The Wedding of Jesus

[paarsurrey]

? The New Testament did not exist in St. Pauls day. ?

He told his listeners to ‘read the Scriptures’, which were the Old Testament Scriptures.

Hi

I think i wrote it earlier also; and repeat it that I club the clergy who followed Paul with Paul in abstraction. Jesus’ views were clearly different than Paul’s, in my opinion.

I love Jesus and would defend him against strange ideas of Paul.

Thanks

 

[Ben_Masada]

i have been to a Messianic Synagogue and it seems to me that they basically believe that Israel is the Messiah, is almost if they worship themselves instead of focus in the Man Jesus as the Son of God our Savior. obviously they dont believe that they need a Savior. but to me this is a contracdition of the Scriptures since there is plenty of indication in SS about the Savior.
a promise from the beginning. but instead they elevate themselves above what God is trying to tell them from the beginning. if you believe that we sin, you must believe that God has a plan to get us out of it. although our salvation comes from Israel, it is not Israel itself that is our savior but a man sent by God to be of a Sacrificing for the sins of many.

Wisdomseeker, you made a small mistake but very easy to fix it. I don’t know what you saw or heard in this Messianic place you were at, because the answer is NO. They do not believe that Israel is the Messiah. Their Messiah is the same as yours: Jesus.

I have read a lot about “Messianic Jews” as well as “Jews-for-Jesus”. Their Messiah is Jesus. Even among the real Jews, only a small portion believe that the Messiah is Israel. I am one among
them. And we do not worship ourselves, only God.

You say above, “Although our salvation comes from Israel, Israel is not our savior.” I have just posted a thread about “Salvation is from the Jews” based on John 4:22. Take a look at it and tell me what you think.

Ben:

 

[Ben_Masada]

You know I have read some thing’s but this one take the cake. All I can say is one thing.

Jesus HATES Liars. That is what the bible say’s. I guess Ben does has no one else left to slander so he has to start with our Dear Lord Jesus Christ now.

You know what Ben, I don’t even dislike you I pity you. To start garbage like this could only come from one source. And I can tell you this, it is the opposite of Jesus.

You do not believe in Jesus, you could never begin to believe in Jesus, If you did you would be afraid to spread these kinds of lies. May Jesus h
ave mercy on your soul. Because forgive me Dear Jesus because right now I sure do not.

Too bad that you feel thus. And all because I have found out that this our Jesus was married? What
about if I proved to you that Jesus is not yours but ours?

Jesus was not Christian but Jewish. The Christian one was Paul. It means that Jesus had nothing to do with Christians and everything to do with Jews. You should put such a fight for Paul and not for Jesus.

You have too much hatred in your heart, and that’s not a good incentive to learn. If you feel like defending something or someone, the only way is through arguments and not with hostile epithets. To show the fangs only proves that fangs is all that you have to show.

Ben: :

 

[Valke2]

it doesnt really matter how it is read. the question is what i stated. so, do you believe what i stated from the OT?

So your question is why does God tell Abraham to sacrifice Isaac? The traditional answers are to test Abraham’s faith. Perhaps to test Isaac’s faith as well? To strengthen and restate the covenant. A covenant was traditionally made over a sacrifice.

I can give pages of answers and none of them would have anything to do with forshadowing the death of Jesus. Kanichan is correct when she says chrsitians read the five books of Moses from a completely different standpoint. There is an assumption that the purpose of the Jewish scriptures is to prove that Jesus is God. So they start with that assumption and look for things that they believe proves it.

When a Jew reads their scripture without giving any thought to Jesus, there’s nothing that jumps out at us saying “something’s missing”

 

[mercygate]

So your question is why does God tell Abraham to sacrifice Isaac? The traditional answers are to test Abraham’s faith. Perhaps to test Isaac’s faith as well? To strengthen and restate the covenant. A covenant was traditionally made over a sacrifice.

I can give pages of answers and none of them would have anything to do with forshadowing the death of Jesus. Kanichan is correct when she says chrsitians read the five books of Moses from a completely different standpoint. There is an assumption that the purpose of the Jewish scriptures is to prove that Jesus is God. So they start with that assumption and look for things that they believe proves it.

