Thoughts on Amazon Synod

[Frankie65]

VATICAN CITY (ChurchMilitant.com) - Cardinal Walter Brandmüller is warning that the Amazon Synod represents an attempt to replace Catholicism with “a pantheistic natural religion of man.”
More at Church Militant

 

[Frankie65]

I don’t understand them and the spirit they are sharing around through ‘osmosis’ is foreign and dark to me

Yes, there’s a clear dividing line, getting narrower.
All my Catholic friends think either the one thing or the other. The ones that don’t will eventually find themselves on one of the sides.
True , the side of the line I am on contains far fewer people , always did. Always will. Pope Benedict has told us about a small remnant church

I believe he was talking in a prescient way

 

[Emeraldlady]

Eh, I guess that all depends on how one views the infamous 3rd secret…

Whatever one thinks Pope BXVI warned against using the 3rd secret to stoke a gloomy view of the future.

"The purpose of the vision is not to show a film of an irrevocably fixed future. Its meaning is exactly the opposite: it is meant to mobilize the forces of change in the right direction. Therefore we must totally discount fatalistic explanations of the “secret”.

 

[pnewton]

There has been. Several. There will be. More.

I think of all the apostasies, even the Protestant Reformation, I do not think any will end up matching the rise of modernism and secularism. It seems to be Satan’s most insidious attack. If there was ever a time to stop this drawing of battle lines within the ranks, now is that time. No, we do not have to “choose sides.” In the essentials, unity. In everything else, charity.

If I could see where essentials have been discarded, I would join with everyone. However, stupid practices, imprudent decisions and progressive doctrinal exploration does not constitute heresy. John 17:20

“My prayer is not for them alone. I pray also for those who will believe in me through their message, that all of them may be one, Father, just as you are in me and I am in you. May they also be in us so that the world may believe that you have sent me."

 

[Emeraldlady]

VATICAN CITY (ChurchMilitant.com) - Cardinal Walter Brandmüller is warning that the Amazon Synod represents an attempt to replace Catholicism with “a pantheistic natural religion of man.”
More at Church Militant

What makes you submit to Cdl Brandmullers point of view over the Pope and the other Cdls around the world who share the Popes vision of evangelisation? Especially since he seems to eerily echo the negative nelly of Vatican II, Cdl Ottaviano. They ended up have to cut the mic on him. Who’s in charge of Cdl B’s mic??

 

[Frankie65]

The purpose of the vision is not to show a film of an irrevocably fixed future. Its meaning is exactly the opposite: it is meant to mobilize the forces of change in the right direction. Therefore we must totally discount fatalistic explanations of the “secret”.

I absolutely agree with Pope Benedict’s quote here

 

[pnewton]

Here is the practical problem. We would be fools to dismiss the possibility of satanic insurgents. I get that. Sexual predators have entered. Now we are screening the best we can. Screening out theological predators is harder, unless they cross the clear line of canonical heresy. Consider the words of Jesus.

“The kingdom of heaven is like a man who sowed good seed in his field; 25 but while men slept, his enemy came and sowed tares among the wheat and went his way. 26 But when the grain had sprouted and produced a crop, then the tares also appeared. 27 So the servants of the owner came and said to him, ‘Sir, did you not sow good seed in your field? How then does it have tares?’ 28 He said to them, ‘An enemy has done this.’ The servants said to him, ‘Do you want us then to go and gather them up?’ 29 But he said, ‘No, lest while you gather up the tares you also uproot the wheat with them.

Do you think if there was some sort of shake up, that the most traditional would also go unscathed? I would think we would loose good wheat and bad tares.

I will do this. Though I am rather moderate, especially compared to those here, I will agree and promote the necessity of even the most extreme traditional priest and bishops. They are vital to keeping the Church orthodox.

 

[Frankie65]

What makes you submit to Cdl Brandmullers point of view over the Pope and the other Cdls around the world who share the Popes vision of evangelisation?

My inbuilt orthodoxy meter. Like a Geiger counter but more sensitive

 

[Frankie65]

No, we do not have to “choose sides.”

