The Western Diet: Bane or Boon?

[Marfran]

For myself I tend to not be all that concerned about the weight, or life span. For me its more immediate. Changing my diet has improved, my experiences with allergies, headaches, energy, and general day to health and just feeling good.

As to time, well spending time cooking isn’t really a bad way to spend life, its a skill, its active, and its fun to do. I’d rather work in kitchen than watch TV, or waste money on fast food that doesn’t even taste good. But again that’s all about choices. Its worth it to you or its not. Life is all about choices.

Right on!!! There are great** immediate **benefits from eating healthy!!! I eat a plant-based diet and I am never tired, have lots of energy (I used to have to nap in the afternoon), my skin has improved (look a decade younger), etc., etc… AND IT DOESN’T TAKE ANY LONGER TO PREPARE MEALS!!! How long it takes one to prepare a meal is based on the RECIPE and how involved or gourmet you want to get. I’m NOT into the FANCY recipes where you need a food processor and 150 different ingredients. YOU CAN EAT HEALTHY AND prepare quick meals. One does not exclude the other.

 

[Marfran]

I also tend to eat a lot of raw foods now.

And that is the healthiest way to eat. Cooking destroys a lot of nutrients in food. ALSO saves all that cooking time!!! But there are RAW food recipes where you combine ingredients–usually takes less time than hot cooking as you do not heat or cook anything. It’s called uncooking!!!

I would like to move in this direction myself, but for right now I still make hot cooked plant-based dishes–AND I DO NOT SPEND ANY EXTRA TIME doing this–probably EVEN LESS than traditional cooking.

 

[Marfran]

I can’t help, but wonder in my mind how you would answer catagorically the points I made in post#15. Especially the comments about time and genetics.

TIME–not an issue at all. YOU CAN eat healthy and cook with simple recipes, or you can buy healthy frozen dinners–numerous makers–most common one in regular grocery stores is Amy’s Kitchen. Issue of genetics: You might want to read The China Study. Environmental and lifestyle issues tend to trump genetics. That is if you are predisposed to a certain disease such as heart or diabetes, you can often improve your chances of either not developing the disease, or can manage it better with lifestyle and diet changes. Often the poor diet is the match that lights the fire. One’s genetics may say that members of a certain family have a tendency toward being overweight, or developing heart disease, or diabetes–but with a healthy diet these people may completely avert getting these diseases.

 

[aspawloski4th]

THis is to adress the plant vs meat based diet part of the debate. Knowing that vitamin b 12 is very important, likely the most important of the water soluable vitamins. Knowing that vitamin b 12 comes from animal sources. How do you vegatarians out there get your vitamin b 12?

 

[Marfran]

THis is to adress the plant vs meat based diet part of the debate. Knowing that vitamin b 12 is very important, likely the most important of the water soluable vitamins. Knowing that vitamin b 12 comes from animal sources. How do you vegatarians out there get your vitamin b 12?

Vitamin B -12 was the last vitamin to be identified (in 1949). Vitamin B -12 originates not from animal foods but from bacteria. Animal foods contain B -12 of bacterial origin. It is found in the soil but we wash it away when we clean our ground vegetables. If we were not such clean-living creatures there would be more more naturally occuring vitamin B -12 found in our foods. Colbalamin is created by one-celled organisms bacteria and fungi. These microscopic organisms are airborne and you can find them in the dirt, on the wind, in the waters. In previous centuries when foods like sauerkraut or tempeh were fermented outdoors, airborne bacteria would naturally drift into the fermentation process making these foods a source of B -12. Nowadays everything is manufactured indoors in clean environments and we stringently wash all of our foods.

Because vitamin B -12 is stripped from vegetables, because soil is arduously removed, because fermentation occurs in clean environments, our foods are deficient in vitamin B 12. The B -12 found in animal foods was produced by micro-organisms in the soil eaten by the animals (bits of soil or manure adhering to grass eaten etc.). When an animal eats grass or feed with B -12 producing bacteria, the vitamin ends up in the flesh or the milk of the animals.

Of noteworthy interest is that soils treated with pesticides and other chemicals have less B -12 producing bacteria than organic soils.

Vegans can easily get their B -12 from fortified foods such as soy milk or cereals. Non-vegans must also be concerned about B -12 inadequacies. Ten to thirty percent of people over the age of 50 lose their ability to absorb the protein-bound form of B -12 present in animal foods. And people in general, lose their ability to absorb nutrients and vitamins from their foods as they age–that’s why it’s a good idea to have regular check-ups as you age and include blood analyses to check for deficiencies or areas of concern.

