The Truth About Islam

[sidbrown]

Does this mean Islam is good?

Another thing is that Muslim women dress quite modestly. I was invited to attend a fashion show at a Catholic Jesuit college, and the Catholic women students were dressed quite scantily. Which is more pleasing to the Mother of God: Muslim women who dress modestly or those Catholic women at college fashion shows who dress with revealing and suggestive clothing?

 

[planten]

Another thing is that Muslim women dress quite modestly. I was invited to attend a fashion show at a Catholic Jesuit college, and the Catholic women students were dressed quite scantily. Which is more pleasing to the Mother of God: Muslim women who dress modestly or those Catholic women at college fashion shows who dress with revealing and suggestive clothing?

It was not always like this amongst the christians. The christian women also dressed modestly. Only recently, they have become more liberal in mny ways.

The Catholics are far better off than the protestants becuase they have a leader (Pope) who guides them. He is their spiritual head. It is important to give good food to the spirit otherwise it will die away before time.

It is not so in the case of protestants. Yet all are christians. And We love all christians.

 

[seraphime2008]

Another thing is that Muslim women dress quite modestly. I was invited to attend a fashion show at a Catholic Jesuit college, and the Catholic women students were dressed quite scantily. Which is more pleasing to the Mother of God: Muslim women who dress modestly or those Catholic women at college fashion shows who dress with revealing and suggestive clothing?

I refused the notion that by using Burqa, niqab or veil, muslim women dress modestly. I think in a multicultural background with women dress according to their cultural background (in Indonesia, some of the real local traditional costume for women is to dress with just sort of breast cloth which hasn’t become a dispute of revealing sexiness or of an intention to draw men’s attention, until all those Islamic claim of what’s considered to be morally accepted…! ) with differing ideas of what to be called modest or not, I refuse to say that a uniform basis of wearing veil is considered more morally accepted or modest…!

Christian women’s dress is more Revealing and suggesting? Of what?
Please, do not let your eye sin towards your whole body.

 

[sidbrown]

I refused the notion that by using Burqa, niqab or veil, muslim women dress modestly. I think in a multicultural background with women dress according to their cultural background (in Indonesia, some of the real local traditional costume for women is to dress with just sort of breast cloth which hasn’t become a dispute of revealing sexiness or of an intention to draw men’s attention, until all those Islamic claim of what’s considered to be morally accepted…! ) with differing ideas of what to be called modest or not, I refuse to say that a uniform basis of wearing veil is considered more morally accepted or modest…!

Christian women’s dress is more Revealing and suggesting? Of what?
Please, do not let your eye sin towards your whole body.

I don;t see how anyone can say that the sexy, skimpy, show a lot of skin, bikini type outfits that were worn at the Catholic fashion show that I attended were more pleasing to the Mother of God, than the modest Muslim dress.

 

[dzheremi]

Sidbrown,

Could it be more that this was a fashion show in (I’m assuming) a Western country where such things are considered “fashionable”, whereas standards of dress are different elsewhere? I doubt it really had much to do with Christian morality. I have met Christians from many places in the world, and you would be hard pressed to find a noticeable difference between, say, the dress of Ethiopian Orthodox women and that of their Muslim counterparts.

And, lest we fall for another one of Islam’s propaganda traps, let us not forget that Muslim women and men are just as fallible as the rest of us and in no way immune from immoral behavior as a result of their dress code, no matter how tightly they cling to it (many of whom do not at all, mind you). I am not for a second meaning to berate or belittle Muslim women, but in light of comments from the likes of Planten and now you, Sidbrown, I feel I should point out things like the increase in “vaginal rejuvenation” (hymen restoration) surgeries among Muslim women in Europe as proof that, religion aside (or included), people are people no matter where they are, where they come from, or what they wear.

 

[sidbrown]

Sidbrown,

Could it be more that this was a fashion show in (I’m assuming) a Western country where such things are considered “fashionable”, whereas standards of dress are different elsewhere? I doubt it really had much to do with Christian morality. I have met Christians from many places in the world, and you would be hard pressed to find a noticeable difference between, say, the dress of Ethiopian Orthodox women and that of their Muslim counterparts.

And, lest we fall for another one of Islam’s propaganda traps, let us not forget that Muslim women and men are just as fallible as the rest of us and in no way immune from immoral behavior as a result of their dress code, no matter how tightly they cling to it (many of whom do not at all, mind you). I am not for a second meaning to berate or belittle Muslim women, but in light of comments from the likes of Planten and now you, Sidbrown, I feel I should point out things like the increase in “vaginal rejuvenation” (hymen restoration) surgeries among Muslim women in Europe as proof that, religion aside (or included), people are people no matter where they are, where they come from, or what they wear.

I am only speaking here of modesty in dress. On this score, I believe that the way Muslim women dress is quite modest and would be pleasing to the Mother of God. I do not believe that the fashion show that I have seen at a Catholic college illustrates how a woman should dress modestly.

