The Wedding of Jesus

[S_J_Thaikattil]

Planten, there is a very good reason that Judaism, Christianity and Islam are different religions.

As a Muslim, you are not expected to believe as Christians do. Neither are Christians obliged to believe as Jews and Muslims do.

Leave it to Christians to interpret their own Scripture. After all Christians don’t offer to interpret Islam for Muslims, nor Judaism for Jews.

If Christianity does not appeal to you, nobody forces you to become a Christian. Christians are free to leave their religion any time they please, without punishment.

 

[PatienceAndLove]

**
Further more, it is well known that Jesus had a God to whom he used to pray, to whom he used to call for help. If he himslef was god, he would never do that.**.

Well, as per my PP #194 we read in the Gospel of St. John 10:36-38
“Do you say of him whom the Father hath sanctified and sent into the world: Thou blasphemest, because I said, I am the Son of God? If I do not the works of my Father, believe me not. But if I do, though you will not believe me, believe the works: that you may know and believe that the Father is in me, and I in the Father”

Additionally, the Gospel of St. John tells us in 10:30
“I and the Father are one.”

The First Epistle of St. John tells us in 5:7
“And there are three who give testimony in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost. And these three are one.”

Lastly, and I think most powerfully, the Gospel of St. John tells us in 17: 21-24:
"That they all may be one, as thou, Father, in me, and I in thee; that they also may be one in us; that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. And the glory which thou hast given me, I have given to them; that they may be one, as we also are one: I in them, and thou in me; that they may be made perfect in one: and the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast also loved me. Father, I will that where I am, they also whom thou hast given me may be with me; that they may see my glory which thou hast given me, because thou hast loved me before the creation of the world. "

This passage plainly tells us of the Divine Nature of Our Lord, Jesus Christ. That He is ONE with God.

**
For reference, please see the prayer of Jesus in the garden before his arrest. Also note the words of Jesus while he was on the cross, “Ailly, Ailly, …” Meaning “O my Lord, O my Lord…”**.

Your translation is incorrect:
Gospel According to St. Mark 14: 36
And he saith: Abba, Father, all things are possible to thee: remove this chalice from me; but not what I will, but what thou wilt

He had a Lord and was not himself any Lord.

Please see the Bible verses I provided in the first part of this post.

 

[LilyM]

John 2, 1-2
And the third day, there was a marriage in Cana of Galilee: and the mother of Jesus was there. And Jesus also was invited, and his disciples, to the marriage.

If it was Jesus marriage, wouldn’t the author have said “the marriage of Jesus”?
Again- your interpretation of “called” does not work here.

Here’s another thing that doesn’t gel as far as Ben Masada’s interpretation. ‘the mother of Jesus was there’. If it was Jesus’ wedding OF COURSE she’d be there! There’d be no need to specifically mention that she was there if she was mother of the groom.

 

[planten]

Well, as per my PP #194 we read in the Gospel of St. John 10:36-38
“Do you say of him whom the Father hath sanctified and sent into the world: Thou blasphemest, because I said, I am the Son of God? If I do not the works of my Father, believe me not. But if I do, though you will not believe me, believe the works: that you may know and believe that the Father is in me, and I in the Father”

Thank you for your post. I believe these good words of Jesus honestly.

Additionally, the Gospel of St. John tells us in 10:30
“I and the Father are one.”

The First Epistle of St. John tells us in 5:7
“And there are three who give testimony in heaven, the Father, the Word, and the Holy Ghost. And these three are one.”

** I do not know who said that. I will have to look up in the bibleNT.**

Lastly, and I think most powerfully, the Gospel of St. John tells us in 17: 21-24:
"That they all may be one, as thou, Father, in me, and I in thee; that they also may be one in us; that the world may believe that thou hast sent me. And the glory which thou hast given me, I have given to them; that they may be one, as we also are one: I in them, and thou in me; that they may be made perfect in one: and the world may know that thou hast sent me, and hast loved them, as thou hast also loved me. Father, I will that where I am, they also whom thou hast given me may be with me; that they may see my glory which thou hast given me, because thou hast loved me before the creation of the world. "

I believe all that what Jesus said. That he is one in God and One with God. But please read that he is inviting all others that they be good and be One with God. So would they also become a god?

This passage plainly tells us of the Divine Nature of Our Lord, Jesus Christ. That He is ONE with God.

You are taking the words “Being One with God” literally. Could you please take them symbolically? We are learned people and we understand what Jesus meant by being One with God. But you understand it differently. Jesus always used to talk in parables.

Your translation is incorrect:
Gospel According to St. Mark 14: 36
And he saith: Abba, Father, all things are possible to thee: remove this chalice from me; but not what I will, but what thou wilt

What you have written is true. But that does not concern me. My point is that Jesus had a Lord and he was praying to Him. If he was The Lord, why he would pray to any one?

Please see the Bible verses I provided in the first part of this post.

