"There is no virtue to be had..."

[Just_wondering]

“… in marrying a poor man. It doesn’t make you more virtuous, it just makes you poor.”
So says an acquaintance of mine (Catholic).

That got me thinking. I know this guy doesn’t think I should marry my boyfriend, due in a large part to the fact that my boyfriend is from a poor country. We have discussed his reasons, and I have considered them. This one makes me wonder, a bit.

Doesn’t poverty lead in some way to virtue? I’m not saying that marrying a poorer man lets me brag to my friends that I took the more virtuous path - I’m saying that there will be opportunities to become virtuous that a more comfortable life doesn’t always provide. It would be a different situation if I were choosing between a good rich man and a good poor man, but I’m not. I’m choosing to marry the good poor man that I have found. I say the fact that he’s a good, virtuous man outweighs the fact that he’s poor.

He is a virtuous man, and so he will help me become more virtuous. He’s not that poor, either - between us we have less than $2000 debt. The issue is just that he isn’t the kind of guy who’ll be earning six-figure incomes. He’s always worked in blue-collar jobs, and we’d like to open our own (modest) business. I’ll probably always have to work part-time, either in our own business or outside the home. Our kids may have to share bedrooms. (Hope we have enough kids for that!) We may be poor by North American standards, but we’ll be comfortable enough (eating rice and beans a lot, perhaps) and we’ll be rich by his country’s standards. It seems like a nice enough life to me, with him by my side.

So what do you think? Is there virtue to be had in marrying a poor man? Or would you advise your daughters to fall in love with a rich man?

 

[KCtheMommy]

I’m married to a poor man – my family thinks I married a SAINT.

He married ME after all.

Who cares? If you are materialistic don’t marry poor. You don’t strike me as materialistic, so mary poor. Also – you have more power than you realize – a great woman can lift a good man higher than he ever imagined.

 

[JustinR]

a poor man that is a natural saver is better than a rich man who spends like he is rich.

a man who make $12,000 a year and lives on $10,500 equals Happiness and contentment

a man who makes $85,000 a year and spends $92,000 equals Trouble and stress

 

[LilyM]

a poor man that is a natural saver is better than a rich man who spends like he is rich.

a man who make $12,000 a year and lives on $10,500 equals Happiness and contentment

a man who makes $85,000 a year and spends $92,000 equals Trouble and stress

absitively posolutely

I think poverty isn’t for everyone though - for some it causes trouble in the marriage, whereas others can stick together firmly for poorer as well as richer.

Just like for St Francis poverty was a source of sanctity, whereas for others in Assisi it was doubtless just an incitment to theft or other sins.

 

[joandarc2008]

Sounds like your other male friend may have other reasons for picking on your marriage interest. Are you sure that he just wants to be friends or do you think he has other motives? If he has other motives and you are looking elsewhere this may cause problems with ANY relationship you have in the future.

God bless,

 

[KingAlfred]

“… in marrying a poor man. It doesn’t make you more virtuous, it just makes you poor.”
So says an acquaintance of mine (Catholic).

That got me thinking. I know this guy doesn’t think I should marry my boyfriend, due in a large part to the fact that my boyfriend is from a poor country. We have discussed his reasons, and I have considered them. This one makes me wonder, a bit.

Doesn’t poverty lead in some way to virtue? I’m not saying that marrying a poorer man lets me brag to my friends that I took the more virtuous path - I’m saying that there will be opportunities to become virtuous that a more comfortable life doesn’t always provide. It would be a different situation if I were choosing between a good rich man and a good poor man, but I’m not. I’m choosing to marry the good poor man that I have found. I say the fact that he’s a good, virtuous man outweighs the fact that he’s poor.

He is a virtuous man, and so he will help me become more virtuous. He’s not that poor, either - between us we have less than $2000 debt. The issue is just that he isn’t the kind of guy who’ll be earning six-figure incomes. He’s always worked in blue-collar jobs, and we’d like to open our own (modest) business. I’ll probably always have to work part-time, either in our own business or outside the home. Our kids may have to share bedrooms. (Hope we have enough kids for that!) We may be poor by North American standards, but we’ll be comfortable enough (eating rice and beans a lot, perhaps) and we’ll be rich by his country’s standards. It seems like a nice enough life to me, with him by my side.

So what do you think? Is there virtue to be had in marrying a poor man? Or would you advise your daughters to fall in love with a rich man?

His material status should have nothing to do with your decision to marry him. Education, on the other hand, might have some bearing, as it goes to the issue of compatibility and shared worldviews.

 

[Sierrah]

I always believed you were supposed to marry the person and not the income. Some opt for security others for a trophy spouse. I would prefer to marry someone I loved poor or rich be that as it may. I don’t think being poor is a particular virtue but the bible does say that the rich man does have a harder time getting into heaven. Since I’ve always been poor and don’t know about any other life style it wouldn’t bother me in a spouse. What I think is more important is someone you can connect with, communicate with and love as Jesus calls us to love.

