This Is Gonna Get Ugly

[dailey]

This has not been a good week for me.

For those of you who did not read my other post, my dog died. Out of grief, I came here to find some answers on pets and heaven. In doing so, I also came across a lot of other stuff that I was unaware of…like using protection is a mortal sin. Of course, being born and raised a catholic, I knew that it was considered a sin, but not mortal. So now that I know, I will have to inform my husband and this could definitely get ugly.

First off, he is already losing patience with me since I have been moping around and just down right heartbroken over my pup. He didn’t say it but I know he thinks I should just move on already. Now, I am going to have to tell him that using condoms is a sin and that is not going to sit well with him. He is not Catholic…or religious for that matter, so he will not understand. I know we can practice natural birth control, but honestly, I know myself. I will be filled with anxiety (and trust me, I do not need anymore anxiety in my life) every month waiting for my cycle to come to assure that I am not pregnant. I am 41 and know the risks of having a child at this age. I have a sister who is autistic and well aware that one day I will be in charge of taking care her, which is a 24 hour job.

I’m scared. What to do? The thought of having sex without protection makes me sick to my stomach. God forbid I get pregnant. But obviously not having sex is not an option. I don’t even know how to approach him with this as I know this is going to push him over the edge. I’ve read that if the husband had a vastecomy (sp?) it would not be a sin for me to have relations with him. But I don’t want him to sin?? Any (name removed by moderator)ut or advice would be appreciated.

Did I mention I was not having a good week??

 

[smad0142]

The absolute great new for you is that when done appropriately NFP is by far the most effective form of birth control out there. It is literally 99.9% effective whereas condoms are much less statistically effective. It is just important to keep in mind that there must be a grave reason to use NFP, otherwise it is just another form of birth control. Concern for the life of a mother is a grave reason.
The other positive to NFP, not to be crass or anything but to make it a more attractive option for your husband, is that there is nothing between husband and wife. I once heard at a chastity talk that God wants you to have a great sex life as a married couple, and I think that might be a huge selling point to your husband.

 

[MichaelR]

The absolute great new for you is that when done appropriately NFP is by far the most effective form of birth control out there. It is literally 99.9% effective whereas condoms are much less statistically effective. It is just important to keep in mind that there must be a grave reason to use NFP, otherwise it is just another form of birth control. Concern for the life of a mother is a grave reason.
The other positive to NFP, not to be crass or anything but to make it a more attractive option for your husband, is that there is nothing between husband and wife. I once heard at a chastity talk that God wants you to have a great sex life as a married couple, and I think that might be a huge selling point to your husband.

You may want to reconsider this statistic. The group that claimed the 99% actually only said that some parts of NFP were 99% effective. And actually, further clinical studies showed that it was only 75% effective.

One thing to consider is that there are two people in a marriage. Whatever you decide should surely be as a result of a conversation between the two of you.

And also, have you spoken about this with your Priest? If not, I would recommend you do so rather than take the word of people here…that is of absolutely no offence to people here (I, afterall, am one of them!), but don’t forget, not everyone who replies here are experts, and before making such a big decision it might be wise to talk to your own Priest.

(And by the way, it’s perfectly normal and okay to grieve for a loved pet. Just take the time you need.)

 

[Tim_Kirchoff]

Your situation is not an easy one, and you are certainly under no obligation to take my advice as The Final Word on the matter, but here goes:

It seems as though you’re encountering the Catholic faith in a way you haven’t for a long while, and if you are going to try to take Catholicism seriously in a way your husband isn’t used to, it could result in a number of difficulties which I am in no position to advise you on, beyond recommending that you talk to a priest. However, I would suggest that you look on the Church’s teachings about sex less as arbitrary rules meant to make your life harder and more as ways in which we can best respect God’s great gift of sexuality. Everything the Church says about contraception comes from a very particular understanding about the nature of human sexuality and God’s intentions for it. It might be easier to come to terms with Catholic teachings on sexuality within the context of the whole of the Catholic Faith, taking into account the Church’s understanding of marriage as well as the purpose of life in general.

Anything you do from here will probably be very confusing for your husband, especially if you have never placed a very big emphasis on your faith before. There is little I can do other than pray that God gives both of you patience and that you receive the proper guidance from your local priest.

 

[EphelDuath]

But obviously not having sex is not an option.

This attitude has resulted in quite a bit of suffering in the world. Remember Mary and Joseph? Was not having sex obviously not an option for them?