I hope I have seen those verses and if there is still some doubt then I will see them again if advised. I am with you on many points. But I do not (desire to) take literal meanings. Desires can ruin the good things.

 

[planten]

Here’s another thing that doesn’t gel as far as Ben Masada’s interpretation. ‘the mother of Jesus was there’. If it was Jesus’ wedding OF COURSE she’d be there! There’d be no need to specifically mention that she was there if she was mother of the groom.

Yes, John 2:1-2 is clearly telling that it was not the wedding ceremony of Jesus. So I may have to believe that. Thanks for giving reference and guidance.

 

[Valke2]

.

Now, to say that Paul invented Christianity is, with all due respect, to put a limitation on God’s power and might.

I didn’t say that. I think we can agree that he had a lot to do with shaping it?

St. Paul was a zealous, pious and devout Jew. He sincerely believed that what the Christians were doing was wrong.

For the reasons I set forth here and in the thread I linked to, it is hard for me to believe based on what Paul said that he was a zealous jew.

What you are basing yourself on is what the Council of Yamnia came up with where they totally disregarded the Greek version of the Sacred Scriptures simply because they were not written in Hebrew.

I’m not sure how this counters anything I’ve said. Without getting into which translation was more accurate, the fact is that Paul does not seem to ever quote from the Hebrew translation which may indicate that he did not in fact speak or read Hebrew.

 

[Valke2]

There is only one problem here. Jesus was not a Rabbi. The Rabbinical tradition did not begin until the end of the Jewish priesthood. The Jewish priesthood was very much alive and well in Jesus lifetime.

Jesus was called Teacher, which is also translated as Rabbi. But he was not part of the Rabbinical school. That did not begin until the first century after the destruction of the Temple in 70 AD.

Fraternally,

JR

There were rabbis during the time of Jesus. And there were synagouges during the time the Temple stood. Very few Jews, if any, went to the priests to learn. The went to scholars, a.k.a rabbis. As I am sure has been pointed out, a rabbi is a teacher. In the time of Jesus, his main role would be to provide guidence on how to apply the commandments to varioius situations, much more so than being a community’s spiritual leader.

 

[Ben_Masada]

And- BTW
Just because YOU don’t believe that Our Lord, Jesus Christ is the Saviour doesn’t mean we don’t believe it.
And, irregardless of your own beliefs, the Gospels were written for believers. So if the writers of the Gospel were writing for believers, wouldn’t it make sense for them to designate the wife of who they believe to be the saviour with some sort of signifier? “Mary, wife of Jesus” sounds a whole lot more important than “Mary of Magadala” or “Mary Magdalen”.

So… it’s rather interesting that she isn’t called that. Huh… I wonder why?

Maybe because she WASN’T the wife of Our Lord, Jesus Christ.

Keep wondering! Who knows, one day the truth will find an open entrance into your brains.

Ben:

 

[Ben_Masada]

Hrm… you would think that being the wife of the SAVIOUR would totally outweigh a business.

Do you think the Church would have allowed such an epitet (Mary the wife of Jesus) to pass the screening into
the Canon of the NT? You must be kidding!

Ben:

 

[Ben_Masada]

Christians believe Jesus came in fulfilment of Jewish Scripture. Considering Jesus preached only in Israel in His lifetime and converted only Jews, it does mean something. Christianity was spread by Jewish converts to Christianity. Paul had been an overzealous Pharisee who knew his Jewish Scripture well enough (didn’t I mention that at least a couple of times?).

I know Jesus came to fulfill the Jewish Scriptures and to make sure we all did the same. (Mat. 5:17-19)
Yes, and I agree with you that Jesus preached only to Israel. However, he was not spreading Christianity. Christianity rose about 30 years later with Paul. I am usually afraid of the overzealous religious people who know too much of Scriptures.

Ben:

 

[S_J_Thaikattil]

I know Jesus came to fulfill the Jewish Scriptures and to make sure we all did the same. (Mat. 5:17-19)
Yes, and I agree with you that Jesus preached only to Israel. However, he was not spreading Christianity. Christianity rose about 30 years later with Paul. I am usually afraid of the overzealous religious people who know too much of Scriptures.

Ben:

Ben, Apostle Thomas came to Kerala in 52 AD. Tradition has it that he preached in Edessa, Syria before he came to Kerala, India. Christianity in Kerala developed independent of Paul. I mentioned in an earlier post that Jesus had 12 disciples all of whom had been given the commandment to preach the good news of Jesus, by Jesus Himself.

So why do you go on and on about Paul. What is wrong with Paul anyway? He was a zealous Jewish pharisee who spent all his life after his conversion preaching to the Gentiles.

 

[mercygate]

**
After Jesus’ immersion in the Jordan River by John the Baptist, Jesus was seen during the next two days on his way to Galilee. (John 1:35,43) Then on the third day after his “mikveh” the family and friends were celebrating his wedding in Cana with Mary Magdalene.**

Jesus fasted for forty days after His “mikveh” (perfectly good word in this context), so he didn’t go to Galilee on the third day after it.