 

[Lil_M]

Sierrah got the verse I was thinking of: It’s easier for a camel to pass through the eye of a needle than for a rich man to enter the Kingdom of God. (paraphrased Matt 19:24).

“Things” are nice. Yes. But we cannot take them with us. All we can do is try to store our treasure in heaven and not on earth.

This is very difficult in our materialistic world. We must balance our needs with our wants, as well as take into consideration those who cannot meet their needs and depend on others assistance.

If you marry for money, you’ll always wish you’d married for love. Better to marry for love and cut coupons I wouldn’t worry what another friend thinks as long as YOU know he is the right person.

 

[RHC]

If you marry for money, you’ll always wish you’d married for love. Better to marry for love and cut coupons I wouldn’t worry what another friend thinks as long as YOU know he is the right person.

:clapping: SO true.

 

[iluvmybabies]

Hahaha I will be marrying a poor man! I had married a poor man before too, and even though to me I had a good life, he was materialistic and forced me to work a lot!! LOL…He wouldn’t but I had to!! How does that work?

This new poor man doesn’t care for materialistic things, we are living acceptable, not comfortable yet, surviving and it’s fine. I of course hope that he will finish his education and then things will get comfortable at least I won’t have to be living off of foodstamps to feed my kids and myself…and that’s ok…

We are not materialistic, all we really want is to have enough to live well…you know?! And I work part-time, and hopefully soon he will start working full-time so we’ll be ok! God willing!!

Now if you love him, then please go for it! Money isn’t everything…My sister and her husband made over 90 grand a year yet they don’t even own their own place…it’s pretty sad…

So please…don’t worry about money, my ex is trying to take my child support away and you know what I am leaving it in GOD’s hands, I am not worrying myself because I look way too old to be with my fiance, and way to old for worrying, and I am not OLD at all!! Pretty sad…Anyhow, the point is that as long as you love each other trust in GOD that He will provide everything you need, just continue working together and you will make it through anything…

And just thought I should let you know, my family thinks my fiance is a SAINT as well!! LOL…

 

[puzzleannie]

“… in marrying a poor man. It doesn’t make you more virtuous, it just makes you poor.”
So says an acquaintance of mine (Catholic).

?

i think it is true as far as it goes. What I would look for in someone to spend my life with, and hope my daughters would marry, is someone who is poor in spirit, quite a different thing. A person can be poor and still be greedy, driven by need to aquire material possessions, and miserly. So can a rich person have these traits. being poor by itself is not a virtue, but it is an opportunity to practice virtue. so is being rich

 

[iluvmybabies]

i think it is true as far as it goes. What I would look for in someone to spend my life with, and hope my daughters would marry, is someone who is poor in spirit, quite a different thing. A person can be poor and still be greedy, driven by need to aquire material possessions, and miserly. So can a rich person have these traits. being poor by itself is not a virtue, but it is an opportunity to practice virtue. so is being rich

YUP!!! That’s true that was my ex right there!! LOL…We were poor but he was no where near poor in spirit, he makes over 3 grand gross monthly and has no involvement with the children at all, not once has he come to see them in 3 years and he won’t even send them a gift card or bday card for their bdays, and I barely live off of 1500 a month, 400 in foodstamps and am with my children 24/7…morning, noon and night!! LOL…And he’s still trying to take child support away that he hasn’t even paid on over 3 months!! LOL…

I know about greedy poor people!!!

Just like there are rich people that are poor in spirit…

 

[whatevergirl]

I think that as long as you are happy, JW, than money will not be an issue. I don’t think that there is virtue in purposely finding someone “poor” to marry. I would say that if you marry someone who puts God first, the relationship second, and works hard in whatever job he has…those are the important things.

I don’t think marrying someone ‘rich’ means a person is materialistic whatsoever. I know quite a few wealthy people who are not greedy, and are very generous, loving individuals. My dad was one of them. He always placed God first, and for the short time I had with him on this earth, he taught me that money will not make a person happy…it simply can buy some nice things. We live in a materialistic world, that is true, but not all people who make large paychecks are greedy, and materialistic either.

I think that if your bf is a determined, motivated, and hard working man…whether or not that will lead to wealth, is not important. What’s important is that he possesses those virtues, and has character. Those things are priceless, and there are many wealthy people who don’t possess the positive character that your bf has.

I’m wondering, like the other poster said, if this ‘friend’ of yours is interested in you as more than a friend. Could be. I don’t know if I’d continue to hang around with someone who continued to put my bf down, which if this is the same friend from other posts, seems to do a lot of.

When are you guys getting married already?

 

[whatevergirl]

YUP!!! That’s true that was my ex right there!! LOL…We were poor but he was no where near poor in spirit, he makes over 3 grand gross monthly and has no involvement with the children at all, not once has he come to see them in 3 years and he won’t even send them a gift card or bday card for their bdays, and I barely live off of 1500 a month, 400 in foodstamps and am with my children 24/7…morning, noon and night!! LOL…And he’s still trying to take child support away that he hasn’t even paid on over 3 months!! LOL…

I know about greedy poor people!!!