I don’t mean to burden you, but abstinence is most certainly a better path than you’re giving it credit it for.

God bless.

 

[Berean2]

This attitude has resulted in quite a bit of suffering in the world. Remember Mary and Joseph? Was not having sex obviously not an option for them?

I don’t mean to burden you, but abstinence is most certainly a better path than you’re giving it credit it for.

On the contrary, in 1 Corinthians 7, the marriage chapter, we read: *Do not deprive one another, except perhaps by agreement for a limited time, that you may devote yourselves to prayer; but then come together again, so that Satan may not tempt you because of your lack of self-control.
*

 

[Phemie]

This attitude has resulted in quite a bit of suffering in the world. Remember Mary and Joseph? Was not having sex obviously not an option for them?

I don’t mean to burden you, but abstinence is most certainly a better path than you’re giving it credit it for.

God bless.

It might be quite a hard sell to convince the husband to go from using condoms to abstinence like the Holy Family.

Of anything my marriage has had to bear, permanent abstinence has been the most difficult.

 

[dailey]

Thank you for the advice everyone.

I will have to muster up the courage to call my church and talk to my priest. Not exactly looking forward to having a conversation about sex with him. However, I am not sure why I would even go to him? Is he not only going to tell me that witholding sex from husband is a sin?..and that using protection is also a sin? I feel like I’m *damned if I do, damned if I don’t".

My husband has always made it perfectly clear that sex was extremely important in the marriage. As a matter of fact, I would say 95% of the fights that we have had are because he feels we should have it more often. This is not going to sit well with him. Since this is a marriage between two people, how much should his opinion count? Hmmm, that didn’t come out the way I intended it to. Hopefully, you all know what I mean.

 

[floresco]

You may want to reconsider this statistic. The group that claimed the 99% actually only said that some parts of NFP were 99% effective. And actually, further clinical studies showed that it was only 75% effective.

Actually, pretty much all the studies show the same thing. If one looks at NFP used correctly i.e. abstaining at the times taught by the method to avoid pregnancy, it is highly effective, around 97% - 99%. If one looks at the effectiveness among all users, including rule-breakers, the results are around 75% - 80%. Looking at both figures shows us both that NFP is accurate at determining times of fertility and that many couples find periodic abstinence difficult. In practice, compliance with the pregnancy-avoidance rules is related to motivation. In other words, the more motivated one is, the better it works.

To the origianl poster, I agree with all the people who are advising you to talk to your priest. It is possible, under some circumstances, that you would not be guilty of mortal sin if your husband uses a condom. This is not something to determine in an online forum. You need to talk with your priest.

 

[smithm29]

Your priest may well tell you that he doesn’t think birth control is a sin. All but one of my priests for the last ten years have said as much, and told my wife (who converted as an adult) as much- which has made NFP difficult for us. If your priest says this, consider reading the words of the popes and bishops.

 

[buffalo]

This has not been a good week for me.

For those of you who did not read my other post, my dog died. Out of grief, I came here to find some answers on pets and heaven. In doing so, I also came across a lot of other stuff that I was unaware of…like using protection is a mortal sin. Of course, being born and raised a catholic, I knew that it was considered a sin, but not mortal. So now that I know, I will have to inform my husband and this could definitely get ugly.

First off, he is already losing patience with me since I have been moping around and just down right heartbroken over my pup. He didn’t say it but I know he thinks I should just move on already. Now, I am going to have to tell him that using condoms is a sin and that is not going to sit well with him. He is not Catholic…or religious for that matter, so he will not understand. I know we can practice natural birth control, but honestly, I know myself. I will be filled with anxiety (and trust me, I do not need anymore anxiety in my life) every month waiting for my cycle to come to assure that I am not pregnant. I am 41 and know the risks of having a child at this age. I have a sister who is autistic and well aware that one day I will be in charge of taking care her, which is a 24 hour job.

I’m scared. What to do? The thought of having sex without protection makes me sick to my stomach. God forbid I get pregnant. But obviously not having sex is not an option. I don’t even know how to approach him with this as I know this is going to push him over the edge. I’ve read that if the husband had a vastecomy (sp?) it would not be a sin for me to have relations with him. But I don’t want him to sin?? Any (name removed by moderator)ut or advice would be appreciated.

Did I mention I was not having a good week??