 

[mkingdomlvr]

TIME–not an issue at all. YOU CAN eat healthy and cook with simple recipes, or you can buy healthy frozen dinners–numerous makers–most common one in regular grocery stores is Amy’s Kitchen. Issue of genetics: You might want to read The China Study. Environmental and lifestyle issues tend to trump genetics. That is if you are predisposed to a certain disease such as heart or diabetes, you can often improve your chances of either not developing the disease, or can manage it better with lifestyle and diet changes. Often the poor diet is the match that lights the fire. One’s genetics may say that members of a certain family have a tendency toward being overweight, or developing heart disease, or diabetes–but with a healthy diet these people may completely avert getting these diseases.

I agree that it’s not always about time-but it is often about money. When I switched to eating less processed food, my grocery bill went up. In a bad economy, that’s a major issue for many families. Mac and Cheese is cheaper than fresh fish and vegetables.

I’ve heard good things about the China Study as well, a friend of mine read it for a teaching class she was taking.

 

[Marfran]

I agree that it’s not always about time-but it is often about money. When I switched to eating less processed food, my grocery bill went up. In a bad economy, that’s a major issue for many families. Mac and Cheese is cheaper than fresh fish and vegetables.

I’ve heard good things about the China Study as well, a friend of mine read it for a teaching class she was taking.

On ANY diet, or way of eating, you can economize, or you can be extravagant, or somewhere in the middle. It **is **challenging in these times to keep your grocery bill down. One strategy is to buy local produce that is in season. This year, for the first time in my life, I have planted tomatoes and a raspberry bush (and some sugar snap peas but I’m pretty sure I already killed those). I don’t have a good track record with growing things, but if I could learn how, and be successful, that would impact my grocery bill in a positive way. And even the healthy grocers like WHOLE FOODS have sales and coupons. Oh, and I have cilantro growing in a pot. I never use a lot of cilantro. Buying a bunch in the store is always too much–I never use it all–so growing it in the windowsill saves money. 4elise has a plant-based Mac & Cheese recipe posted in the Catholic Vegetarians & Vegans Group. I haven’t tried it yet, but am planning to. Instead of cheese it gets its flavoring from nutritional yeast–which is very healthy and has a cheeselike taste–and not very expensive.

 

[aspawloski4th]

On ANY diet, or way of eating, you can economize, or you can be extravagant, or somewhere in the middle. It **is **challenging in these times to keep your grocery bill down. One strategy is to buy local produce that is in season. This year, for the first time in my life, I have planted tomatoes and a raspberry bush (and some sugar snap peas but I’m pretty sure I already killed those). I don’t have a good track record with growing things, but if I could learn how, and be successful, that would impact my grocery bill in a positive way. And even the healthy grocers like WHOLE FOODS have sales and coupons. Oh, and I have cilantro growing in a pot. I never use a lot of cilantro. Buying a bunch in the store is always too much–I never use it all–so growing it in the windowsill saves money. 4elise has a plant-based Mac & Cheese recipe posted in the Catholic Vegetarians & Vegans Group. I haven’t tried it yet, but am planning to. Instead of cheese it gets its flavoring from nutritional yeast–which is very healthy and has a cheeselike taste–and not very expensive.

Too time consuming, too complicated. Tonight it took me 2 minutes to make dinner. I just love microwaves. Nice bbg rib snadwich yum yum. With Coke imported from Mexico in the glass.

 

[jewells17]

Okay everybody…get ready to look at these websites! Go to www.hacres.com and click on the testimonials and read them. They will blow your mind…why isn’t anyone being told this stuff? Then google Dr. Joel Fuhrman and go to his website. His book “Eat To Live” is really good. But those testimonials at www.hacres.com are a must read for anyone with any physical disease. God bless!

 

[Marfran]

Okay everybody…get ready to look at these websites! Go to www.hacres.com and click on the testimonials and read them. They will blow your mind…why isn’t anyone being told this stuff? Then google Dr. Joel Fuhrman and go to his website. His book “Eat To Live” is really good. But those testimonials at www.hacres.com are a must read for anyone with any physical disease. God bless!

I was able to watch the first two episodes and will continue to watch the rest. I had not heard of Dr. Fuhrman. Thank you for posting this link!!!

I think this is a great part of the reason that the ***Catholic Vegetarians and Vegans ***Group here at CAF was formed–when you learn something good you want to share.

