Thoughts on what age dating should start?

[EasterJoy]

Kids don’t utterly disregard their parents, but kids do tend to think that parents are stupid when they are teens.

Everyone I knew growing up got a car at 16. Like, everyone. The high school parking lot was full of 4 wheel drives that boys had and 4 door sedans that the girls had. There is no walking anywhere in the town I grew up in, since there is NOTHING in the town. You have to drive 20 minutes down a country highway to get to a McDonalds. lol.

I don’t think holding hands and walking around the mall is an adult privilege. I don’t think going to the movies or a football game and sitting next to a person you like is wrong at 16. I will never think that is an adult only activity. I don’t think baking cookies and decorating your boyfriend’s locker with his football number for homecoming is an adult privilege AT ALL.

If you haven’t taught your kids what you expect and what you will allow by middle school, you aren’t going to get through to them. By age 12 kids think parents don’t know what they’re talking about.
At age 16 that kid has a car, they can say they are going to the mall with a group of same sex friends and meet their boyfriends there. That is why 16 is usually the dating age, because at that age they do get a car and a bit of freedom. It isn’t bad for kids to grow up. It is a part of life.

Who tells a 12 year old what their rules will be when they’re 16? Doesn’t this usually depend on the maturity the child exhibits when they get to that age? Also, where does a child get the idea that the rules of their life change just because they don’t believe that their parents (or school or government) doesn’t know what they’re talking about?

You may think that it is a part of life for a 16 year old to have ownership and free use of a car, and maybe it was that way when you were young, but this is not the modern opinion as enshrined in law. In the State of Oregon, a minor may not purchase a car without parental consent, because a minor may not legally sign a binding contract, which includes the cash sale of a car. They may not get a provisional license (this is the license for people under 18) until they are 16 and they cannot have anyone under 20 in the car while they are driving (other than family) until they have had their provisional license for 6 months.

Furthermore, not only is parental consent required by the State of Oregon for anyone under 18 to apply for a provisional permit or license, but that consent may also be withdrawn by parental request made to Oregon DMV in writing at any time until the provisionally-licensed driver reaches 18. Yes, I’m saying that parents in Oregon can legally and quite literally take away the licenses of their under-18 teen drivers.

Finally, the superintendent or board of the driver’s school may also ask to have driving privileges suspended if a student “withdraws” from school by insufficient attendance, defined as 10 consecutive unexcused absences or 15 unexcused absences in a single semester. The driver may not get their license back until they comply with the law or reach 18.

IOW, all licenses given to people under the age of 18 by the state of Oregon are provisional and subject to parental consent and compliance with laws concerning school attendance. I do not know how emancipated minors are handled, since some rights (such as the right to marry) are not given to anyone under 18, even if emancipated, while an emancipated minor does have the right to enter into legal contracts. (A moot point here, since we’re not talking about emancipated minors)

 

[pnewton]

My His parents have told us many times that IT WAS WHEN HE STARTED DATING MY DAUGHTER that he got serious about life, and started working harder in school and at his full-time job (McDonalds).

…I honestly think that if I had not come along, my husband would be living in a dinky apartment with three other geeky guys, eating peanut butter and mayo sandwiches every night, and never doing anything outside of his computer job other than playing with computers.

So your point is behind every good man there is a woman with a big stick? Hmm. I go along with that. Even priests have Mary.

 

[dshix]

Kids don’t utterly disregard their parents, but kids do tend to think that parents are stupid when they are teens.

Everyone I knew growing up got a car at 16. Like, everyone. The high school parking lot was full of 4 wheel drives that boys had and 4 door sedans that the girls had. There is no walking anywhere in the town I grew up in, since there is NOTHING in the town. You have to drive 20 minutes down a country highway to get to a McDonalds. lol.

Well, I suppose we live in very different places, because where I live people generally don’t get cars till 19-20 and some in their early twenties still take rides with friends and use public transportation.

I don’t think holding hands and walking around the mall is an adult privilege. I don’t think going to the movies or a football game and sitting next to a person you like is wrong at 16. I will never think that is an adult only activity. I don’t think baking cookies and decorating your boyfriend’s locker with his football number for homecoming is an adult privilege AT ALL.

I did not list any of those you mentioned, though I do consider some of them to be particularly froward and inappropriate.

I do not think most people at the age of 16 should be out in the mall with friends without supervision. There is SO much room for inappropriate behavior in that setting.

