Thinking for one’s self?

[D_Martin]

Could thinking for one’s self be over rated? Truthfully, thinking for one’s self would only qualify in the self justification of one’s self, in the presence of one’s self. As in what we think is only justified by ourselves, and no one else, unless of corse some one else agrees to think the same.

(Hope that was said clearly)

 

[Love4All]

Could thinking for one’s self be over rated? Truthfully, thinking for one’s self would only qualify in the self justification of one’s self, in the presence of one’s self. As in what we think is only justified by ourselves, and no one else, unless of corse some one else agrees to think the same.

(Hope that was said clearly)

Do you have an alternative way of arriving at thought?

 

[ThinkingSapien]

Could thinking for one’s self be over rated?

I’ve not seen it “rated.” But I have seen is encouraged and psuedo-encouraged (ex: think for yourself until you come to the conclusion that I want you to. Other conclusions don’t qualify).

Truthfully, thinking for one’s self would only qualify in the self justification of one’s self, in the presence of one’s self.

Not necessarily. It can be helpful in raising or exercising one’s capability. For example, often times math equations can be performed by machines but students are encouraged to work out equations without their calculating machines.

As in what we think is only justified by ourselves, and no one else, unless of [course] some one else agrees to think the same.

I don’t think so, one can be convinced her conclusions are wrong.

 

[D_Martin]

Not necessarily. It can be helpful in raising or exercising one’s capability. For example, often times math equations can be performed by machines but students are encouraged to work out equations without their calculating machines.

I don’t think so, one can be convinced her conclusions are wrong.

I’m sorry but it seems you might not understand what is meant by thinking for your self or one’s self.

If I use a shovel or a backhoe to dig a hole I still dug the hole. If I use pencil and paper or a calculator, I still got the result desired. This has nothing to do with what is meant by “thinking for yourself”, especially in philosophy.

It is mainly in the environment of trusting your own judgement, and no one else’s, not even God’s Judgement.

 

[tonyrey]

Thinking for ourselves cannot be overrated because our ultimate authority is our conscience and we are all responsible for our own destiny. It is possible though to overrate our opinions and conclusions by failing to consider the teaching of the Church. Jesus founded His community to guide us towards the truth because by ourselves we cannot possibly find all the answers…

 

[D_Martin]

Thinking for ourselves cannot be overrated because our ultimate authority is our conscience and we are all responsible for our own destiny. It is possible though to overrate our opinions and conclusions by failing to consider the teaching of the Church. Jesus founded His community to guide us towards the truth because by ourselves we cannot possibly find all the answers…

tonyrey

We are not going to be judged by what we are conscience of, we are to be judged by what God is conscience of. (Smarts, “intellect” and lack of smarts, is not a qualification for salvation)

Can one live with one’s self? Well that would be according to one’s own judgement wouldn’t it? But that doesn’t help anyone in the heat of torment, correct?

But in God’s Judgement what’s the answer? And in all honesty, can He, and will He live with us? Will He have Grace toward those who trust His Judgement, or those who trust their own judgement? And it would seem one would trust that God’s Judgement is for him, rather then of him, otherwise how could one embrace God’s Judgements?

 

[tonyrey]

Thinking for ourselves cannot be overrated because our ultimate authority is our conscience and we are all responsible for our own destiny. It is possible though to overrate our opinions and conclusions by failing to consider the teaching of the Church. Jesus founded His community to guide us towards the truth because by ourselves we cannot possibly find all the answers…

I agree. We’re not expected to be infallible but impeccable.

Can one live with one’s self? Well that would be according to one’s own judgement wouldn’t it? But that doesn’t help anyone in the heat of torment, correct?
But in God’s Judgement what’s the answer? And in all honesty, can He, and will He live with us? Will He have Grace toward those who trust His Judgement, or those who trust their own judgement?

Let’s thank God for taking into account our ignorance and weakness!

 

[atheistgirl]

(ex: think for yourself until you come to the conclusion that I want you to. Other conclusions don’t qualify).

:sad_yes::sad_yes::sad_yes:

Sarah x

 

[Paddy_Walker]

君なくて
まことに多大の
木立哉

 

[Michael_Allen]

I’d say even deciding to trust another is thinking for oneself. People might say “I trust the Church” but that is a decision they have made themselves, just as others will say “I trust the Q,ran”. Of course upbringing is extremely influential in who we trust, but we still have to give consent to continuing our cultural upbringing.

Even when we say “I trust X”, I think I see a lot of “filtering” going on - everyone also comes with, for example, political and national paradigms that come in to play. When Papa Francesco, for example, says he’d like to see a poor Church for poor people - lots of people who say they trust the Pope will find a way of viewing that in a way that is comfortable for the rest of their views and life. Few people totally abandon themselves to other’s and when that does happen it well may be quite dangerous (such as the followers of David Koresh or Jim Jones). I think we even struggle to fully trust Jesus and what he taught - we often find ways of sanitizing it a little so we can still enjoy a certain level of lifestyle (with a few notable, wonderful and inspiring exceptions such as Francesco of Assisi).

 

[fhansen]

Could thinking for one’s self be over rated? Truthfully, thinking for one’s self would only qualify in the self justification of one’s self, in the presence of one’s self. As in what we think is only justified by ourselves, and no one else, unless of corse some one else agrees to think the same.

(Hope that was said clearly)

Nope. It’s always better if we just think for other people.

 

[jimmy]

I’m sorry but it seems you might not understand what is meant by thinking for your self or one’s self.

If I use a shovel or a backhoe to dig a hole I still dug the hole. If I use pencil and paper or a calculator, I still got the result desired. This has nothing to do with what is meant by “thinking for yourself”, especially in philosophy.