When a Jew reads their scripture without giving any thought to Jesus, there’s nothing that jumps out at us saying “something’s missing”

If it were not for the Jewish understanding of the Akedah, Christians wouldn’t have known what to make of the Crucifixion.

And you are correct: from a Jewish perspective, Christians read the scriptures inside out. It is a completely different way of seeing from any Jewish approach.

The NT tells us that Paul spent 3 years in Arabia before the full scale launch of his preaching career. I believe he spent those 3 years synthesizing his personal experience of Christ with his knowledge of the Jewish scriptures. The outcome was something entirely novel.

 

[wisdomseeker]

So your question is why does God tell Abraham to sacrifice Isaac? The traditional answers are to test Abraham’s faith. Perhaps to test Isaac’s faith as well? To strengthen and restate the covenant. A covenant was traditionally made over a sacrifice.

I can give pages of answers and none of them would have anything to do with forshadowing the death of Jesus. Kanichan is correct when she says chrsitians read the five books of Moses from a completely different standpoint. There is an assumption that the purpose of the Jewish scriptures is to prove that Jesus is God. So they start with that assumption and look for things that they believe proves it.

When a Jew reads their scripture without giving any thought to Jesus, there’s nothing that jumps out at us saying “something’s missing”

what was the purpose of testing Abraham’s faith? again how about creation? how about the fall of mankind and sins?

 

[Thing]

Hi

I think i wrote it earlier also; and repeat it that I club the clergy who followed Paul with Paul in abstraction. Jesus’ views were clearly different than Paul’s, in my opinion.

I love Jesus and would defend him against strange ideas of Paul.

Thanks

Then you have a problem. St Paul clubbed with the rest of the Apostles in Jerusalem before he taught, - Jesus’ Apostles, Jesus’ views, and St. Pauls views met together, and were content and unanimous.

 

[rinnie]

Too bad that you feel thus. And all because I have found out that this our Jesus was married? What
about if I proved to you that Jesus is not yours but ours?

Jesus was not Christian but Jewish. The Christian one was Paul. It means that Jesus had nothing to do with Christians and everything to do with Jews. You should put such a fight for Paul and not for Jesus.

You have too much hatred in your heart, and that’s not a good incentive to learn. If you feel like defending something or someone, the only way is through arguments and not with hostile epithets. To show the fangs only proves that fangs is all that you have to show.

Ben: :

Its not hatred in my heart Ben, it the hatred that I see that you have for my Lord that upsets me. How in the world could Jesus not be a Christian, Do you know how the word Christian came about ben. CHRISTian. That is the word Christ like. Now how in the world could Christ not be a Christian when that is what a Christian is. Explain that one to me. I can’t wait to hear it.

Also show me where Jesus got married. Where is that in SS or Tradition. Show me how the Church can teach us one thing, and show me how you can separate Jesus Christ from the Catholic Church when Jesus Christ and the Catholic Church are one. Jesus is not Jewish. He came from the Jewish faith, and continued on the Jewish faith. It became the Christian faith.

How can Jesus be Jewish, the Jewish faith deny Christ, THey do not believe he is God.

So when you can explain that to me, then we can talk.

 

[adrift]

**There is a good question here from Ben to all the Catholics about Jesus not being married. Of course, there is no news of his marriage in the Gospels. **

I am glad you agree that the Marriage of Cana was not Jesus’

There is also no news of any disciples marriage in the gospels. So shall we be justified to believe that none of the disciples was married?

 

[planten]

It all comes down to what SS says about the fall of man kind. did Adam and Eve existed? is it true or false that God created man and man disobeyed God in the beginning? and what went on after that? why did God ask Abraham to sacrifice his only son? what was the purpose for this?

BLESSED TO BE CATHOLIC

**Please be reminded that God created man and gave mankind the free will. It did not mean that man will be perfect and will not make mistakes.

That act of Adam was a mistake, not any wilful disobediance. He was misled and showed weakness. That is in the nature of man. Then Adam learned words of repentance from God and and uttered those words. He was pardoned. Thereafter, there was no sin and no more punishment… It is not correct to carry the sin any further.

