Theology of the Trinity

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Im pasting wording from the Mystical City of God vol. Approved private revelation. WARNING. CHEW ON THIS SLOWLY
  1. I saw the Most High, at the same time under
    standing how his Majesty is in Himself; I received a
    clear intelligence and a true perception of what is meant by a God, infinite in his substance and attributes, eternal, exalted above all, being three in Person, and one true God. Three in Person, because of the three activities of
    knowing, comprehending and loving each other; one, so as to secure the boon of eternal unity.
    It is the Trinity of the Father, the Son and the Holy Ghost.
    The Father is not made, nor created, nor begotten, nor can He be generated or have a beginning. I perceived, that the Son derives his origin from the Father alone by eternal generation; and that They are equal in their duration from eternity ;
    and that He is begotten by the fecundity (FERTILITY)
    of the intelligence of the Father. The Holy Ghost proceeds from the Father and the Son through love.
    In their indivisible Trinity there is nothing which can be
    called first or last, greater or smaller: all three Persons
    are equally eternal and eternally equal ; there is unity of
    essence in a trinity of persons.
 
Nor are the Persons mingled in order to form one God, nor the divine sub stance separated or divided in order to form three Persons, being distinct as the Father, as the Son and as theHoly Ghost. They are nevertheless one and the same
Divinity, equal in Each is the glory, and majesty, the
power, the eternity, the immensity, the wisdom and sanc
tity, and all the attributes. And though there are three
Persons, in whom these infinite perfections subsist, He
is the one and true God, the Holy, the Just, the Power
ful, the Eternal and the Measureless.
28. I also obtained an understanding of the manner in
which this Trinity comprehends Itself by simple vision,
so that no new or distinct cognition is necessary : the
Father knows that, which is known to the Son, and the
Son and the Holy Ghost know that which is in the in
telligence of the Father. I understood how they love
One another with one and the same immense and eternal love; how there is a single, indivisible and equal oneness of intelligence, love and action, how there is one simple, incorporeal and indivisible nature, a divine essence of the true God, in which are joined and united all the perfections in their highest and in an infinite degree.
 
Sacred Scriptures themselves provide the clearest understanding of the Three Divine Persons…

God… Son of God and God’s Spirit
  • are constantly mentioned all throughout -
    without any sense of not distinguishing each Divine Person…
Rather as in close familiarity

_
 
EndTimes said:
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goout:
Love is meaningless without a lover and a beloved, so it is between persons.
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Not so… GOD IS LOVE…

LOVE IS A QUALITY - AN ACTUALITY

_

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I have no idea what you are responding to.
Did I say God is not love?
What are you responding to, and would you like to have a conversation about it?
 
I accept the common Catholic definition of love:
love is to will the good of the other, for the sake of the other.
What is your working definition?
 
The dogma of the Holy Trinity
253 The Trinity is One. We do not confess three Gods, but one God in three persons, the “consubstantial Trinity”.83 The divine persons do not share the one divinity among themselves but each of them is God whole and entire: "The Father is that which the Son is, the Son that which the Father is, the Father and the Son that which the Holy Spirit is, i.e. by nature one God."84 In the words of the Fourth Lateran Council (1215), "Each of the persons is that supreme reality, viz., the divine substance, essence or nature."85

254 The divine persons are really distinct from one another. "God is one but not solitary."86 “Father”, “Son”, “Holy Spirit” are not simply names designating modalities of the divine being, for they are really distinct from one another: "He is not the Father who is the Son, nor is the Son he who is the Father, nor is the Holy Spirit he who is the Father or the Son."87 They are distinct from one another in their relations of origin: "It is the Father who generates, the Son who is begotten, and the Holy Spirit who proceeds."88 The divine Unity is Triune.

255 The divine persons are relative to one another. Because it does not divide the divine unity, the real distinction of the persons from one another resides solely in the relationships which relate them to one another: "In the relational names of the persons the Father is related to the Son, the Son to the Father, and the Holy Spirit to both. While they are called three persons in view of their relations, we believe in one nature or substance."89 Indeed "everything (in them) is one where there is no opposition of relationship."90 "Because of that unity the Father is wholly in the Son and wholly in the Holy Spirit; the Son is wholly in the Father and wholly in the Holy Spirit; the Holy Spirit is wholly in the Father and wholly in the Son."91
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In addition:
IV. THE DIVINE WORKS AND THE TRINITARIAN MISSIONS

