Things heating up in Australia over new mandatory reporting of confessions law

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Hope1960 said:
From everything I’ve read, priests will never break the seal of the Confessional.
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Except that if such a thing happened and there was a possibility of keeping it secret, we know, as a result of the abuse scandal, that Church authorities would most certainly do so. So everything you have read would say that.
 
FiveLinden said:
Except that if such a thing happened and there was a possibility of keeping it secret, we know, as a result of the abuse scandal, that Church authorities would most certainly do so. So everything you have read would say that.
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Church authorities would break the seal or wouldn’t?
 
Hope1960 said:
Do you really believe law enforcement is bugging Catholic Confessionals?
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They don’t have to. Our mobile phones already do it for them. 🤷‍♀️

(Seriously, though, either don’t bring it or completely turn it off. Any app you’ve given microphone permissions to could theoretically be listening.)
 
Again, I don’t know what the confessionals look like in Australia, but in USA, if one doesn’t go face-to-face, there is very little possibility a priest could identify you as you are completely behind a wall or screen.

A large number of people I know never go face to face. You can tell this because when there is an event with a bunch of priests hearing confessions, many people will troop out to the anonymous confessional and stand in a long line rather than go to the priest hearing them face to face who has no line or a short line.

I really don’t think anybody thought this law through from a practical standpoint.
 
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It has happened. There was an incident in 2010 in Eugene, OR where a priest was called to confess a prisoner in the Lane County Jail, the conversation was intentionally recorded and the DA was going to use it in evidence. It took the diocese bringing a lawsuit and publicity to get a court to seal it, but the recording was not destroyed. That is just one incident we know about. If the DA had just used that confession as background information and not tried to bring it out in court, we wouldn’t even know about that one.

Federal agencies are always listening in on stuff. As long as they don’t try to use it as direct evidence, we will never know about it. I have no doubt, none whatsoever that if they thought they had a reason to do it, they would.
 
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Yes, the prudent thing for priests would be the complete elimination of face-to-face confessions.
 
The seal of the confessional is meant to protect penitents, not priests. Eliminating face-to-face would only protect priests and do little to protect penitents, so I think it is solving the wrong problem.

If law enforcement wants to find out what’s going on in a confessional, they can. There are listening devices now that are completely undetectable. They can even “bluejack” the penitents and the priests cell phones to listen. There are devices don’t even have to physically be placed in the confessional. And there are voice recognition systems that can tell who is on the recording. A paper published in 2015 determined that the iPhone app “Siri” can ID a person after they have only spoken two words to a plus or minus 2% accuracy. The cops have much more sophisticated stuff.

What Australia needs to do is take back control of its own government, which is completely out of control. In the US, we need to do the same. Our law enforcement doesn’t even respond to the direction of the president, the AG or the Congress. That has got to stop.
 
Woah there, this is old news.

Let’s wait and see what happens next week. Let’s see what the Australian Bishops response is to the recommendations
 
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So does this law require priests to report ALL felonies confessed in the confessional, or just child abuse?

If it’s just child abuse, it’s more of just a blatant attack on the Church than anything else.
 
That won’t happen in the US, as it would be an obvious violation of the First Amendment and also the separation of church and state.
 
I am thinking the Australian Bishops response will be handed down tomorrow, Friday, at around 5pm. I could be wrong though. Hopefully we will have information about it Sunday in Mass, from our Bishop. He is really good and prompt at keeping us up to date.

If not earlier from the ABC or melbourne Catholic page.
 
The law is not Australia wide, it will be up to each state to decide on its adoption and in what form.

So far Canberra and South Australia have indicated they will bring the law in, Victoria, won’t.
But each state is also free to form the mechanics of the law and punishments for disregarding it.

The law is proposed to make mandatory reporting of suspected child abuse cases, or suspected abuse of vulnerable adults, standardised across all institutions.

It is not an intended blatant attack on the church. There is nothing in its intention to do that.
If there were, the Australian Bishops conference would not have had 9 months to respond.
Its simply a response to the horrific historical child sex abuse we have experienced in this country.

