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Adonia
Guest
Can someone help with the Church’s teaching on the Wounds of Our Lord, especially the ones in the area of the hands? Were the nails through the wrist or straight through the palm of the hands?
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C
Cluny
Guest
Do you actually think this would have any spiritual or doctrinal significance?
S
Sir_Alec
Guest
According to Dr. Pierre Barbet’s book A DOCTOR AT CALVARY, the nails were placed in the wrist area. However, Dr. Frederick Zugibe contends that the nails were placed through the upper palm area. Both base their ideas on a study of the Holy Shroud of Turin. Here’s a link to some pertinent info:Can someone help with the Church’s teaching on the Wounds of Our Lord, especially the ones in the area of the hands? Were the nails through the wrist or straight through the palm of the hands?
shroud.com/zugibe.htm
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Adonia
Guest
Only in the context of someone , like Padre Pio, whose stigmata seems (see his picture here) to be manifested in the palms of his hands. Sometimes when my faith grows weak, I can look at someone like Padre Pio and be strengthened in my walk with Our Lord. I have heard about the nails in the wrist and was just curious as to the Church’s teaching on the issue. I also thank you Sir Alec for your info here.Do you actually think this would have any spiritual or doctrinal significance?
C
Cluny
Guest
Stigmata, in and of themselves, have no doctrinal significance, either, and the Church has never claimed that they did.
P
paperwight
Guest
The strange thing is, some mystics have ‘seen’ the wounds in one part, some in another. It makes me doubt the authenticity of almost all visions, frankly.
As you have implied - stigmata are no guarantee of holiness, and I would add, nor are ‘revelations’, giving detailed accounts of the Passion, the Nativity or whatever. Such things can so easily be the product of the mind, and in some cases, a disturbed mind at that.
As you have implied - stigmata are no guarantee of holiness, and I would add, nor are ‘revelations’, giving detailed accounts of the Passion, the Nativity or whatever. Such things can so easily be the product of the mind, and in some cases, a disturbed mind at that.
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I_Believe
Guest
Prayer to the Shoulder Wound of Jesus
O Loving Jesus, meek Lamb of God, I a miserable sinner, salute and worship the most Sacred Wound of Thy Shoulder on which Thou didst bear Thy heavy Cross, which so tore Thy Flesh and laid bare Thy Bones as to inflict on Thee an anguish greater than any other Wound of Thy Most Blessed Body. I adore Thee, O Jesus most sorrowful; I praise and glorify Thee and give Thee thanks for this most sacred and painful Wound, beseeching Thee by that exceeding pain and by the crushing burden of Thy heavy Cross to be merciful to me, a sinner, to forgive me all my mortal and venial sins, and to lead me on towards Heaven along the Way of Thy Cross. Amen.
It is related in the annals of Clairvaux that St. Bernard asked Our Lord which was His greatest unrecorded suffering and Our Lord answered: “I had on My Shoulder, while I bore My Cross on the Way of Sorrows, a grievous Wound, which was more painful than the others and which is not recorded by men. Honor this Wound with thy devotion and I will grant thee whatsoever thou dost ask through Its virtue and merit. And in regard to all those who shall venerate this Wound, I will remit to them all their venial sins and will no longer remember their mortal sins.”
Imprimatur: Thomas D. Beaven
Bishop of Springfield, Ma.
I
I_Believe
Guest
Devotion to the Drops of Blood
Lost by our Lord Jesus Christ
on His Way to Calvary
St. Elizabeth, Queen of Hungary, with St. Matilda and St. Bridget, wishing to know something of the Passion of Jesus Christ, offered fervent and special prayers, upon which Our Lord revealed to them:
To all the faithful who shall recite for 3 years, each day, 2 “Our Fathers”, 2 “Hail Marys” and 2 “Glory Bes”, in honor of the drops of Blood I lost, I will concede the following 5 graces:
1st The plenary indulgence and remittance of your sins.