 

[elwill]

I’ve heard Muslims say Mohammad was created from light or is light ie “Nur”. But at the same time didn’t Mohammad say “I’m just a man”. Did Mohammad ever say that he was “light”?

MJ

it’s just metaphor .

 

[Young_Thinker]

it’s just metaphor .

It can be a little confusing, since al-Nur is one of Allah’s epithets( hence, the names* Abdul-Noor *and Amatunoor), while, at the same time, Maryam is called Mother of Light(Umme-Nur) by Muslims.

 

[Young_Thinker]

That is one reason why there should be more strong-willed parents in the world, and, to some extent, why countries like Great Britain and France should not have such(as it appears) open immigrational policies. In addition, It is scary that France is about 8%(roughly 5 million) Muslims while having hordes of nominal, apathetic Catholics, but I do not want to go into that argument.

 

[Young_Thinker]

It can be a little confusing, since al-Nur is one of Allah’s epithets( hence, the names* Abdul-Noor *and Amatunoor), while, at the same time, Maryam is called Mother of Light(Umme-Nur) by Muslims.

So, if Our Lady is Mother of Light in a Muslim’s eyes, what does that make Isa? He cannot be Light(remember that God is Light), can he?

 

[Contarini]

it’s just metaphor .

How do you know that?

Edwin

 

[dava4444]

I am only speaking here of modesty in dress. On this score, I believe that the way Muslim women dress is quite modest and would be pleasing to the Mother of God. I do not believe that the fashion show that I have seen at a Catholic college illustrates how a woman should dress modestly.

I agree, we are one step away from being protestant.

seriously, yes, we need our sisters to dress modestly, like our Muslim Cousins.

A mans nature is set by God, and it is compounded through tempting by Satan, as~in covetous and possibly even lust. with modest dress, men are more at peace with women.

peace in Christ

Dava

the ‘OLD’ Catholic way was good.

 

[dzheremi]

Someone’s hedging their bets, it seems. I hate to sound like a jerk, but this is the sort of mess that happens when you emphasize/make up out of whole cloth some sort of “connection” between Christians and Muslims just because Muslims claim to love Jesus, His mother, etc. You can’t be Christian and Muslim at the same time. You can’t be in union with Rome and not in union with Rome at the same time. What a sad, confused mess.

 

[planten]

I’ve heard Muslims say Mohammad was created from light or is light ie “Nur”. But at the same time didn’t Mohammad say “I’m just a man”. Did Mohammad ever say that he was “light”?

MJ

Elwill has rightly described that it is a metaphor. Muhammad was not made from light. He was just a man like any other man except that he was chosen by Allah to be his messenger. He received revelation from God.

He himself said or was told to say to all people: " Say, I am a person (Bashar) like all of you. It has been revelaed to me that you God is One God…"

Of course he had the light, that was spiritual matter, not physical. He was a mortal man like any one else. Being a messenger makes him suprior to many people, just like all other prophets of God.

Light in Arabic is of two types. One is called Dhiaa. That si the inherent light which is a part of something. It is in the body. It belongs to that body. (Such as in the Sun.)

The other light is the borrowed light or light in transit. That is called Noor. That is a light which doe snot belong to the body. It is a granted light or reflected light. It is some kind of illuminated light, such as in the Moon.

The Quran, at various places, describes the two types of light clearly as Dhiaa or as Noor. It says that Sun has Dhiaa or inherent light. The moon has borrowed light called Noor. Please see just one example in chapter 10 verse 5.

"It is He (Allah) who has made the Sun wth Dhiaa (i.e. internal, inherent shining bright light) and the Moon with Noor (the borrowed light, cool, soft, pleasing light) and proposed (ordained) stages for them (Sun and the Moon) so that you may keep accounts of years etc…" 10:5.

According to above Muhammad has the light which is given to him by Allah. He has not the inherent light. But he has the light sent to him from Allah. It illuminates him spiritually… For such an illumination, one needs a very clear pious heart. Allah will not send his light on any dirty heart. That light lands on the most truthful heart which has no hatred or envy or enmity, on such aheart which has no falsehood.

That was Muhammad. But it is not only for Muhammad. It applies to all persons, Tom Dick and Harry, if they purify themselves and keep themselves away from maladies, hatred, bias etc, and away from any false thinking, that person will receive the words of God. I am sure of that. Even today, same is the rule for all mankind, man or woman, to purify themselves and see the miracles coming from God. They will recelive messages from god and the good news.

 

[Maria65]

seriously, yes, we need our sisters to dress modestly, like our Muslim Cousins.

Actually, I dress modestly already, thank you. I have no intention of wearing a sack or a bedsheet.

