This is hard (please do not take offense)

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lookaround

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I have only been a member of the Catholic Church for a little while (2 years).
In this short time one thing that I have discovered is that while I do not know who is a REAL Catholic (I don’t know if anyone is). I know that I am not.
There are many good things about the Catholic Church (wonderful people, charities, has made more positive changes then any other church) and I find that I agree more with the teachings of the Catholic Church then any other church, but more is not all.

I think back to my baptism and confirmation, and wonder if the Catholic Church should have ever baptized me. Honestly, the answer is probably still yes.
There is nothing I was asked that I would now say “no” to. My beliefs have not changed, but what I thought we all believed has changed.

I know many of you will think that I built my faith on sand, that I do not want to submit to authority, or that I am not being sincere in following God.
I understand and don’t hold it against you. There was a time I would have thought the same thing.

What I do know is to be a true worshiper we must worship in spirit and in truth. Sadly if I remained in the Catholic Church I would not be doing this.
I would just be a body in church on Sunday.

Peace be with all of you.
 
lookaround said:
I have only been a member of the Catholic Church for a little while (2 years). In this short time one thing that I have discovered is that while I do not know who is a REAL Catholic (I don’t know if anyone is). I know that I am not.
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If you were Baptized in the Catholic Church you are a “real” Catholic. Perhaps you’re not a well informed Catholic, but “real” all the same.
 
lookaround said:
There are many good things about the Catholic Church (wonderful people, charities, has made more positive changes then any other church) and I find that I agree more with the teachings of the Catholic Church then any other church, but more is not all.
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Of all of the reasons to be Catholic, I have to say, people, charities and “positive” changes are possibly the weakest. I’m a Catholic because in all of the study of how Jesus taught, the Catholic teachings are the closest to His, actually, not close, the same.
 
lookaround said:
There is nothing I was asked that I would now say “no” to. My beliefs have not changed, but what I thought we all believed has changed.
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Have you researched what you think the Church teaches in the Catechism? It sounds like you are missing something. Before you give up learn as much as you can on the true teachings of the Church. Why don’t you start a thread on a “teaching” you’re having trouble with.
 
lookaround said:
What I do know is to be a true worshiper we must worship in spirit and in truth. Sadly if I remained in the Catholic Church I would not be doing this.
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Why? I’ve been Catholic all of my life and I worship in Spirit and Truth. Why can’t you?
 
Being in confusion about Church teaching doesn’t make you a bad Catholic by any means. Remember even the Apostles found some of Jesus’ teachings hard - look at John 6.

The one thing is they didn’t leave Him as others did, even when they found His sayings hard. Neither should you.

Beware of taking the wrong end of the stick as regards your faith - it sounds like you entered the Church because it ticked the most boxes for you about what you already believed.

Remember we’re seeking Truth, because Truth, as Our Lord said, will set us free. And remember that as individuals we are far more likely to be wrong than Christ’s own Spirit-guided Church about what that Truth is - which is why we need the Church in the first place!

For the moment, I’d advise lots of prayer and study. The prayer of the man in the Gospels who said ‘Lord, I believe, help my unbelief’ is the best place to start, as is the Catechism. From the Catechism go back to the scripture passages and Church documents it cites as support for its teachings, so that you know why and how the Church teaches as it does.
 
Leaving the Eucharist? Leaving Our Lord’s Flesh and Blood? For what will you trade your time with God? Honestly now if you ever really believed that host to be Christ flesh and that wine to be His Blood sacrificed for you personally, could you really forsake HIM?
 
Dear Lookaround,

Don’t be confounded by what other Catholics do or believe… it’s all about your relationship with Our Lord. You have done a fair bit of study I’d say and you believe in Catholic doctrine… that’s the intellectual side of it. Allow the heart to also get an equal footing in your faith (through prayer, the rosary, Adoration, Mass) which I’m sure you mostly do.

I could be wrong but the part in your post that seemed pivotal was “but what I thought we all believed has changed.” but you didn’t go into what you meant by that.

I have prayed for you and wish you a future happy and satisfying relationship as another part of our dear Church.

Rove
 
fear_n0_evil said:
Leaving the Eucharist? Leaving Our Lord’s Flesh and Blood? For what will you trade your time with God? Honestly now if you ever really believed that host to be Christ flesh and that wine to be His Blood sacrificed for you personally, could you really forsake HIM?
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the Catholic Church is not the only church that has the Eucharist
 
roveau said:
I could be wrong but the part in your post that seemed pivotal was “but what I thought we all believed has changed.” but you didn’t go into what you meant by that.
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immaculate conception: I thought this was about Jesus

transubstantiation: I personally believe it is logical but the Orthodox don’t believe in transubstantiation and the CC says they have a valid Eucharist (I do believe in the Real Presence of the Eucharist)

Peter in charge: the more I learn about history the less likely this seems

days of obligation: once I heard this I was like… wow this is wrong

indulgences not gone: I was told before I converted that they were gone (I even said that if they weren’t I would never become a Catholic)

assumption of Mary: I can believe this as a maybe but not 100%

the Catholic Church never changing: one of the things I liked about Catholicism is that they made major (positive) changes with Vatican II

I was also told that I would never have to pray to saints or Mary if I did not want to. However, once I went to Reconciliation, 3 Hail Mary’s.

The big one (outside of some very negative experiences I had in the Church in only two years) is history.