 

[dshix]

Who tells a 12 year old what their rules will be when they’re 16? Doesn’t this usually depend on the maturity the child exhibits when they get to that age? Also, where does a child get the idea that the rules of their life change just because they don’t believe that their parents (or school or government) doesn’t know what they’re talking about?

You may think that it is a part of life for a 16 year old to have ownership and free use of a car, and maybe it was that way when you were young, but this is not the modern opinion as enshrined in law. In the State of Oregon, a minor may not purchase a car without parental consent, because a minor may not legally sign a binding contract, which includes the cash sale of a car. They may not get a provisional license (this is the license for people under 18) until they are 16 and they cannot have anyone under 20 in the car while they are driving (other than family) until they have had their provisional license for 6 months.

Furthermore, not only is parental consent required by the State of Oregon for anyone under 18 to apply for a provisional permit or license, but that consent may also be withdrawn by parental request made to Oregon DMV in writing at any time until the provisionally-licensed driver reaches 18. Yes, I’m saying that parents in Oregon can legally and quite literally take away the licenses of their under-18 teen drivers.

Finally, the superintendent or board of the driver’s school may also ask to have driving privileges suspended if a student “withdraws” from school by insufficient attendance, defined as 10 consecutive unexcused absences or 15 unexcused absences in a single semester. The driver may not get their license back until they comply with the law or reach 18.

IOW, all licenses given to people under the age of 18 by the state of Oregon are provisional and subject to parental consent and compliance with laws concerning school attendance. I do not know how emancipated minors are handled, since some rights (such as the right to marry) are not given to anyone under 18, even if emancipated, while an emancipated minor does have the right to enter into legal contracts. (A moot point here, since we’re not talking about emancipated minors)

The rules are the same or similar in most states, including my own.

 

[EasterJoy]

I do not think most people at the age of 16 should be out in the mall with friends without supervision. There is SO much room for inappropriate behavior in that setting.

I’m going to knock on wood, because so far my teens think that there is not a bigger waste of their time than aimlessly hanging around a mall. Their view of malls is much like their grandfather’s: If you have to go there at all, then you get in, you buy what you want, and you get out. May this never change!

 

[KendraDZ1902]

Who tells a 12 year old what their rules will be when they’re 16? Doesn’t this usually depend on the maturity the child exhibits when they get to that age? Also, where does a child get the idea that the rules of their life change just because they don’t believe that their parents (or school or government) doesn’t know what they’re talking about?

You may think that it is a part of life for a 16 year old to have ownership and free use of a car, and maybe it was that way when you were young, but this is not the modern opinion as enshrined in law. In the State of Oregon, a minor may not purchase a car without parental consent, because a minor may not legally sign a binding contract, which includes the cash sale of a car. They may not get a provisional license (this is the license for people under 18) until they are 16 and they cannot have anyone under 20 in the car while they are driving (other than family) until they have had their provisional license for 6 months.

Furthermore, not only is parental consent required by the State of Oregon for anyone under 18 to apply for a provisional permit or license, but that consent may also be withdrawn by parental request made to Oregon DMV in writing at any time until the provisionally-licensed driver reaches 18. Yes, I’m saying that parents in Oregon can legally and quite literally take away the licenses of their under-18 teen drivers.

Finally, the superintendent or board of the driver’s school may also ask to have driving privileges suspended if a student “withdraws” from school by insufficient attendance, defined as 10 consecutive unexcused absences or 15 unexcused absences in a single semester. The driver may not get their license back until they comply with the law or reach 18.

IOW, all licenses given to people under the age of 18 by the state of Oregon are provisional and subject to parental consent and compliance with laws concerning school attendance. I do not know how emancipated minors are handled, since some rights (such as the right to marry) are not given to anyone under 18, even if emancipated, while an emancipated minor does have the right to enter into legal contracts.

I didn’t own the car. It did have a big pretty bow on it and I was handed the car keys on my 16th birthday. They were taken from me once. Very embarrassing to ride the bus at 17 for 2 weeks. I was the only high schooler on the bus. LOL.
I’m sure that a 12 year old won’t have the same curfew, but they should know expectations. My parents didn’t have to discipline me very much after about 10 years old. I knew what they expected of me. That didn’t change when I became a teen. I knew what was expected. If you don’t teach kids what you expect of them by around 12, you aren’t going to get through to them.

 

[KendraDZ1902]

Well, I suppose we live in very different places, because where I live people generally don’t get cars till 19-20 and some in their early twenties still take rides with friends and use public transportation.