The Magisterium and the Bishops have been working together on an appropriate response. And Canon lawyers examining the mechanics of the Seal of Confession very closely.
 
How do they not realize they are infringing on religious freedom? It’s a joke they think priests will actually do this.
 
We must not accord labels to this that are not the core of the issue.

The core of the issue is universal mandatory reporting of child and vulnerable adult sexual abuse. And in the light of our horrific history, some of which USA has begun to experience for itself, this month with the Grand Jury report, A method to ensure it never happens again.

from the Bishops conference

AUSTRALIAN CATHOLIC BISHOPS CONFERENCE

Bishops to focus on Royal Commission at August meeting

Media Release July 26, 2018

The Australian Catholic Bishops Conference has convened an additional plenary meeting for 2018 to expedite the Catholic Church’s response to the Royal Commission into Institutional Responses to Child Sexual Abuse.

The meeting will be held in Melbourne on August 2 and 3, and will allow the bishops to consider, as a body, the Church’s formal response to the Royal Commission.

“The bishops hadn’t received enough advice at their May meeting to prepare our response to the Royal Commission’s final report,” ACBC president Archbishop Mark Coleridge said.

“Additional advice, including from the Truth, Justice and Healing Council, the Implementation Advisory Group, Catholic Professional Standards Limited, local safeguarding experts and canon lawyers has now been received and is informing the bishops’ response.

“We have also begun discussions with the Holy See about issues that concern the discipline and doctrine of the universal Church.”

Representatives from Catholic Religious Australia, the Implementation Advisory Group and Catholic Professional Standards Limited will attend the meeting.

Archbishop Coleridge said he hoped the Australian Catholic Bishops Conference’s formal response to the Royal Commission would be released as soon as possible after the August plenary meeting.

“We decided we couldn’t wait until our next scheduled plenary meeting in late November to finalise our response,” he said.

The bishops will also receive an update on the Catholic Church’s participation in the National Redress Scheme and on Commonwealth funding for Catholic schools at next week’s meeting.

so note the Bold.

Now the Bishops conference is expected to release its response this week.
And please note the bolded statement. That is crucial.
 
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so what will the Bishops Conference release

Here is what we are told

AUSTRALIAN CATHOLIC BISHOPS CONFERENCE

Bishops to release formal Royal Commission response this month

Media Release August 3, 2018

The Australian Catholic Bishops Conference has today agreed that it will release its formal response to the Royal Commission into Institutional Responses to Child Sexual Abuse by the end of the month.

It will also release the four volumes of the Truth, Justice and Healing Council’s final report.

“After two productive days of meetings, the bishops have reached a common position on the Royal Commission’s recommendations relating to the Catholic Church and its various ministries,” ACBC president Archbishop Mark Coleridge said.

“The Bishops Conference and the president of Catholic Religious Australia agreed that the close collaboration between the two bodies during the life of the Royal Commission and in the area of the protection of children and vulnerable people should continue.”

The Catholic Religious Australia Council, which meets later this month, will work with the ACBC to finalise the Catholic Church’s response.

“Through the Truth, Justice and Healing Council, the bishops and religious orders have engaged productively with the Royal Commission and within the Church in recent years, shaping a shared voice and approach,” Archbishop Coleridge said.

“It’s therefore appropriate that our formal response to the Commission’s recommendations and our response to child sexual abuse should also be made together.”

Representatives of Catholic Religious Australia, Catholic Professional Standards Limited and the Church’s Implementation Advisory Group were key contributors to the bishops’ deliberations this week.
 
jfz178 said:
f law enforcement wants to find out what’s going on in a confessional, they can. There are listening devices now that are completely undetectable. They can even “bluejack” the penitents and the priests cell phones to listen. There are devices don’t even have to physically be placed in the confessional. And there are voice recognition systems that can tell who is on the recording. A paper published in 2015 determined that the iPhone app “Siri” can ID a person after they have only spoken two words to a plus or minus 2% accuracy. The cops have much more sophisticated stuff.
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Priests and penitents should not take cell phones or any other device into the confessional with them. Unless one has no objection to one’s confession being stored in the cloud for future use.
 
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