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Bookcat
Guest
If the thoughts are chaste sexual thoughts about your husband…these are good.
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Mamanurse
Guest
I am a returning Catholic and I just started reading the Theology of the Body for Beginners and I have to say that Yeah!! The Church does care how you come to your orgasm!! If one has acheived an orgasm by immoral means then yes, I think that Jesus does care. Also Pope John Paul II wrote I belive an encyclicle or at least a book on Theology of the Body, which does in fact focus on sexuality. – As a returning Catholic I find it very disturbing reading some of these comments
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BrickRoux
Guest
The eyes have it.
I’ve never been married, but I got very close to a wedding day and as a result got a lot of the advice a new bride would get. One such piece of advice was to focus on his eyes if you find your thoughts getting impure - this helps you remember and feel that he is your beloved. Even though his body is amazing (everyone’s body is amazing), that is secondary. Focusing on how his body makes you feel is impure; being aware of it is not. Does that make sense?
And in fact, I think this is really good advice for couples before marriage. I have a wonderful boyfriend, and I want our marriage to be special if that’s where we end up going. I never think about other men, but as someone who loves him but isn’t married to him yet, I need to be careful what I think about him. Often I find that just looking into his eyes, or a picture of his face if he’s not around, helps. He’s a person, not an anatomy; sometimes I think how I would feel if someone viewed me as an anatomy and not as my whole self, and that, too, can help me calm down and see the big picture.
I don’t think you’re bad. Getting a grip on impure thoughts takes practice. Eventually you get so good at discerning them that you can stop them in their tracks before they fully form and run loose; you’ll learn the best ways for yourself.
By the way, I love Dr. Popcak!
I’ve never been married, but I got very close to a wedding day and as a result got a lot of the advice a new bride would get. One such piece of advice was to focus on his eyes if you find your thoughts getting impure - this helps you remember and feel that he is your beloved. Even though his body is amazing (everyone’s body is amazing), that is secondary. Focusing on how his body makes you feel is impure; being aware of it is not. Does that make sense?
And in fact, I think this is really good advice for couples before marriage. I have a wonderful boyfriend, and I want our marriage to be special if that’s where we end up going. I never think about other men, but as someone who loves him but isn’t married to him yet, I need to be careful what I think about him. Often I find that just looking into his eyes, or a picture of his face if he’s not around, helps. He’s a person, not an anatomy; sometimes I think how I would feel if someone viewed me as an anatomy and not as my whole self, and that, too, can help me calm down and see the big picture.
I don’t think you’re bad. Getting a grip on impure thoughts takes practice. Eventually you get so good at discerning them that you can stop them in their tracks before they fully form and run loose; you’ll learn the best ways for yourself.
By the way, I love Dr. Popcak!
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OraLabora
Guest
I think if you’re busily analyzing whether your thoughts are sinful while in the throes of sexual congress with whom, one presumes (and hopes), is your spouse, the odds of successfully completing the act and achieving orgasm will decline substantially.
When we get down to such a level of granularity in our lovemaking I begin to wonder if the name of this forum shouldn’t be changed to the “Obsessive-compulsive disorder forum”…
But seriously since this does purport to be a Catholic forum (though I often wonder), while making love I would say that one is not in 100% possession of one’s rational faculties but has rather given one’s self over to one’s emotional faculties. That to me would mitigate any culpability in a sin whether the matter was grave or not, and thus, would reduce it to the level of veniality in virtually 100% of cases.
In short, don’t sweat it. Lusting after the neighbour while idly daydreaming is one thing, and fantasizing while in the throes of (hopefully marital) sex, is quite another, when it comes to the ability to formulate “full knowledge” and “full consent”.
When we get down to such a level of granularity in our lovemaking I begin to wonder if the name of this forum shouldn’t be changed to the “Obsessive-compulsive disorder forum”…
But seriously since this does purport to be a Catholic forum (though I often wonder), while making love I would say that one is not in 100% possession of one’s rational faculties but has rather given one’s self over to one’s emotional faculties. That to me would mitigate any culpability in a sin whether the matter was grave or not, and thus, would reduce it to the level of veniality in virtually 100% of cases.