Read this:

Natural Family Planning Blessed Our Marriage: 19 True Stories

http://ecx.images-amazon.com/images/I/41RP2V7Y6RL.SL500_AA300.jpg

 

[floresco]

I will have to muster up the courage to call my church and talk to my priest. Not exactly looking forward to having a conversation about sex with him. However, I am not sure why I would even go to him? Is he not only going to tell me that witholding sex from husband is a sin?..and that using protection is also a sin? I feel like I’m *damned if I do, damned if I don’t".

Many other people have been in your situation and the Church has reasonable, compassionate and orthodox ways of dealing with it. If your priest simply says that birth control is not a sin, then it is not an orthodox position. But the Church does not teach damned if you do, damned if you don’t. The priest’s job is to help you to figure out how to do the right thing and he should have been taught the moral theology he needs to do this.

 

[RosaryCrusader]

Daily,

There is a lot of fear in your posts - as the Bible says fear is useless; what is needed is trust. Remember, fertility is not a disease - it’s a beautiful gift. Maybe God wants you to have more children - maybe not - but it’s His choice and we cooperate or not. Please don’t buy into the anti-life American culture which breeds fear and views children as curses instead of blessings. God will not give you a child then leave you on your own. No, He will provide for that child as long as you’re seeking God’s will first:

Mathew 6:25-34
*Therefore I say to you, be not solicitous for your life, what you shall eat, nor for your body, what you shall put on. Is not the life more than the meat: and the body more than the raiment?

Behold the birds of the air, for they neither sow, nor do they reap, nor gather into barns: and your heavenly Father feedeth them. Are not you of much more value than they? And which of you by taking thought, can add to his stature by one cubit? And for raiment why are you solicitous? Consider the lilies of the field, how they grow: they labour not, neither do they spin. But I say to you, that not even Solomon in all his glory was arrayed as one of these. And if the grass of the field, which is today, and tomorrow is cast into the oven, God doth so clothe: how much more you, O ye of little faith?

Be not solicitous therefore, saying, What shall we eat: or what shall we drink, or wherewith shall we be clothed? For after all these things do the heathens seek. For your Father knoweth that you have need of all these things. Seek ye therefore first the kingdom of God, and his justice, and all these things shall be added unto you. Be not therefore solicitous for tomorrow; for the morrow will be solicitous for itself. Sufficient for the day is the evil thereof. *

Don’t worry. Pray for courage and make sure the Priest you’re seeing is solid in the teachings of the Church. I would recommend seeing a Priest of the Fraternity of St. Peter (FSSP) - they will not lead you astray. You can go here for a list of their apostolates near you. It would be worth the drive even if they’re not in your immediate area.

fssp.org/en/messes.htm

God Bless,

 

[Edward_H]

This has not been a good week for me.

'm scared. What to do? The thought of having sex without protection makes me sick to my stomach. God forbid I get pregnant.

This is a key part of your problem and area of growth. It’s not your will. It’s God’s. Welcome the possibility of new life…with joyful abandonment, a new little one that generates naturally infinite opportunities to love, to give, to sacrifice, to practice putting yourself last, For your husband to learn how to love God by showing others how to love children and you. Parenting is the schoolhouse of love; new lessons and new challenges each year. New problems to solve together.

I know this sounds ridiculous…or radical…but it’s the essential point and purpose of marriage. Fruitfulness that comes from complete self-giving. And utter confidence that it will work out…when your intentions are fully rectified with God’s intentions for your marriage.

Maybe the dog dying was to draw you closer together, to make you feel that something was now missing. Maybe you just now have to show the courage to have fun, unprotected abandonment in the marital act…laughing all the way to beautiful orgasm…perfect giving union, true giving of self. Lots and lots of laughter about what might happen if you fully love. And end up having to give yourself away your whole life time.

We just had our 25th Anniversary last night…and our only regret was not having more children…and we had been trying, fully unprotected, laughing all the way.

God Bless.

 

[dailey]

I understand what you all are saying…I really do. But this isn’t just about me. My husband is in this marriage too and I feel like this is not fair for him. I sometimes wish he would of married someone else better suited for him. We are very different. I guess we should have explored that further before we got married 11 years ago. But of course, we are married to each other so here I am.

*edited to add a question- Is it a mortal sin to have relations at the very beginning or end of menstrual cycle? I am asking this since I am pretty sure there would be little chance of being fertile at that point

 

[Phemie]

I understand what you all are saying…I really do. But this isn’t just about me. My husband is in this marriage too and I feel like this is not fair for him. I sometimes wish he would of married someone else better suited for him. We are very different. I guess we should have explored that further before we got married 11 years ago. But of course, we are married to each other so here I am.