It only shows that man is apt to make mistakes and even commit sinful acts. It shows that it in the nature of mankind. Nothing more than that. it is not fair to say that even a one day new born baby is sinful. Nobody will believe you.

The devil (Satan) was different. The whole matter has not been correctly described in the bible. It is well and better described in the Quran. The devil disbeyed God when man was raised to a higher rank. man was here on earth for thousands of years. It is not true as bible says that Adam was the first man. Adam was not the first man. he was however the first man vouchsafed with knowledge (guidance, revelation).

That disobedience of Adam was a mistake. he was tricked by the devil. But nobody misguided the devil when he disobeyed God and did not submit to prostration in honor of Adam. The devil was cheating God for a long time and did not know that God knows everything. Due to that God created mankind and the cheating of the devil (Satan) was exposed.

When God asked devil why he disobeyed, he became furious and blamed God for all things and said that he would keep on opposing the mankind.

It is a long story. I suffice it to say as much now. Thanks.**

 

[adrift]

I think you misread the post that you were responding too. He was talking about the jews that the Romans crucified at the time of Jesus, not the Shoah.

forums.catholic-questions.org/showpost.php?p=4822003&postcount=187

From post `187

One million and a half children were burned alive in the Holocaust just because they were Jews. Children who didn’t know their right from their left. If Jesus could know what they went through, he would be happy that he didn’t have to suffer that much. Their pain didn’t count? Can you see how unfair faith can make of religious people?

I don’t thing that refers to the Jews that the Romans crucified.

 

[planten]

Its not hatred in my heart Ben, it the hatred that I see that you have for my Lord that upsets me. How in the world could Jesus not be a Christian, Do you know how the word Christian came about ben. CHRISTian. That is the word Christ like. Now how in the world could Christ not be a Christian when that is what a Christian is. Explain that one to me. I can’t wait to hear it.

Also show me where Jesus got married. Where is that in SS or Tradition. Show me how the Church can teach us one thing, and show me how you can separate Jesus Christ from the Catholic Church when Jesus Christ and the Catholic Church are one. Jesus is not Jewish. He came from the Jewish faith, and continued on the Jewish faith. It became the Christian faith.

How can Jesus be Jewish, the Jewish faith deny Christ, THey do not believe he is God.

So when you can explain that to me, then we can talk.

**You have made more complications. You mean Jesus is Christ like.

CHRISTian. That is the word Christ like.**

It means Jesus is Christ like. If he is a christian then he is christ like. That means he is not christ. Is that so? Every one knows that Jesus was a Jew. He was all for the Jews. He never uttered a word against the Jewish teachings. Rather he tried to explain and to improve upon the practical applications of the Jewish teachings. Read those things about washing, eating and about sabath and about giving tax to Caesar and about helping the poor.

He was not starting any new religion.

Ben is pressing the point that there is nothing in the bibleNT to say that Jesus was not married. What do you say about that?

 

[rinnie]

Jesus said you cannot serve 2 masters. Jesus gave himself fully to the Church. To say that Jesus was married and did not give himself fully to the Church IMO is calling Jesus a Liar.

Jesus is not a Liar. So now Ben, the ball is in your court. Are you saying that Jesus did indeed lie to us?

If you want to say Jesus was married, there is only one way. The same as RC Priests are married. To the Church. Not to a women who was a sinner. Jesus gave his life to the Church. He tells us so. To say Jesus did marry would have him contradicting scripture. That is impossible. IT is you ben who do not understand scripture so you try to make up lies about Jesus. Please go back and read scripture before you try to teach it.

Do you have the gift of the HS Ben. I will ask you now how my Lord Jesus would ask you ben on whos authority are you speaking?

 

[rinnie]

I am glad you agree that the Marriage of Cana was not Jesus’

You are unfamiliar with the Bible aren’t you? It does mention that Peter was married.