And He didn’t marry anybody.

The wedding according to Orthodox tradition was that of Simon the Zealot.

AND Bethany was not the home of Mary Magdalene, it was the home of Mary, sister of Martha and Lazarus.

 

[Ben_Masada]

Jesus referered to himself as “I AM” many times in the Gospel according to St. John.

This is what happens when Gentiles try to plagiarize the Scriptures.

Jesus is God made man. That is the part that, with all due respect, you do not understand.

Neither do you. You have accepted it by blind faith, because you have grown up into it.

All of the prophecies of the Old Testament, the Hebrew scriptures, if you will, point directly to Him.

Prove it. Mention to me these prophecies that point to Jesus on an individual basis. You can’t because you go by hear-say.

Because He is God, the Second Person of the Trinity (with the Father being the First and the Holy Spirit being the Third), he is incapable of lying.

But of course, God is incapable of lying but incapable of being lied about.

The Holy Trinity was already mentioned thrice in the book of Genesis. “Let us make man in OUR own image.”

When man was created he was granted several of God’s attributes albeit on a human level. Therefore, the atributes of God in the making of man are metaphorically expressing the statement, “Let us make man in our own image.”

"Let us go down: to Babel and see what they are doing.

Angels are emanations, influences, the personificaton of things to happen. Somehow and almost all of a sudden, no one would understand anyone else. So, the Bible author interpreted that phenomenon as angels being sent from heaven, each one with a different tongue or language to confuse the builders of the tower. That’s how the original author could explain the origin of the diversification of languages.

Abraham had “three visitors” whom he invited as a token of hospitatlity. These three were the Trinity.

Here yes, they were three visitors from heaven, and one of them was even God Himself, but how? During a vision Abraham had. In a vision or dream everything is possible. Even for God to ride on the wind or cloud as if they were horses.

Ben:

 

[paarsurrey]

Originally Posted by benedictgal :
The Holy Trinity was already mentioned thrice in the book of Genesis. “Let us make man in OUR own image.”

Ben Masada:

When man was created he was granted several of God’s attributes albeit on a human level. Therefore, the atributes of God in the making of man are metaphorically expressing the statement, “Let us make man in our own image.”

Hi

I agree with you.

Thanks

 

[paarsurrey]

Jesus had 12 disciples all of whom had been given the commandment to preach the good news of Jesus, by Jesus Himself.

Hi

Kindly give the list of names from NTBible.

Thanks

 

[adrift]

Hi

Kindly give the list of names from NTBible.

Thanks

Matthew Chapter 10

The first, Simon who is called Peter, and Andrew his brother, 3 James the son of Zebedee, and John his brother, Philip and Bartholomew, Thomas and Matthew the publican, and James the son of Alpheus, and Thaddeus, 4 Simon the Cananean, and Judas Iscariot, who also betrayed him.

 

[benedictgal]

Matthew Chapter 10

The first, Simon who is called Peter, and Andrew his brother, 3 James the son of Zebedee, and John his brother, Philip and Bartholomew, Thomas and Matthew the publican, and James the son of Alpheus, and Thaddeus, 4 Simon the Cananean, and Judas Iscariot, who also betrayed him.

Let’s not forget Matthias, who was elected to succeed Judas Iscariot. His election occurred is recorded in the Acts of the Apostles.

By his appointing 12 apostles, Jesus was reconstituting Israel and he gave it a further meaning. Instead of going beyond the bounds of Israel, Jesus was now going to extend the Chosen People to embrace the Gentiles, constituting the New Israel, the Church.

If you carefully read the Gospels, you will find evidence that Jesus is making all things new. He chose a new set of 12. He is also the new Moses, this time freeing his people from slavery to sin. The big problem that Ancient Israel had with him was that he made Himself equal to God. They could not believe that God could become man.

 

[adrift]

This is what happens when Gentiles try to plagiarize the Scriptures.

What happens? You make a statement without weight.

Neither do you. You have accepted it by blind faith, because you have grown up into it.

Try again.

Here yes, they were three visitors from heaven, and one of them was even God Himself, but how? During a vision Abraham had. In a vision or dream everything is possible. Even for God to ride on the wind or cloud as if they were horses.
Try again.

Ben:

 

[paarsurrey]

Matthew Chapter 10

The first, Simon who is called Peter, and Andrew his brother, 3 James the son of Zebedee, and John his brother, Philip and Bartholomew, Thomas and Matthew the publican, and James the son of Alpheus, and Thaddeus, 4 Simon the Cananean, and Judas Iscariot, who also betrayed him.

Hi

One betrayed; were the rest 11 present when Jesus was put on the Cross?

Thanks

 

[adrift]

Hi

One betrayed; were the rest 11 present when Jesus was put on the Cross?

Thanks

paarsurrey

I feel insulted that you ask this question when you have already been answered in another thread. You know the answer. If you are leading up to something just spit it out. I live with a mathematician and have learned well a geometric trap.