*edited to add a question- Is it a mortal sin to have relations at the very beginning or end of menstrual cycle? I am asking this since I am pretty sure there would be little chance of being fertile at that point

No, of course it isn’t a sin. That’s what Natural Family Planning is all about, using your knowledge of your own body to either avoid pregnancy or increase your chances of becoming pregnant depending on what you wish to have happen at that time.

 

[NoAvailableName]

Dailey,

I don’t think your position is as bad as you think it is, and I do think talking to your priest will help you out more than your realize.

Your husband wants more sex. You want to follow the church’s teaching better. These two are not mutually exclusive.

First, as others have noted, if you tell your husband that you are against ABC and he does not agree with you, it is unlikely that you will be held accountable for his choice.

Second, there is a possible compromise here. I don’t know how often you two have sex, but if you agree to have sex every day (or nearly every day and maybe twice a day) that you can within NFP guidelines, your husband may get the additional sex he wants (and of a higher quality without the condom), and you can get to do the NFP you want. Additionally, you’ll be satisfying your second responsibility – to not withhold sex from your partner.

I am not a Catholic though, and am just arguing from the “If I was a Catholic” position.

 

[crazzeto]

The absolute great new for you is that when done appropriately NFP is by far the most effective form of birth control out there. It is literally 99.9% effective whereas condoms are much less statistically effective.** It is just important to keep in mind that there must be a grave reason to use NFP, otherwise it is just another form of birth control. Concern for the life of a mother is a grave reason.**
The other positive to NFP, not to be crass or anything but to make it a more attractive option for your husband, is that there is nothing between husband and wife. I once heard at a chastity talk that God wants you to have a great sex life as a married couple, and I think that might be a huge selling point to your husband.

This is a bit of a gray area, there is a clear tension with the CCC…

2399 The regulation of births represents one of the aspects of responsible fatherhood and motherhood. Legitimate intentions on the part of the spouses do not justify recourse to morally unacceptable means (for example, direct sterilization or contraception).

It is important to understand, the Church does not teach that a married couple must be a baby making machine. You are not required to have sex at all, in fact in marriage. The teaching is, that when you do have sex you remain open to the possbility of lifem, rather than attempt to put up barriers.

 

[Edward_H]

Ok. Ok. I understand.

“Fair” in the sense that “the rules have changed”. But it’s really not a matter of being fair…it’s a matter of robbing your husband of a new way to think about human love. You wouldn’t want to have your husband half know God would you? So maybe it will take time and a good counselor, ask around discreetly in your diocese

Ask around the diocese for some family planning counselors who can walk through this more gentle than I can here.

It’s great that you married him. This “part” of marriage might have been “easier” with someone else, but that’s not why God pairs us up…he pairs us up for the maximum amount of love that can come from a relationship.

Be thankful for this challenge…pray, offer thanksgiving for this challenge…"Lord I want to run away from this challenge…give me the courage of St Thomas More and the patience of St Monica…and let Mary form my words…and take time…go at God’s pace. Maybe associate with some couples who have really welcomed children into their lives fully…and over time God will help you move this in the right direction. Maybe he’ll be touched by someone he respects who over time has a man-to-man talk about giving heroically.

Pray conversationally about it, with humor, all the time. Never deceive your husband. Pray with humor with God, every day, never let an hour go by without talking with him about it.

God Bless…I will pray and offer up some sacrifices for you over the next few days.

 

[dailey]

Dailey,

I don’t think your position is as bad as you think it is, and I do think talking to your priest will help you out more than your realize.

Your husband wants more sex. You want to follow the church’s teaching better. These two are not mutually exclusive.

First, as others have noted, if you tell your husband that you are against ABC and he does not agree with you, it is unlikely that you will be held accountable for his choice.

Second, there is a possible compromise here. I don’t know how often you two have sex, but if you agree to have sex every day (or nearly every day and maybe twice a day) that you can within NFP guidelines, your husband may get the additional sex he wants (and of a higher quality without the condom), and you can get to do the NFP you want. Additionally, you’ll be satisfying your second responsibility – to not withhold sex from your partner.

I am not a Catholic though, and am just arguing from the “If I was a Catholic” position.

I called my parish and my priest will be giving me a call. Thanks for the encouragement everyone.

@ NoAvailableName. I am confused. How can we have sex everyday while following NFP? What about the days I am fertile?