2nd You will be free from the pains of Purgatory.
3rd If you should die before completing the said 3 years, for you it will be the same as if you had completed them.
4th It will be upon your death the same as if you had shed all your blood for the Holy Faith.
5th I will descend from Heaven to take your soul and that of your relatives, until the fourth generation.
Blessed by His Holiness Pope Leo XIII in Rome, April 5, 1890.
I
IOPdevotee
Guest
The Passionists have a special devotion to the Holy Wounds, including a Chaplet. It has offered me a very good source of meditation. God Bless
**
CHAPLET OF THE HOLY WOUNDS**
Incline unto my aid O God. O Lord, make haste to help me. Glory be …etc
O ever good and sweetest Jesus, behold I here fall down upon my knee before Thee, and with all the powers of my soul do beg and beseech Thee to inspire my heart with lively feelings of faith, hope and charity, with true repentance for my sins, with a will resolved to amend, and with a heart full of affection and sorrow, while I consider within myself, and contemplate in my mind, Thy Five most precious wounds; fixing my eyes upon those words long since uttered by the prophet David, they have pierced my hands and my feet, they have numbered all my bones. Amen.
At each “station”, pray 5 Glory Be’s in honor and memory of the Five most Holy Wounds, and one Hail Mary in honor of the Dolors of the Blessed Virgin Mary.
In the first station, you must meditate upon the sufferings endured by Jesus from the Wound of His Left Foot, and implore the remission of your sins.
In the second station, you must meditate upon the sufferings endured by Jesus from the Wound of His Right Foot, and ask for the graces of Final Perseverance and of a holy death.
In the third station, you must meditate upon the sufferings endured by Jesus from the Wound of His Left Hand, and beseech Him to save you from Hell.
In the fourth station, you must meditate upon the sufferings endured by Jesus from the Wound of His Right Hand, and ask him to bestow upon you the joys of Heaven.
In the fifth station, you must, while contemplating the most sacred Wound in His Side, meditate on the immense love borne by the Blessed Heart of Jesus, and ask for Grace to love God.
ACTS OF ADORATION ADDRESSED TO EACH OF THE FIVE MOST HOLY WOUNDS OF JESUS CRUCIFIED
I humbly adore Thee, O most holy Wound of the Left Foot of my Lord, and implore Thee, my crucified Jesus, through the pain thou didst endure in it, and through the blood which thou didst shed from it, grant me the remission of my most grievous offenses, and preserve me from ever again committing them, giving me strength to resist every temptation , even unto death. And I beseech thee, most Blessed Virgin, through the anguish which thou endured on account of this Wound, to intercede for me that my prayer may be heard.
I humbly adore Thee, O holy Wound of the Right Foot of my Redeemer, and I beseech Thee, my crucified Jesus, to grant me the precious gift of perseverance in Thy grace to the last moment of my life, and that of a holy death. And thou, O Mary, my sweet Mother, who didst suffer in they soul, what thy beloved Son endured in His Body, be my Advocate, and obtain this great favor for me.
I humbly adore Thee, O most sacred Wound of the Left Hand of my Saviour, and with a heart filled with tender gratitude for the sufferings Thou didst endure, I beseech Thee, my Crucified Jesus, to deliver me in Thy mercy from the eternal punishment of Hell. And thou, most Sorrowful Virgin, who did endure overwhelming anguish with so great constancy at the foot of the Cross, vouchsafe to ask of thy Son for me the grace not to be condemned to the abode of everlasting torments.
I humbly adore Thee, O Blessed Wound of the Right Hand of my Lord, and with my whole heart do beg of Thee my Crucified Jesus, by the Blood Thou didst shed from it, to grant that on the great day of the General Judgement, I may find myself in the number of the elect, on Thy right hand, and hear myself summoned by Thy own sweet invitation, to enter into the joys of Heaven. And thou, O Mary, my loving Mother, never cease assisting me by thy powerful intercession, that so I may be made worthy to come and behold thee in heaven, and in union with thee to praise and bless God continually.