I knew that the Bible did not agree 100% with the Catholic Church, but I also knew that the Church had Sacred Traditions.
However, for these Traditions to be true they needed to be based in history. Many times the Catholic Church has said, “it has always been this way and everyone believed it”. Its not true.
 
lookaround said:
I have only been a member of the Catholic Church for a little while (2 years).
In this short time one thing that I have discovered is that while I do not know who is a REAL Catholic (I don’t know if anyone is). I know that I am not.
There are many good things about the Catholic Church (wonderful people, charities, has made more positive changes then any other church) and I find that I agree more with the teachings of the Catholic Church then any other church, but more is not all.

I think back to my baptism and confirmation, and wonder if the Catholic Church should have ever baptized me. Honestly, the answer is probably still yes.
There is nothing I was asked that I would now say “no” to. My beliefs have not changed, but what I thought we all believed has changed.

I know many of you will think that I built my faith on sand, that I do not want to submit to authority, or that I am not being sincere in following God.
I understand and don’t hold it against you. There was a time I would have thought the same thing.

What I do know is to be a true worshiper we must worship in spirit and in truth. Sadly if I remained in the Catholic Church I would not be doing this.
I would just be a body in church on Sunday.

Peace be with all of you.
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I had a brief look at your profile, but it didn’t tell me much. So I’m assuming you’ve come from a Protestant background, and probably attended churches where the services were “spiritual”. As a former, although mainline, Protestant myself, I’ll make a couple of statements.

First of all the Catholic services are dry and routine. I’ve found not much effort is put into the service, particularly the homily or music. Other parishes might have greater resources however.

Truth however is Truth, whether its dressed up in a charismatic outfit, or given in a dry as dust format. Unless you’ve got a specific suspicion that something is untrue, then that part of your complaint holds no water. For my part the Catholic Church is “CLOSEST” to the truth.

I also think you need to be sure that the worship services you might have experienced in the past were in fact “spiritual” when in fact a lot of it is emotional, hyped up with powerful music and atmospheric manipulation. I remember watching a promotional video for a particular charity, and it was very moving, and certainly caught our attention.

It was also a scam. The “pastor” and his sons were putting the money in their own pockets. The “spirituality” was absolutely bogus.

Having said that, I think the Catholic Church could do a lot to improve its worship services.
 
Bob_Crowley said:
I had a brief look at your profile, but it didn’t tell me much. So I’m assuming you’ve come from a Protestant background, and probably attended churches where the services were “spiritual”. As a former, although mainline, Protestant myself, I’ll make a couple of statements.
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Jewish
 
I’m afraid that you had a very poor catichist. You should have been counciled about your issue with Mary’s role in the church prior to finishing RCIA. Belief in the Immaculate Conception and The Assumption is a must for catholics. Your RCIA instructor should have made this clear.
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Its interesting tho that what I had to say yes to in order to be baptized and confirmed the Immaculate Conception or Assumption was not one of them.

ie: Do you reject satan and his empty promises?
 
I’m not sure if this will help you, but being Catholic is just who I am. I can act like I am something else, but when it all comes out in the wash, I am still a Catholic through and through. For me, it was a matter of accepting what I am instead of fighting it.

That would be my suggestion. I don’t think a good argument is going to change your mind. I think some introspection about who you really are what is needed. Look in your heart. The truth is written there.
 
Bob_Crowley said:
First of all the Catholic services are dry and routine. I’ve found not much effort is put into the service, particularly the homily or music. Other parishes might have greater resources however.
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I have been to some very good Catholic worship services (some that are more modern then Protestant worship)
 
I’m afraid that you had a very poor catichist. You should have been counciled about your issue with Mary’s role in the church prior to finishing RCIA. Belief in the Immaculate Conception and The Assumption is a must for catholics. Your RCIA instructor should have made this clear.
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I remember one of the things I was told in RCIA was that since Catholic means Universal its ok if everyone has different beliefs.
Not entirely true.

Looking back, since I did RCIA at college I think the instructor was more liberal and trying to soften everything for the group.
 
We all struggle and have moments of doubt, but The Assumption is a non-negotiable. Are you sure you are not just experiencing a “dark night of the soul”?
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I didn’t even know about the Assumption of Mary until 5 months ago
why do you say this?
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without entering into grace vs. law
a person who does something out of obligation is not doing it out of love
 
lookaround said:
What I do know is to be a true worshiper we must worship in spirit and in truth.
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That’s the ideal, but it is not the requirement. You say MUST. But it is not MUST. It is, at best, SHOULD. But, it is better to offer lackluster worship to God than to watch TV or mow the lawn or buy groceries (or whatever else) while Mass is going on.
lookaround said:
Sadly if I remained in the Catholic Church I would not be doing this. I would just be a body in church on Sunday.
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But this is a GOOD thing. You come before God - even with your doubts and weaknesses. Yet, you reach out to God. Do you think God will not take your hand? Maybe not as immediately as you would want, nor in the manner you would prefer, but it will happen. It may take weeks, months, or years for you to realize what is happening to you, but it will come. It always comes to those who seek God.

You could be a body in church, or you could be a body at a baseball game, or a body in a grocery store, or a body pushing a lawn mower, or a body in an easy chair. Which do you think will eventually lead you towards a deeper relationship with God?

FWIW, I was a “body in Church” for about 10 years.
 
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