 

[Loboto-Me]

Another thing is that Muslim women dress quite modestly. I was invited to attend a fashion show at a Catholic Jesuit college, and the Catholic women students were dressed quite scantily. Which is more pleasing to the Mother of God: Muslim women who dress modestly or those Catholic women at college fashion shows who dress with revealing and suggestive clothing?

Don’t be so quick with that statement, I’ve seen muslim women wearing their hijab and wearing skin tight jeans and loads of makeup. Modest indeed

As a catholic woman I dress modestly, wear makeup maybe once every year or 2 and have no concern with my hair.

 

[seraphime2008]

I am only speaking here of modesty in dress. On this score, I believe that the way Muslim women dress is quite modest and would be pleasing to the Mother of God. I do not believe that the fashion show that I have seen at a Catholic college illustrates how a woman should dress modestly.

Ok, since I live in a country with muslim majority, I’d tell you that (this is not a real accurate report by media, but lots of hearsay by muslim pilgrim to Mecca which made a rather convincing real story ) in SA, eventhough women dress cover most part of the body, there are still lots of raping informed, even targeting women visitors, who apparently have to be escorted everywhere during their visit. The “inherent” Arab mentality ( I and many Indonesians presume) of seeing woman as objects of desire doesn’t protect them of looking at women with lust, though they have made a law for women to cover all those “suggesting” part. Even the eyes of a woman can trigger man’s desire (remember the burqa!)

I wonder in a society where women have to be all hidden and covered, wouldn’t it make men more “curious” about them that they would have all their imagination going wild and make them prone to this kind of mentality ( I mean seeing woman with lust)?

What I want to say that going either too sexy or too modest isn’t going to answer the issue. Perhaps being moderate will help.

Just my thought…!

 

[MartinJordan]

Elwill has rightly described that it is a metaphor. Muhammad was not made from light. He was just a man like any other man except that he was chosen by Allah to be his messenger. He received revelation from God.

He himself said or was told to say to all people: " Say, I am a person (Bashar) like all of you. It has been revelaed to me that you God is One God…"

Of course he had the light, that was spiritual matter, not physical. He was a mortal man like any one else. Being a messenger makes him suprior to many people, just like all other prophets of God.

Light in Arabic is of two types. One is called Dhiaa. That si the inherent light which is a part of something. It is in the body. It belongs to that body. (Such as in the Sun.)

The other light is the borrowed light or light in transit. That is called Noor. That is a light which doe snot belong to the body. It is a granted light or reflected light. It is some kind of illuminated light, such as in the Moon.

The Quran, at various places, describes the two types of light clearly as Dhiaa or as Noor. It says that Sun has Dhiaa or inherent light. The moon has borrowed light called Noor. Please see just one example in chapter 10 verse 5.

"It is He (Allah) who has made the Sun wth Dhiaa (i.e. internal, inherent shining bright light) and the Moon with Noor (the borrowed light, cool, soft, pleasing light) and proposed (ordained) stages for them (Sun and the Moon) so that you may keep accounts of years etc…" 10:5.

According to above Muhammad has the light which is given to him by Allah. He has not the inherent light. But he has the light sent to him from Allah. It illuminates him spiritually… For such an illumination, one needs a very clear pious heart. Allah will not send his light on any dirty heart. That light lands on the most truthful heart which has no hatred or envy or enmity, on such aheart which has no falsehood.

That was Muhammad. But it is not only for Muhammad. It applies to all persons, Tom Dick and Harry, if they purify themselves and keep themselves away from maladies, hatred, bias etc, and away from any false thinking, that person will receive the words of God. I am sure of that. Even today, same is the rule for all mankind, man or woman, to purify themselves and see the miracles coming from God. They will recelive messages from god and the good news.

Thanks for taking the trouble to explain it. Interesting.

 

[dava4444]

Hi (name removed by moderator)!

the 1.
2.
3.

they are in order of Devotion,

isn’t it true that some Christians identify with Judisim?

Firstly I am a Roman Catholic, born and bred. Secondly I believe in the Apostolic Thrones of the founding Apostles in the Orthodox Churches,

…thirdly I believe that God fulfilled his promise to make Ishmael a ‘Great Nation’…but no more than some Christians identify with being Jewish. I identify with Islam, because of Jesus, and I believe the noble Qur’an to be God’s poetry, spirit of His promise but without the substance of literal truth. a poem.

peace.

Dava

please, if you would like read the parable of the ten virgins, and suggested~ remember one of those virgins is the Holy Catholic Church, but who are the others?

 

[dava4444]

Actually, I dress modestly already, thank you. I have no intention of wearing a sack or a bedsheet.

Hi Maria

I do believe you, but when going out do you think “is this something Mother Mary would wear”? I think that is the core of the discussion.

Muslim women do think this, the Jilbab is based on what Mother Mary wears.

when I said ‘OLD’ Catholic I meant a cardigan and long skirt and oh I just remembered, a head scarf.

that’s not too bad or too far away is it?

peace
your brother
Dava