I humbly adore Thee with my whole soul, most Sweet Wound of the Sacred Side of my Redeemer, and I beseech Thee, my Crucified Jesus, through its merits, and the Blood shed by it, that Thou wouldst enkindle in my heart the most ardent love for Thy infinite goodness. And thou O Immaculate Virgin, Mother of fair love, and Advocate of sinners, through that anguish which thou didst endure when the Side of they Beloved Son was wounded, obtain for me the gift of that love, and imprint in my soul, the memory of His Wounds and thy bitter anguish.
Prayer of St. Francis Xavier.
My Lord Jesus Christ, through those most Holy Wounds which Thou did endure for us on the Cross for love of us, I beseech Thee succor Thy servants whom Thou hast redeemed with Thy Precious Blood.
**
CHAPLET OF THE HOLY WOUNDS**
Incline unto my aid O God. O Lord, make haste to help me. Glory be …etc
O ever good and sweetest Jesus, behold I here fall down upon my knee before Thee, and with all the powers of my soul do beg and beseech Thee to inspire my heart with lively feelings of faith, hope and charity, with true repentance for my sins, with a will resolved to amend, and with a heart full of affection and sorrow, while I consider within myself, and contemplate in my mind, Thy Five most precious wounds; fixing my eyes upon those words long since uttered by the prophet David, they have pierced my hands and my feet, they have numbered all my bones. Amen.
At each “station”, pray 5 Glory Be’s in honor and memory of the Five most Holy Wounds, and one Hail Mary in honor of the Dolors of the Blessed Virgin Mary.
In the first station, you must meditate upon the sufferings endured by Jesus from the Wound of His Left Foot, and implore the remission of your sins.
In the second station, you must meditate upon the sufferings endured by Jesus from the Wound of His Right Foot, and ask for the graces of Final Perseverance and of a holy death.
In the third station, you must meditate upon the sufferings endured by Jesus from the Wound of His Left Hand, and beseech Him to save you from Hell.
In the fourth station, you must meditate upon the sufferings endured by Jesus from the Wound of His Right Hand, and ask him to bestow upon you the joys of Heaven.
In the fifth station, you must, while contemplating the most sacred Wound in His Side, meditate on the immense love borne by the Blessed Heart of Jesus, and ask for Grace to love God.
ACTS OF ADORATION ADDRESSED TO EACH OF THE FIVE MOST HOLY WOUNDS OF JESUS CRUCIFIED
I humbly adore Thee, O most holy Wound of the Left Foot of my Lord, and implore Thee, my crucified Jesus, through the pain thou didst endure in it, and through the blood which thou didst shed from it, grant me the remission of my most grievous offenses, and preserve me from ever again committing them, giving me strength to resist every temptation , even unto death. And I beseech thee, most Blessed Virgin, through the anguish which thou endured on account of this Wound, to intercede for me that my prayer may be heard.
I humbly adore Thee, O holy Wound of the Right Foot of my Redeemer, and I beseech Thee, my crucified Jesus, to grant me the precious gift of perseverance in Thy grace to the last moment of my life, and that of a holy death. And thou, O Mary, my sweet Mother, who didst suffer in they soul, what thy beloved Son endured in His Body, be my Advocate, and obtain this great favor for me.
I humbly adore Thee, O most sacred Wound of the Left Hand of my Saviour, and with a heart filled with tender gratitude for the sufferings Thou didst endure, I beseech Thee, my Crucified Jesus, to deliver me in Thy mercy from the eternal punishment of Hell. And thou, most Sorrowful Virgin, who did endure overwhelming anguish with so great constancy at the foot of the Cross, vouchsafe to ask of thy Son for me the grace not to be condemned to the abode of everlasting torments.