Just like there are rich people that are poor in spirit…

Yes, greed is actually a character flaw …it isn’t contingent upon the dollars in one’s bank account…that is true.

 

[mercygate]

i think it is true as far as it goes. What I would look for in someone to spend my life with, and hope my daughters would marry, is someone who is poor in spirit, quite a different thing. A person can be poor and still be greedy, driven by need to aquire material possessions, and miserly. So can a rich person have these traits. being poor by itself is not a virtue, but it is an opportunity to practice virtue. so is being rich

As always, Annie is right: it’s not the money it’s the attitude about the money that counts.

That said, the ability to support a family is definitely something to look for in a husband. More marriages founder over $$$ issues than any other; so get it straight in your head BEFORE the creditors start ringing your doorbell.

As somebody said up-thread: poor and debt-free is WAY better than living “rich” and shouldering a load of debt.

 

[kevinsgirl]

Better to marry for love and cut coupons I wouldn’t worry what another friend thinks as long as YOU know he is the right person.

Ditto!

DH doesn’t make that much, but we’ve been living on his income ever since we got married. I plan on quitting my job when the baby comes–but we’ve been saving up my earnings to afford it. Having to be careful about money doesn’t mean you won’t have a wonderful loving marriage–you just have to keep money in perspective and be on the same page with your spouse on finances. That goes for any marriage–whether you are very well off or just scraping buy. It isn’t just poor people who fight about money.

 

[chevalier]

Thinking that marrying a poor man is necessarily superior to marrying a wealthier one would be misguided. Obviously, it may show some virtue that a woman decided to marry the poor man she loved rather than the rich one she didn’t, perhaps a woman looking specifically for a poor man could have her good reasons, but generally, it is rather neutral.

 

[Just_wondering]

a poor man that is a natural saver is better than a rich man who spends like he is rich.

a man who make $12,000 a year and lives on $10,500 equals Happiness and contentment

a man who makes $85,000 a year and spends $92,000 equals Trouble and stress

Good point!

Sounds like your other male friend may have other reasons for picking on your marriage interest. Are you sure that he just wants to be friends or do you think he has other motives? If he has other motives and you are looking elsewhere this may cause problems with ANY relationship you have in the future.

God bless,

I am limiting contact with this friend. He has a negative attitude toward life in general, and tends to complain about everything when I see him. I told him my personal life isn’t up for discussion anymore - but I may just avoid him altogether. As for whether he’s interested in me, I suspect it. I also ignore it. He’s married.

His material status should have nothing to do with your decision to marry him. Education, on the other hand, might have some bearing, as it goes to the issue of compatibility and shared worldviews.

Another good point. We both put a high value on education, although I have more than him.

If you marry for money, you’ll always wish you’d married for love. Better to marry for love and cut coupons I wouldn’t worry what another friend thinks as long as YOU know he is the right person.

Hehehe… luckily, there are no rich men trying to sweep me off my feet to tempt me! I know my boyfriend is the right person for me - but I have to admit, the thought of being as broke as I am today for the rest of my life is daunting - not that we will be.

I think that if your bf is a determined, motivated, and hard working man…whether or not that will lead to wealth, is not important. What’s important is that he possesses those virtues, and has character. Those things are priceless, and there are many wealthy people who don’t possess the positive character that your bf has.

I’m wondering, like the other poster said, if this ‘friend’ of yours is interested in you as more than a friend. Could be. I don’t know if I’d continue to hang around with someone who continued to put my bf down, which if this is the same friend from other posts, seems to do a lot of.

When are you guys getting married already?

Thanks, WG! My bf is hard working, determined, and motivated. He’s also loving, generous, and responsible. I love that man!

I told the other guy he’s not allowed to discuss my life and my relationship anymore, because I’m sick of hearing what he has to say. I suspect he may be interested in me, but he’s married, and even if he weren’t I wouldn’t be interested in him. (I know his wife, too - lovely lady.) I’m planning to limit future contact with him.

And when are we getting married already? Still don’t know. (And my mom always said I can’t say I’m engaged until we’ve picked the wedding date!) The custody results and legal annulment results are expected in about 9 weeks (not that I’m counting ) and after that we can start making plans… except that the lawyer said we should expect an appeal, too. And I don’t have time off to visit him until May - so I’m hoping that everything can be sorted out by then. I’ve got about 6 months of pining and whining left!

 

[Ruthie]

My niece gave me a coffee mug with a woman saying, “All of the good men are not either gay or married. Some are poor.”

As some wise man said long ago,

Better is a dinner of herbs where love is than a fatted ox and hatred with it. (Prov 15:17 RSV)

God bless you,

Ruthie