In short, don’t sweat it. Lusting after the neighbour while idly daydreaming is one thing, and fantasizing while in the throes of (hopefully marital) sex, is quite another, when it comes to the ability to formulate “full knowledge” and “full consent”.
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SaintGobban
Guest
I’m really glad you posted this because I have the exact same problem myself and I would like to find out the answer to this question.
The problem is that the responses are either off topic or not credible. I’m not sure you can ever find credible responses to questions in this kind of forum.
I’ve had priests say they were okay with this, I’ve had priests ignore it, I’ve read things online that were from books written by priests that said it was okay. But, you and I both know that some of these thoughts are certainly outside the realm of what “nice” girls,. or maybe anyone, should ever be thinking.
The problem is that thoughts that are not “dirty” or potentially sinful, are also not arousing.
Thinking of yourself and your spouse wrapped in a beach towel sipping a cool drink is hardly the prelude to red hot sex, nor is giving yourself to him with full realization of his magnificent dignity as a child of God. Get real.
After decades of marital fidelity and physical decay, it is very difficult to get aroused by the same old same old. In order to enjoy the act you almost have to use your imagination. Maybe you aren’t imagining a “real” other person, maybe you are just imagining a person or persons who do not exist. Maybe you are imagining a fictional couple who is physically attractive that isn’t you or your husband. Is that a sin? I mean, I could go on and on with hypotheticals but please, let’s not state the obvious. I’m sure this is a gray area. Please don’t continue to respond with some nun-like answer. If you don’t know for sure, just don’t respond to the question. The answers so far show a great lack of insight.
The problem is that the responses are either off topic or not credible. I’m not sure you can ever find credible responses to questions in this kind of forum.
I’ve had priests say they were okay with this, I’ve had priests ignore it, I’ve read things online that were from books written by priests that said it was okay. But, you and I both know that some of these thoughts are certainly outside the realm of what “nice” girls,. or maybe anyone, should ever be thinking.
The problem is that thoughts that are not “dirty” or potentially sinful, are also not arousing.
Thinking of yourself and your spouse wrapped in a beach towel sipping a cool drink is hardly the prelude to red hot sex, nor is giving yourself to him with full realization of his magnificent dignity as a child of God. Get real.
After decades of marital fidelity and physical decay, it is very difficult to get aroused by the same old same old. In order to enjoy the act you almost have to use your imagination. Maybe you aren’t imagining a “real” other person, maybe you are just imagining a person or persons who do not exist. Maybe you are imagining a fictional couple who is physically attractive that isn’t you or your husband. Is that a sin? I mean, I could go on and on with hypotheticals but please, let’s not state the obvious. I’m sure this is a gray area. Please don’t continue to respond with some nun-like answer. If you don’t know for sure, just don’t respond to the question. The answers so far show a great lack of insight.
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SaintGobban
Guest
Well, duhhhhhhhh.
What would a “chaste sexual thought” look like?
Imagining yourself giving a sponge bath to your husband’s war wound?
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SaintGobban
Guest
Okay, but there is obviously a difference between S & M activities and S & M THOUGHTS. The woman is FANTASIZING.
At no time did this woman ask about performing S & M, she asked about THINKING things while having sex with HER HUSBAND.
If you don’t KNOW the answer to this specific question, then don’t bother to respond to a DIFFERENT question.
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ad_altare_Dei
Guest
Unfortunately the Church is not too specific, partly for the same reason we’re having this discussion. There simply are too many possible situations to outline every single one of the allowances and restrictions.
I’m not a big fan of the Christopher West book, mainly because he really dumbs down theology of the body to where it’s not really what John Paul said. That, and he says sodomy is permissible, but it’s not.
Here’s a few basic rules, though, that should help you determine if you’re marital acts are in line with the good life:
- Don’t do anything to purposefully stop procreation, i.e. no artificial birth control.