I humbly adore Thee, O Blessed Wound of the Right Hand of my Lord, and with my whole heart do beg of Thee my Crucified Jesus, by the Blood Thou didst shed from it, to grant that on the great day of the General Judgement, I may find myself in the number of the elect, on Thy right hand, and hear myself summoned by Thy own sweet invitation, to enter into the joys of Heaven. And thou, O Mary, my loving Mother, never cease assisting me by thy powerful intercession, that so I may be made worthy to come and behold thee in heaven, and in union with thee to praise and bless God continually.
I humbly adore Thee with my whole soul, most Sweet Wound of the Sacred Side of my Redeemer, and I beseech Thee, my Crucified Jesus, through its merits, and the Blood shed by it, that Thou wouldst enkindle in my heart the most ardent love for Thy infinite goodness. And thou O Immaculate Virgin, Mother of fair love, and Advocate of sinners, through that anguish which thou didst endure when the Side of they Beloved Son was wounded, obtain for me the gift of that love, and imprint in my soul, the memory of His Wounds and thy bitter anguish.
Prayer of St. Francis Xavier.
My Lord Jesus Christ, through those most Holy Wounds which Thou did endure for us on the Cross for love of us, I beseech Thee succor Thy servants whom Thou hast redeemed with Thy Precious Blood.
E
Eucharisted
Guest
The Church is less concerned with where Jesus was nailed - hand or wrist, foot or ankle, right or left side - than with the fact that He was nailed on the Cross and His Heart was pierced.
If you wish to show His Wounds reverence, all you have to do is take your crucifix and kiss each Wound with love. Other ways you can show devotion is by saluting each Wound, praying an Our Father and a Hail Mary for each Wound, hidding sinners in Jesus’ Wounds (“Jesus, I give you poor sinners, I hide them in Your Wounds; have mercy on them, for whom You did suffer and die on the Cross!”), and asking Jesus to give you a share in His suffering.
If you wish to show His Wounds reverence, all you have to do is take your crucifix and kiss each Wound with love. Other ways you can show devotion is by saluting each Wound, praying an Our Father and a Hail Mary for each Wound, hidding sinners in Jesus’ Wounds (“Jesus, I give you poor sinners, I hide them in Your Wounds; have mercy on them, for whom You did suffer and die on the Cross!”), and asking Jesus to give you a share in His suffering.
C
Cluny
Guest
Visions are given in terms the visionary can understand–or the one the message is intended for.The strange thing is, some mystics have ‘seen’ the wounds in one part, some in another. It makes me doubt the authenticity of almost all visions, frankly.
Catherine Ann Emmereich had a vision of Solemn Mass celebrated by St. Peter, with St. James and St. John as deacon and subdeacon.
Would she have recognized the Eucharist as celebrated by the Apostolic Church? I doubt it.
A
Adonia
Guest
I like those words in your first paragraph. The fact that He was nailed on the Cross for us is the relevant act here. As I said earlier, I have a special devotion to St Padre Pio, who in turn makes me strive to emulate Our Lord all the more. ( Your second paragraph wasn’t too shabby either). Thanks!The Church is less concerned with where Jesus was nailed - hand or wrist, foot or ankle, right or left side - than with the fact that He was nailed on the Cross and His Heart was pierced.
If you wish to show His Wounds reverence, all you have to do is take your crucifix and kiss each Wound with love. Other ways you can show devotion is by saluting each Wound, praying an Our Father and a Hail Mary for each Wound, hidding sinners in Jesus’ Wounds (“Jesus, I give you poor sinners, I hide them in Your Wounds; have mercy on them, for whom You did suffer and die on the Cross!”), and asking Jesus to give you a share in His suffering.
L
ladybri77
Guest
Has the church denied the authenticity of Padre Pio’s and others stigmata?Stigmata, in and of themselves, have no doctrinal significance, either, and the Church has never claimed that they did.
C
Cluny
Guest
I’m not entirely sure the Church has made any declaration about anybody’s stigmata.