It is mainly in the environment of trusting your own judgement, and no one else’s, not even God’s Judgement.

If you can’t trust your own thinking, then why would you trust anyone else’s?

Everyone has to make their own decisions on how to live and what they believe. We can’t just choose ignorance and obedience to another, after all who would we be obedient to? The bishop of Canterbury, the patriarch of Constantinople, the pope, the Dalai lama, a Muslim cleric? Who should I trust to do my thinking for me?

In the end, I would rather do it for myself.

 

[D_Martin]

Nope. It’s always better if we just think for other people.

LOL, I know, if they would just do what we say, everything would be great.

 

[D_Martin]

I’d say even deciding to trust another is thinking for oneself. People might say “I trust the Church” but that is a decision they have made themselves, just as others will say “I trust the Q,ran”. Of course upbringing is extremely influential in who we trust, but we still have to give consent to continuing our cultural upbringing.

Even when we say “I trust X”, I think I see a lot of “filtering” going on - everyone also comes with, for example, political and national paradigms that come in to play. When Papa Francesco, for example, says he’d like to see a poor Church for poor people - lots of people who say they trust the Pope will find a way of viewing that in a way that is comfortable for the rest of their views and life. Few people totally abandon themselves to other’s and when that does happen it well may be quite dangerous (such as the followers of David Koresh or Jim Jones). I think we even struggle to fully trust Jesus and what he taught - we often find ways of sanitizing it a little so we can still enjoy a certain level of lifestyle (with a few notable, wonderful and inspiring exceptions such as Francesco of Assisi).

Michael Allen
Excellent point, in the perspective in which you are speaking here seems to be the true understanding when Paul speaks of having the “Mind of Christ”. And one would have to agree to the Lord’s view in all things, hence Jesus being the agreement.

As in: Prov:3:6: In all thy ways acknowledge him, and he shall direct thy paths.

He has made everything, therefore knows what is correct in all things.

 

[D_Martin]

If you can’t trust your own thinking, then why would you trust anyone else’s?

Everyone has to make their own decisions on how to live and what they believe. We can’t just choose ignorance and obedience to another, after all who would we be obedient to? The bishop of Canterbury, the patriarch of Constantinople, the pope, the Dalai lama, a Muslim cleric? Who should I trust to do my thinking for me?

In the end, I would rather do it for myself.

Since this is true:

Prov:9:10: The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding.

Then how is it ignorance to follow the Lord Jesus Christ? To think what He thinks, to know what He knows or understands. How is it that any man’s view or what any man thinks is better than what the Lord thinks? Jesus said to follow Him, he didn’t say to follow anyone else.

 

[jimmy]

Since this is true:

Prov:9:10: The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding.

Then how is it ignorance to follow the Lord Jesus Christ? To think what He thinks, to know what He knows or understands. How is it that any man’s view or what any man thinks is better than what the Lord thinks? Jesus said to follow Him, he didn’t say to follow anyone else.

Why do you believe that is true? Why is ‘fear of the LORD’ good? Why Do you accept the bible? Why do I have to follow Jesus?

 

[Eleve]

Will He have Grace toward those who trust His Judgement, or those who trust their own judgement?

Not to trust in one’s own judgment is a contradiction in terms. To trust in some thing or another is to affirm whichever things it proposes as true. But if my judgment says that something is true, then that’s just to say that I affirm it; there is no difference between judging and affirming.

Of course, it may be that God wants us to trust his judgment. But that would be in addition to trusting our own judgment. In other words, it would be aligning our judgment with God’s, and thus trusting in both.

 

[Michael_Allen]

Since this is true:

Prov:9:10: The fear of the LORD is the beginning of wisdom: and the knowledge of the holy is understanding.

Then how is it ignorance to follow the Lord Jesus Christ? To think what He thinks, to know what He knows or understands. How is it that any man’s view or what any man thinks is better than what the Lord thinks? Jesus said to follow Him, he didn’t say to follow anyone else.

Hi D_M

I suppose the challenge comes when different people understand discipleship in different ways. Can any of us say we know what Jesus knows, or that we really think as Jesus thinks? That would be a bold claim, I think. I think it also helps to sometimes seek out those more mature in faith, or perhaps seek the views of the generations of Christians who came before us (especially with those who grappled with the “big questions” such as those around the divinity and humanity of our Lord. I would say we can learn from others, and yet we can also maintain our own critical thought. I suspect in real life we’re not as polarised in our thinking as this thread suggests - we don’t choose either (a) to follow Jesus or (b) to follow other people; we follow Jesus and we also seek to learn from others who are also seeking to follow Jesus, or who sought to follow Jesus in generations past.

God bless you D_M +

 

[D_Martin]

Why do you believe that is true?

Why shouldn’t I believe that is true?

Why is ‘fear of the LORD’ good?

Why wouldn’t it be?

Why Do you accept the bible?

Why shouldn’t I?

Why do I have to follow Jesus?

Don’t, nobody’s got a gun to your head.

How one’s own judgement, is better and wiser the Lord Jesus’ Judgement, is something your just going to have to explain.

 

[jimmy]

Why shouldn’t I believe that is true?

Why wouldn’t it be?

Why shouldn’t I?

Don’t, nobody’s got a gun to your head.

How one’s own judgement, is better and wiser the Lord Jesus’ Judgement, is something your just going to have to explain.

Why shouldn’t you follow the koran? Why not the Tibetan book of the dead? Why not Greek mythology, or old Norse mythology? Why shouldn’t you murder, rape and pillage?

If I ask you why, saying ‘why not’ isn’t an answer.