion, I think we can both agree that our views can give God all the glory in what He has done for us in Christ Jesus. It’s all of grace brother to the praise of His glorious grace!
Soli Deo gloria (“glory to God alone”)
Ryan is the missing link between historic Reformed Protestantism and Augustinian Catholicism. Rejoice that we can rejoice together in the Lord! We seem to be able to share in at least 3.5 solas of the Protestant Reformation.
Hi There,