It was the holiness of his life, his prophetic gifts (seen in his advice to penitents), and the miracles attributed to him after his repose that led to the canonization of Padre Pio.
NOT the fact that he was stigmatized.
Don’t forget that stigmata can have a psychosomatic rather than spiritual origin. In such a case, they would certainly have no spiritual significance.
That’s why I say that stigmata are meaningless in themselves.
And specifically, why I said that stigmata had no doctrinal significance is this: The location of the stigmata on Padre Pio or anyone else has nothing to do with whether the nails at Christ’s crucifixion went through His palms or wrists.
The Church makes no pronouncements concerning the anatomical details of the method of how Christ was crucified based on the location of stigmata of others.
It was the holiness of his life, his prophetic gifts (seen in his advice to penitents), and the miracles attributed to him after his repose that led to the canonization of Padre Pio.
NOT the fact that he was stigmatized.
Don’t forget that stigmata can have a psychosomatic rather than spiritual origin. In such a case, they would certainly have no spiritual significance.
That’s why I say that stigmata are meaningless in themselves.
And specifically, why I said that stigmata had no doctrinal significance is this: The location of the stigmata on Padre Pio or anyone else has nothing to do with whether the nails at Christ’s crucifixion went through His palms or wrists.
The Church makes no pronouncements concerning the anatomical details of the method of how Christ was crucified based on the location of stigmata of others.
L
ladybri77
Guest
I do think the stigmata has spiritual significance not because of where it is located on the palms or wrists but because of what affect it has on the individual and how God wishes to use the stigmata through the person; to further His cause, to evangelize, to strengthen the person’s faith and the faith of others, to share in the suffering of Christ so that he may become more like Christ. I know these things can be done without the stigmata, but it can be a powerful tool used by God to further His kingdom if the person is genuinely of the Lord and uses it for Him.I’m not entirely sure the Church has made any declaration about anybody’s stigmata.
It was the holiness of his life, his prophetic gifts (seen in his advice to penitents), and the miracles attributed to him after his repose that led to the canonization of Padre Pio.
NOT the fact that he was stigmatized.
Don’t forget that stigmata can have a psychosomatic rather than spiritual origin. In such a case, they would certainly have no spiritual significance.
That’s why I say that stigmata are meaningless in themselves.
And specifically, why I said that stigmata had no doctrinal significance is this: The location of the stigmata on Padre Pio or anyone else has nothing to do with whether the nails at Christ’s crucifixion went through His palms or wrists.
The Church makes no pronouncements concerning the anatomical details of the method of how Christ was crucified based on the location of stigmata of others.
C
Cluny
Guest
Stigmata are not in themselves signs of sainthood.I do think the stigmata has spiritual significance not because of where it is located on the palms or wrists but because of what affect it has on the individual and how God wishes to use the stigmata through the person; to further His cause, to evangelize, to strengthen the person’s faith and the faith of others, to share in the suffering of Christ so that he may become more like Christ. I know these things can be done without the stigmata, but it can be a powerful tool used by God to further His kingdom if the person is genuinely of the Lord and uses it for Him.
Rose Marie Ferron (Little Rose) seemed to have borne all the stigmata of Christ, including a crown of thorns–which looked suspiciously like the double-wreath circlet so often seen in popular religious art. This suggests they could be psychosomatic, rather than spiritual in origin. (Of course, I also said that visions are given in terms the visionary can understand. In the case of Little Rose’s crown of thorns, had it been historically or forensically correct, it might not have been recognized.)
There are even devout Shia Muslims who bear the marks of Ali’s assissination–the Moslem equivalent of Christian stigmata. Other adherents of non-Christian religions have experienced comparable phenomena.
As you said, the true test of any sign is the fruit it bears in the lives of the individual or others involved. That’s why, so far as I can tell, the Church officially attributes no significance to stigmata in themselves, but looks for other fruits of holiness.