I did not list any of those you mentioned, though I do consider some of them to be particularly froward and inappropriate.

I do not think most people at the age of 16 should be out in the mall with friends without supervision. There is SO much room for inappropriate behavior in that setting.

You do know that 16 year old are the ones serving you hamburgers and ripping your ticket stub right? LOL. The mall is a public place with LOTS of people. If your kiddo is making out or what not in the mall, then you didn’t do your job as a parent.

 

[angeldia30]

Very good. Looks like your dad knew what he was doing.

Yet I felt like this was overbearing. I even thought that it was very much like the movie “Meet the Parents” … As if he was intentional trying to prevent one from dating

 

[dshix]

I’m going to knock on wood, because so far my teens think that there is not a bigger waste of their time than aimlessly hanging around a mall. Their view of malls is much like their grandfather’s: If you have to go there at all, then you get in, you buy what you want, and you get out. May this never change!

Haha, great! I was much like that myself. I love commonsense teens.

I didn’t own the car. It did have a big pretty bow on it and I was handed the car keys on my 16th birthday. They were taken from me once. Very embarrassing to ride the bus at 17 for 2 weeks. I was the only high schooler on the bus. LOL.

Good. It appears your parents saw that you were responsible enough to handle such a responsibility (or they were irresponsible parents, giving you privileges which you were not ready for.) It all depends on your maturity level at the time.

I’m sure that a 12 year old won’t have the same curfew, but they should know expectations. My parents didn’t have to discipline me very much after about 10 years old. I knew what they expected of me. That didn’t change when I became a teen. I knew what was expected. If you don’t teach kids what you expect of them by around 12, you aren’t going to get through to them.

Agreed. Adult expectations should be required of kids to turn them into adults. Then, when they ACT like adults, they get adult privileges, not before.

You do know that 16 year old are the ones serving you hamburgers and ripping your ticket stub right? LOL. The mall is a public place with LOTS of people. If your kiddo is making out or what not in the mall, then you didn’t do your job as a parent.

Nope. 16 year olds in this day and age generally don’t have the maturity to get jobs on work. They are too busy making out.

I’m not kidding; this is what I see in public places. I haven’t been served in a restaurant by a 16 year old in… a very long time.

Yet I felt like this was overbearing. I even thought that it was very much like the movie “Meet the Parents” … As if he was intentional trying to prevent one from dating

Well, I’m sorry to see that you thought it was overbearing, but perhaps you thought that because of what your mother said? You said that you went to her to try and get more slack, so it appears that maybe she had a different idea of limits than your dad.

All I know is that dads who do things the way you have described your dad generally turn out stable, happy, and strong young women when they finally get out of the house.

 

[EasterJoy]

I didn’t own the car. It did have a big pretty bow on it and I was handed the car keys on my 16th birthday. They were taken from me once. Very embarrassing to ride the bus at 17 for 2 weeks. I was the only high schooler on the bus. LOL.
I’m sure that a 12 year old won’t have the same curfew, but they should know expectations. My parents didn’t have to discipline me very much after about 10 years old. I knew what they expected of me. That didn’t change when I became a teen. I knew what was expected. If you don’t teach kids what you expect of them by around 12, you aren’t going to get through to them.

IOW, you had rules, and truth be told you probably still know how your parents expect any decent* adult *to act, but since you usually abided by them, you hardly knew they were there…the exception being that incident when you were 17. The exception proves the rule!

You are right: to “discipline” means to make a disciple of…you don’t discipline by forcing behavior, but you also don’t discipline by having no expectations at all on the theory that a teen will do whatever they want. You discipline by having those under your authority on board with your ability to guide them to a mutually-agreed upon destination or goal. It must be appropriate to the abilities of the person being guided, though. It is not fair to expect old heads on young shoulders. In the area of sexuality, to be very blunt, even old heads do some very foolish and heartbreaking things if there are not boundaries. The boundaries I am talking about for a 17 year old young man are much the same as the boundaries for a grown man with a wife and children at home, and really far less strict, if the truth be known. You stay out of situations that are too likely to get you into those life-shaking kinds of trouble, and there are no age exemptions.

With my own kids, this has gotten to the point where telling them the consequences that would follow if they were to imitate some of their more foolish peers is not only pointless but practically insulting. So yes, their behavior is mostly driven by what they expect of themselves, and not by rules imposed on them from above.