- Don’t make you spouse do anything they simply don’t want to do at all.
- Don’t bring a person other than your spouse into the sexual act, be it physically, in pornography, or mentally. You can’t pretend its someone else.
- Don’t do anything that puts your spouse in a health risk, or fantasize about doing things that put your spouse’s health at risk. This would involve sadomasochism or sodomy. Regarding health risk, you’re body and mind are built to be disgusted or frightened by things that are harmful. If you are fantasizing about things that any normally developed person would find utterly disgusting or frightening, it probably crosses the line. (That last sentence is not strictly scientific, but it’s a good measuring stick.)
- Don’t make a foreign object the means of a primary sexual pleasure. Imagining you are doing so also tends toward infidelity, though I wouldn’t call it infidelity strictly speaking.
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micahmike
Guest
We should be careful whan speaking of S&M in front of the scrulpulous - and I can get a bit scrupulous. Light hair-pulling and such are a world away from sexual torture and I suspect that one person’s S&M is another person’s idea of normal, wholesome, chaste marital relations. We shoudl never take pleasure at anyone else’s pain, especially our spouse, but that doesn’t automatically make every little bite or pinch between husband and wife a terrible thing IMO. I base what I say on nothing other than my own oppinion.
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onmyknees
Guest
SaintGobban, I could have written this post. I want straight answers too. Even in confession I think some priests are too uncomfortable to tell it like it is. I wonder if it’s because we are women? I also can get obsessed with worry about whether I am in mortal sin or not because I am uncomfortable telling the priest what I really think about.
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DWC_RC
Guest
I have the same question…I fantasize about my husband with women. These are not real women, but I use to read the romance novels and stuck him as a knight in a castle with the barmaid so to speak. I know it’s upsetting my husband that he can’t pleasure me to the fullest because I’ve refused thinking of such things just in case they are a sin. I’m hoping staying away from such thoughts for a while and trying to just focus on what he’s doing to me out of love will eventually work. I don’t mind not having an orgasm and just enjoying the marraige act from now on, but I know that would not be fun for my husband…what to do 
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onmyknees
Guest
I used to fantasize about worse things than that because that was the only thing that worked. Have you tried having your husband tell you things to do (I don’t mean immoral things like S & M) Being submissive to him might help get you going. Sorry if this was too explicit but I couldn’t get the pm to work lol.I have the same question…I fantasize about my husband with women. These are not real women, but I use to read the romance novels and stuck him as a knight in a castle with the barmaid so to speak. I know it’s upsetting my husband that he can’t pleasure me to the fullest because I’ve refused thinking of such things just in case they are a sin. I’m hoping staying away from such thoughts for a while and trying to just focus on what he’s doing to me out of love will eventually work. I don’t mind not having an orgasm and just enjoying the marraige act from now on, but I know that would not be fun for my husband…what to do
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monicatholic
Guest
i think it’s not a greay area. jesus said if you lust after a woman in your heart, you’ve committed adultery.
he didnt exclude the possibility of lusting after a woman in your heart while making love to your wife, or, if the case is reversed, while making love to your husband.
here is my decidedly non-nun-like recipe for THE Ultimate in good-results-getter/orgasmic/best-kept-secret/happy-fourth-of-july/wonderfulgoodness/WOW: total self-giving with a spouse who, likewise commits to total self-giving.
that’s total self-giving even
after 2 plus decades of marital fidelity
after 10 kids
after obvious “physical decay”
after years of overwork and underpay
after heaps of stress
after seasons of disappointments/ disillusionments/ griefs
after BIG issues
after*** all the etceteras***
perhaps one HUGE help we have is this: we never-- that’s NEVER view, read about, discuss anyone else having sex. we never read bodice-ripper novels. we never watch sex scene movies. we never view pornography. we never chat/gossip to our friends about their/ our sex lives. we don’t watch most TV.
and yeah: BRoux is right-- the eyes have it. my guy’s eyes are the wondow to his soul. his soul is what animates his body. his body is his gift to me. in our house, that all works together to very good results.
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