 

[jewells17]

I am so glad my posting was helpful and the other website is the one that shows how miracles take place regarding physical illness when at least 2/3 of our diet is fresh, live, raw food from the earth. Makes sense…it still has life in it! On www.hacres.com it will actually have a list of diseases to click on to read about all of the people who got well eating this diet. It is the most important website a sick person should go to.

Wanting to take a class this year taught be Seventh Day Adventist and will be about this very topic. They will also have joint prayer sessions. Anyone know if the prayer part will be a “no,no” for me as a Catholic…or if Seventh Day Adventist are Catholic friendly?

 

[Tigertame4]

One should look at the history of our diet. The idea of refined foods came in back in the late 1800’s as being the “healthy” diet. We are now changing our ideas of “healthy” diets. People have lived on very unhealthy diets in many places for centuries. We must be careful not to do radical changes. Some refining has helped keep foods fresh for longer and enabled foods to be shipped and stored. We should encourage whole foods and encourage research into keeping foods fresh and able to be shipped. Radical changes could result in famine.

Want something to be concerned about? Check into modified food seeds. They are made to only be viable once with the offspring nonviable (can’t save seeds for next year). Even if you have heirloom seeds they will cross polinate with your neighbors plants and you will not be able to store for the next year. This can cause SUPER famine and death if a crop gets a disease. It would be the potato famine on a global scale.

 

[freemanld]

There is one irony I found in this discussion. This is the fact that It is being carried out in a Catholic forum under the topic of social justice. Here are two points to consider.

First, how does our eating affect the rest of the world, especially its people? If we eat Del Monte bananas, we are supporting large, industrial farms instead of family-owned farms. Is this better for the people involved? I recommend reading “Food First” by Frances Moore Lappe.

Second, we should consider our eating in a social and spiritual context. Why did God create creatures that needed to eat? If the sole reason for our food choices is our own personal health, convenience, and pleasure, I think we have the wrong perspective. We (myself included) spend too much time and energy focusing on what will please me, what is convenient, and how much do I want. We have also really also lost the practice of fasting and abstinence.

I like to think about what God created us for, what kinds of food he gave us, and how dependent we all are on his bounty and on each other for our mere survival. This seems to me to put the whole discussion into perspective.

 

[aspawloski4th]

There is one irony I found in this discussion. This is the fact that It is being carried out in a Catholic forum under the topic of social justice. Here are two points to consider.

First, how does our eating affect the rest of the world, especially its people? If we eat Del Monte bananas, we are supporting large, industrial farms instead of family-owned farms. Is this better for the people involved? I recommend reading “Food First” by Frances Moore Lappe.

Second, we should consider our eating in a social and spiritual context. Why did God create creatures that needed to eat? If the sole reason for our food choices is our own personal health, convenience, and pleasure, I think we have the wrong perspective. We (myself included) spend too much time and energy focusing on what will please me, what is convenient, and how much do I want. We have also really also lost the practice of fasting and abstinence.

I like to think about what God created us for, what kinds of food he gave us, and how dependent we all are on his bounty and on each other for our mere survival. This seems to me to put the whole discussion into perspective.

Fasting and abstinance can kill my diebetic wife, and make me worse than not functional on account of hypoglycemia. I don’t focus on mere survival, humans are supposed to be above that if we are higher than animals.

 

[Michaelo]

There is one irony I found in this discussion. This is the fact that It is being carried out in a Catholic forum under the topic of social justice.

How is that ironic? Evaluating the merits of the Western Diet is very much appropriate for the Social Justice forum.

First, how does our eating affect the rest of the world, especially its people? If we eat Del Monte bananas, we are supporting large, industrial farms instead of family-owned farms. Is this better for the people involved? I recommend reading “Food First” by Frances Moore Lappe.

Yes, buying food products from local family farms is important.

Second, we should consider our eating in a social and spiritual context. Why did God create creatures that needed to eat? If the sole reason for our food choices is our own personal health, convenience, and pleasure, I think we have the wrong perspective. We (myself included) spend too much time and energy focusing on what will please me, what is convenient, and how much do I want. We have also really also lost the practice of fasting and abstinence.

Also, the “I can eat what I what, it’s my life” response to criticism of certain diets is nonsense as well. Decisions regarding food do not only affect the person making them, so we should rightfully be concerned about what others eat.

 

[aspawloski4th]

Also, the “I can eat what I what, it’s my life” response to criticism of certain diets is nonsense as well. Decisions regarding food do not only affect the person making them, so we should rightfully be concerned about what others eat.