In the end you won’t have a choice

 

[Emeraldlady]

I think of all the apostasies, even the Protestant Reformation, I do not think any will end up matching the rise of modernism and secularism. It seems to be Satan’s most insidious attack. If there was ever a time to stop this drawing of battle lines within the ranks, now is that time. No, we do not have to “choose sides.” In the essentials, unity. In everything else, charity.

So absolutely true. One of the failures in implementing the reforms of VII was the ‘sides’. The traditionalists, instead of contributing to the dialogue from their sense of what is important, just wiped their hands of everything and took up a position of protest. No wonder the process went off the tracks in some areas. Did they learn nothing from taking up an exclusive position of protest from the past?

And still today we see the protesters, trying to undermine the Amazon Synod rather than be part of necessary evangelisation of the region. Hopefully one day the light will dawn.

 

[Emeraldlady]

Emeraldlady:

What makes you submit to Cdl Brandmullers point of view over the Pope and the other Cdls around the world who share the Popes vision of evangelisation?

My inbuilt orthodoxy meter. Like a Geiger counter but more sensitive

An ‘orthodoxy meter’ doesn’t sound like what is needed though which is an informed conscience to rely on. The gnostics thought that their meter was reliable too.

 

[pnewton]

I do. Watch me. I will stay where the Church is, that is, the Bishop of Rome. I will not take sides within the family.

 

[Frankie65]

Though I am rather moderate, especially compared to those here, I will agree and promote the necessity of even the most extreme traditional priest and bishops. They are vital to keeping the Church orthodox.

Therefore why do we need the rest?

 

[Frankie65]

An ‘orthodoxy meter’ doesn’t sound like what is needed though which is an informed conscience to rely on. The gnostics thought that their meter was reliable too.

Nope. Mine works just fine

I bet the gnostics didn’t say the Rosary daily or receive weekly confession or wear the brown scapula

 

[gracepoole]

gracepoole:

Eh, I guess that all depends on how one views the infamous 3rd secret…

Whatever one thinks Pope BXVI warned against using the 3rd secret to stoke a gloomy view of the future.

"The purpose of the vision is not to show a film of an irrevocably fixed future. Its meaning is exactly the opposite: it is meant to mobilize the forces of change in the right direction. Therefore we must totally discount fatalistic explanations of the “secret”.

Might want to review his comments on the secrets from when he was a cardinal.

 

[Emeraldlady]

Emeraldlady:

An ‘orthodoxy meter’ doesn’t sound like what is needed though which is an informed conscience to rely on. The gnostics thought that their meter was reliable too.

Nope. Mine works just fine

I bet the gnostics didn’t say the Rosary daily or receive weekly confession or wear the brown scapula

Some dangers can come from taking too much pride in your piety. Fr Chad Ripperger who is a supporter of traditionalism and an exorcist, has this year reported on some dangerous trends that are manifesting in the traditionalist movement that threaten to destroy it eventually. Remember he is speaking with the view to preserve traditionalism and all that it has to offer the Church and with grave concern about what is emerging among adherents.

 

[Frankie65]

Some dangers can come from taking too much pride in your piety.

Stating facts only.

If you think I’m proud no worries.

The holy rosary keeps me grounded on what is holy. Confession keeps me clean.

And both keep my orthodoxy meter in good working order

 

[Trying2overcome]

The fact that the ecological ritual still hasn’t been explained is a red flag to me. The woman who presented the statue said it was “Our Lady of the Amazon.” A Vatican official said it was neither pagan nor sacred, but simply represented life. If it is simply a symbol, why bow to it? Why carry it in procession? Give it a place of prominence during the synod? Traditionally, Catholics process and honor the life giving cross, images of Our Lord and Lady, the saints. Not vague symbolic images of life

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[Emeraldlady]

The woman who presented the statue said it was “Our Lady of the Amazon.” A Vatican official said it was neither pagan nor sacred, but simply represented life.

Why is the Vatican’s explanation not good enough? What is wrong with that representation?

 

[Trying2overcome]

I already gave the reasons. Bowing to it, honoring it, carrying it in procession