F
fulbert4605
Guest
Blessed Anne Catherine Emmerich relates this. i am paraphrasing.
Regarding the stigmata, the wounds on the outside parts were smaller than inside of the hands and feet meaning the stakes were triangular. The wound on the right side of Jesus (where He was pierced with the spear by Longinus) is 4th rib from the bottom and 3 inches wide and cuts upward into the body as if stabbed from beneath.
Regarding the Shoulder Wound of Christ which was mentioned in a previous post:
When one honors the wound on Christ’s shoulder (His right shoulder) from carrying the cross it is as if they borne the cross for Him up to Calvary.
Also regarding Anne Catherine’s own stigmata the following is observed:
Wounds of the feet larger than hands. Wounds on back of hands as large as a small coin. Since the hands were pierced (it never mentions wrists being pierced) the middle fingers rose far above the other fingers.
Regarding the stigmata, the wounds on the outside parts were smaller than inside of the hands and feet meaning the stakes were triangular. The wound on the right side of Jesus (where He was pierced with the spear by Longinus) is 4th rib from the bottom and 3 inches wide and cuts upward into the body as if stabbed from beneath.
Regarding the Shoulder Wound of Christ which was mentioned in a previous post:
When one honors the wound on Christ’s shoulder (His right shoulder) from carrying the cross it is as if they borne the cross for Him up to Calvary.
Also regarding Anne Catherine’s own stigmata the following is observed:
Wounds of the feet larger than hands. Wounds on back of hands as large as a small coin. Since the hands were pierced (it never mentions wrists being pierced) the middle fingers rose far above the other fingers.
H
heaven_help_me
Guest
I am not sure of where this prayer comes from but it is one I say when looking upon the crucifix.
My crucified Jesus,
I adore the wounds of Your Sacred Head
with sorrow deep and true.
Let every thought of mine today,
be an act of love to You.
I adore the wounds of Your Sacred Hands,
with sorrow deep and true.
Let every work of my hands today,
be an act of love for You.
I adore the wounds of Your Sacred Feet,
with sorrow deep and true.
Let every step I take,
be an act of love for You.
I adore the wounds of you Sacred Heart,
with sorrow deep and true.
Let every beat of my heart today,
be an act of love for You.
Amen.
My crucified Jesus,
I adore the wounds of Your Sacred Head
with sorrow deep and true.
Let every thought of mine today,
be an act of love to You.
I adore the wounds of Your Sacred Hands,
with sorrow deep and true.
Let every work of my hands today,
be an act of love for You.
I adore the wounds of Your Sacred Feet,
with sorrow deep and true.
Let every step I take,
be an act of love for You.
I adore the wounds of you Sacred Heart,
with sorrow deep and true.
Let every beat of my heart today,
be an act of love for You.
Amen.
E
Eucharisted
Guest
Gloria Dei!I am not sure of where this prayer comes from but it is one I say when looking upon the crucifix.
My crucified Jesus,
I adore the wounds of Your Sacred Head
with sorrow deep and true.
Let every thought of mine today,
be an act of love to You.
I adore the wounds of Your Sacred Hands,
with sorrow deep and true.
Let every work of my hands today,
be an act of love for You.
I adore the wounds of Your Sacred Feet,
with sorrow deep and true.
Let every step I take,
be an act of love for You.
I adore the wounds of you Sacred Heart,
with sorrow deep and true.
Let every beat of my heart today,
be an act of love for You.
Amen.
W
weepixie71
Guest
i believe what she means is that since the stigmata is primarily associated with the Roman Catholic Church she is curious what the Church has to say about the matter.Stigmata, in and of themselves, have no doctrinal significance, either, and the Church has never claimed that they did.
there is plenty the Catholic Church teaches that is not dogma. a good example of this is Our Lady of Fatima. it is not dogma. you do not have to believe in it but the Church none the less teaches it in the schools of Children, have processions in her honor, and statues and traveling statues in their churches.
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