This coommon attitude is why, while staying Catholic I distance myself from most other Catholics. What I put in my body is my business only. I’ll eat what I want. Taste, affordability, and quickness of preparation are my main factors when deciding what I eat. I don’t have loads of time to cook, Due to lack of income, my funds are tight , and if I don’t like the taste of it no force on this earth can make me eat it.

 

[freemanld]

Here are two questions that I’ve struggled with that might provide some background to my previous statements.

First, it seems to me that being a vegetarian or vegan (as I am) is a luxury of our affluent lifestyle. If my main concern was making sure that my children didn’t starve, I probably wouldn’t be as concerned about eating vegetarian or not.

Second, what does it mean to be a gracious guest and a vegetarian? I have a friend who is a celiac, and even a teaspoon of gluten will make her (intestinally) sick for a week. Now, I choose not to eat meat, but if I am served something with meat in it, it will not make me sick. Shouldn’t I eat it even if it is disgusting to me? Would I be offended if I made a nice dish only to have someone respond “I don’t like onions?”

What I’m trying to say is that being overly concerned with our personal diet can detract from our relationships with others and our concern for them.

On the other hand, I do agree with most of what has been said or implied about the social structures contributing to our decline in health: working mothers who don’t have time to cook from scratch, highly processed convenience foods and snacks, low level of activity, etc. So, part of our concern for diet and health should lead us to teach others I suppose.

As far as fasting goes, I do have a real fear of fasting because I too have struggled with hypoglycemia, but it seems to me that I let that fear prevent me from trying. Also, there are many of us who could fast but don’t know how or aren’t willing to try. It seems that many of the saints used fasting as a way of overcoming their natural concern for food, and they are worthy of emulation.

 

[raw_vegan_girl]

There are many kinds of fasts and you don’t have to do a severe one due to your medical condition. You can try a vegetarian or vegan fast for 3-5 days. You just have to omit all kinds of animal flesh for the vegetarian fast. For the vegan fast you have to abstain from animal flesh and animal products. Then you can move to a raw fast, where everything you will eat will be raw and uncooked. The raw fast can be really fun because you can eat raw, healthy versions of pizza, pasta, chilli, bacon, barbecue, cake, ice cream, etc. This is very good site to look up free raw recipes:

goneraw.com

Whichever fast you choose make sure you will get enough calories (carb/sugar, protein, fat).

I’m sure God will appreciate whatever kind of mild fast you choose, to think that you have hypoglycemia but still desire to mortify yourself through fasting

 

[Marfran]

What I’m trying to say is that being overly concerned with our personal diet can detract from our relationships with others and our concern for them.

I would say that just the opposite is true. Would you push cake on a diabetic? Of couse not, you would respect the difficulty of his medical issues. A non-kosher item on a Jew? Of course not, you would respect his religion. Push wheat on a celiac? Of course not!!! Meat on a confirmed vegetarian??? Of course not…

If you can not eat (for health reasons), or chose not to eat certain items for ethical reasons, or because you are on a diet to lose weight, or are trying to eliminate excessive sugar, etc., no hostess would be offended, and it is enhancing to a relationship to consider these problems, issues and concerns for others.

In several decades of being vegetarian, I can not recall one instance where this was a problem. Any event or social situation I have been in has always been buffet. All of our family gatherings have been buffet. You may chose what you want, and in what proportions. If you are invited to a sit-down dinner and you have a special diet, or a diet that is different than your hosts, then you may discuss that with your host before declining or accepting the invitation. Your host may be surprised, not realizing that he/she had invited a number of say Jewish people, or vegetarians, or diabetics, or whatever and adjust his/her menu accordingly, or decide to have a buffet instead.

And as far as the Western diet…and it’s unhealthiness and over-reliance on processed foods…as people move away from this in their own kitchens, you will also see this reflected in the offerings at social gatherings.

 

[Beaner]

In regards to fasting, there are many ways you can fast even if health factors prevent you from not eating very much. You can simply choose to eat what’s necessary for your health, but not necessarily what satisfies your taste buds. For example, when I was pregnant, I couldn’t fast the usual way. So for lunch, I still took a full meal, but my sandwich was just bread and cheese - not very tasty to me, so I was getting the mortification, but also the nourishment and calories for my baby. I would do the same thing with the other parts of my lunch, and other meals.

I think fasting is also a time to try to turn our thoughts more to God - not to spending a lot of time on food preparation. So taking time to work on developing a vegan fast or a raw-food fast seems to miss the point.