257 "O blessed light, O Trinity and first Unity!"93 God is eternal blessedness, undying life, unfading light. God is love: Father, Son and Holy Spirit. God freely wills to communicate the glory of his blessed life. Such is the “plan of his loving kindness”, conceived by the Father before the foundation of the world, in his beloved Son: “He destined us in love to be his sons” and “to be conformed to the image of his Son”, through “the spirit of sonship”.94 This plan is a "grace [which] was given to us in Christ Jesus before the ages began", stemming immediately from Trinitarian love.95 It unfolds in the work of creation, the whole history of salvation after the fall, and the missions of the Son and the Spirit, which are continued in the mission of the Church.96
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Before there were created human beings to think about definitions of love, God is love. Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
 
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goout said:
Before there were created human beings to think about definitions of love, God is love. Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
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Of course God IS LOVE …

AND LOVE AS GOD - does not need anything other than ITSELF
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EndTimes said:
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goout:
Before there were created human beings to think about definitions of love, God is love. Father, Son and Holy Spirit.
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Of course God IS LOVE …

AND LOVE AS GOD - does not need anything other than ITSELF
_
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You need to take this up with a pastor or a theologian. Your disagreement is not with me it’s with the catechism.
 
aitapyh said:
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goout:
Love is meaningless without a lover and a beloved, so it is between persons.
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I don’t think so. I believe love is a state of being.
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ok, as I’ve noted, we are starting from completely different premises so the discussion is not really going to come together.

Love is an act of the will towards another person, for that person’s sake.
Love does not have the self as it’s object and it’s not self contained, or stagnant, or static. It flows out by nature to the other. And because it flows out, it is also creative.
 
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I love me truly, truly dear,
Life with it’s sorrow, life with it’s tear,
Fades into dreams when I feel myself near,
For I love me truly,
Truly dear!
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Human intuition tells us that love without a beloved is perverse.
 
aitapyh said:
Do you agree we have a lover, a beloved, and the love exchanged between them?
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Yes
Do you also agree that the love exchanged between them is not the lover itself nor the beloved itself?
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No, love is bound up with the persons, not a vague quality disconnected from them. Love doesn’t make sense without lover and beloved.

Love does not have itself as it’s object, and it is not some inanimate quality that does nothing.
Love is not sterile it is fruitful.
 
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aitapyh said:
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goout:
Human intuition tells us that love without a beloved is perverse.
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Would you agree that scripture says that mans ways are not Gods? Why would you make mans intuition and Gods condition comparable? You’ve got it completely backwards…a lover without love is perverse because the lover is defined by love. You cannot make a meaningful statement such as “Love without a lover is perverse.” Simply because the two are not in the same classification. That would be like word yellow without having the color yellow. The color gives meaning to the word, the word doesn’t give meaning to the color. You cant make the word meaningful if nothing exists that it defines. You can have a color exist however in spite of there being no word which is given meaning by it. We see a color then create a word for it, we don’t see a word then create a color for it.
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Well, my friend, you are appealing to common sense language usage, while using a very individualistic definition of love…
Contradiction.

God’s ways are not our ways. And God reveals his ways. And love is his way, his being. And love does not have itself as an object.

And what you doing is an argument from confusion; basically you are saying that because man doesn’t know everything for sure, common sense knowledge is now up for grabs. I don’t think so.
 
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aitapyh said:
Why have you all abandoned this discussion? There is so much here to discover and contemplate.
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I’m glad you said, “discussion” - rather than “debate”

For, debate suggests that its purpose is to find out an unknown as yet answer to a question…

Since GOD IS LOVE, it behooves any who do not fully understand that - to work on Understanding it.

Understanding? As with Wisdom… Is one of the Gifts of God’s Holy Spirit…

Don’t Understand? Pray to God in Faith (and not doubt) to give you e.g,. Understanding…
  1. Consider it pure joy, my brothers and sisters, whenever you face trials of many kinds, because you know that the testing of your faith produces perseverance. Let perseverance finish its work so that you may be mature and complete, not lacking anything. If any of you lacks WISDOM you should ask God, who gives generously to all without finding fault, and it will be given to you. But when you ask, you must believe and not doubt, because the one who doubts is like a wave of the sea, blown and tossed by the wind. That person should not expect to receive anything from the Lord. Such a person is double-minded and unstable in all they do.
 
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God gives us through prayer does not exclude a continued search for true knowledge about a subject.
aitapyh said:
I am not sure what you mean in relation to the quote as concerns this yes from wisdom. Could you elaborate?
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Of course - but, not, necessarily always a “yes” from Wisdom

What I mean(t) was/is - and in a generic manner…
It depends upon the subject matter that you’re initially involved in
  • and then go about seeking more Understanding… …
Not all of what we pursue - is wise to always do.

Wisdom supersedes Understanding which supercedes Knowledge. .
 
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