Hi adrift. Could you show me where it says in scripture that Peter did indeed take a wife? Thanks

 

[PaulDupre]

Hi adrift. Could you show me where it says in scripture that Peter did indeed take a wife? Thanks

Matthew 8:14
When Jesus arrived at Peter’s house, Peter’s mother-in-law was sick in bed with a high fever.

Mark 1:30
Now Simon’s mother-in-law was sick in bed with a high fever. They told Jesus about her right away.

Luke 4:38
After leaving the synagogue that day, Jesus went to Simon’s home, where he found Simon’s mother-in-law very sick with a high fever. “Please heal her,” everyone begged.

 

[rinnie]

Matthew 8:14
When Jesus arrived at Peter’s house, Peter’s mother-in-law was sick in bed with a high fever.

Mark 1:30
Now Simon’s mother-in-law was sick in bed with a high fever. They told Jesus about her right away.

Luke 4:38
After leaving the synagogue that day, Jesus went to Simon’s home, where he found Simon’s mother-in-law very sick with a high fever. “Please heal her,” everyone begged.

But can you show me where Peter was indeed Married. Or is that your assumption. Could it be possible that Peter was a Widow, and his wife has already passed. If he did indeed have a wife at the time, is it not funny her name was not mentioned in that scripture?

Also what did Mother-in-Law mean in those days, You may want to check that out a little also. Mother-in-Law I was told had many meanings.

 

[adrift]

But can you show me where Peter was indeed Married. Or is that your assumption. Could it be possible that Peter was a Widow, and his wife has already passed. If he did indeed have a wife at the time, is it not funny her name was not mentioned in that scripture?

Also what did Mother-in-Law mean in those days, You may want to check that out a little also. Mother-in-Law I was told had many meanings.

It has been speculated that he was a widow but that is not provable. I have never heard that there were many meanings to Mother-in-law can you give me more information on that. The point was that Peter married.

There is also 1 Corinthians Chapter 9

5
Do we not have the right to take along a Christian wife, as do the rest of the apostles, and the brothers of the Lord, and Cephas?

 

[rinnie]

It has been speculated that he was a widow but that is not provable. I have never heard that there were many meanings to Mother-in-law can you give me more information on that. The point was that Peter married.

There is also 1 Corinthians Chapter 9

Yes, I am just asking. I was told that it could not be proven that Peter was married at the time either. I have read that mother in law, wife, etc all had different meanings in those days. I forget where I found it, but there is a place that you can see where words of today had different meanings back then…

Just like cousin I know is also meant as brothers and sisters. I will try to find the site. and if anyone else knows maybe they can help us.

Father was just talking about that on ewtn not too long ago. I cna’t remember where I found it. But I did one day. I will try.

 

[jakasaki]

But can you show me where Peter was indeed Married. Or is that your assumption. Could it be possible that Peter was a Widow, and his wife has already passed. If he did indeed have a wife at the time, is it not funny her name was not mentioned in that scripture?

Also what did Mother-in-Law mean in those days, You may want to check that out a little also. Mother-in-Law I was told had many meanings.

Yes, he was a widow.

Capharnaum

Simon settled in Capharnaum, where he was living with his mother-in-law in his own house (Matthew 8:14; Luke 4:38) at the beginning of Christ’s public ministry (about A.D. 26-28).

Simon was thus married, and, according to Clement of Alexandria (Stromata, III, vi, ed. Dindorf, II, 276), had children.

The same writer relates the tradition that Peter’s wife suffered martyrdom (ibid., VII, xi ed. cit., III, 306).

Concerning these facts, adopted by Eusebius (Church History III.31) from Clement, the ancient Christian literature which has come down to us is silent.

Simon pursued in Capharnaum the profitable occupation of fisherman in Lake Genesareth, possessing his own boat (Luke 5:3).

newadvent.org/cathen/11744a.htm

Home > Catholic Encyclopedia > P > St. Peter, Prince of the Apostles

 

[rinnie]

Yes, he was a widow.

newadvent.org/cathen/11744a.htm

Home > Catholic Encyclopedia > P > St. Peter, Prince of the Apostles

Thanks Jak, I will check out the site you presented. I knew I read it before.