Still, if you have a 16 year old who expects little of himself or herself, who thinks that moral boundaries and positive goals that require effort are stupid, you can’t afford to say “all is lost” and just throw up your hands and let them go. That is an abdication of responsibility. You would be failing your child if you did that, and who knows in what hell they could wind up that they need not have landed if you do. No, no matter why they are that way, whether your parenting is to blame or not, you are in for some hard work. You will need a lot of luck, but you can’t quit just because you have played the rest of your hand badly or because fate has dealt you difficult cards. You have to hang in there and do your best to get them into adulthood in one piece, and all of the rationalizations in the world won’t get you around that.

 

[Bookcat]

later than sooner…

 

[TheRealJuliane]

I hope that this will make many of you parents think really really hard about your hard-line “no dating” policies. You are assuming that when a teenager “falls in love,” that it will result in them sitting around daydreaming, not doing homework, spending money foolishly, having sex, etc.

Where did you get this idea?!

If you have no more confidence in your children than that, then what on earth did you do with them for the first 10-12 years of their lives to make them into such losers!! Surely you did a better job of raising them than that!

If you truly raised kids that will utterly mess up their lives once they go out with a member of the opposite sex, then tightening the reigns in their teen years will not help. It’s too late for you and your kids. You’ve lost them, and it’s too late to try to start over now.

!

Wow, I don’t think you could have been more condescending here. How rude it is to extrapolate your extraordinary life onto everyone else’s, and judge us because our kids messed up royally. Excuse me, Queen of Life and Parenting! I’ll just crawl off into a corner here and accept that my son was a loser because he fell head over heels with a girl who treated him to all sorts of attractive attention!

:nope::tsktsk:

I’m so glad for your daughter’s boyfriend, what a great experience that must be. We tried to do everything we could to encourage a relationship like that but I guess according to you, we’re losers and our son is a loser because he fell for a girl who wasn’t like your daughter. Goodie for everyone in your life. Yay for you.

:clapping:

That’s the thing - I can see your point of view, but instead of giving parents like me the benefit of the doubt, we’re now losers and our kids are losers and are under our thumb and we don’t have any confidence in them.

Everyone here is trying to do the very best for their children that they know now. You might want to keep that mind from now on.

 

[Bookcat]

I do not plan to really let my children date…

Have friends…be virtuous and be kids.

Got plenty of time to “date” as one gets older.

 

[EasterJoy]

The rules are the same or similar in most states, including my own.

In the old days we could ride around in station wagons with our feet dangling over the tailgate, too. Not everything that used to seem like a good idea actually was a good idea, even if most everyone who did it suffered no harm! When the harm is grave, the tolerance for failure is a lot lower, and the harm that can come from when two young people start their unchaperoned trysts when they are only 16 is very grave and heartbreaking, indeed. That is even true when they have good heads on their shoulders in most respects, and all of us who have escaped our youths know of examples.

 

[dshix]

I do not plan to really let my children date…

Have friends…be virtuous and be kids.

Got plenty of time to “date” as one gets older.

In a nutshell, THIS post sums up my opinion on this issue.

 

[dshix]

In the old days we could ride around in station wagons with our feet dangling over the tailgate, too. Not everything that used to seem like a good idea actually was a good idea, even if most everyone who did it suffered no harm! When the harm is grave, the tolerance for failure is a lot lower, and the harm that can come from when two young people start their unchaperoned trysts when they are only 16 is very grave and heartbreaking, indeed. That is even true when they have good heads on their shoulders in most respects, and all of us who have escaped our youths know of examples.

Yep.

 

[Kamaduck]

Reading this thread really makes me see what an anomaly I am. I’m a teen (16) who thinks dating is more trouble than it’s worth (although that currently applies to all male-female relationships, not just those before the age of 20). My parents realize that this is merely an unusual kind of immaturity in me, and encourage me to talk to boys I like and get to know them. They encourage me to go to dances. And if I wanted to, they would encourage me to date.

I think the right age mostly depends on the kid.

 

[dshix]

Reading this thread really makes me see what an anomaly I am. I’m a teen (16) who thinks dating is more trouble than it’s worth (although that currently applies to all male-female relationships, not just those before the age of 20). My parents realize that this is merely an unusual kind of immaturity in me, and encourage me to talk to boys I like and get to know them. They encourage me to go to dances. And if I wanted to, they would encourage me to date.

I think the right age mostly depends on the kid.

At 16, I had no wish to date simply because I saw the futility of making a romantic, emotional relationship when you can’t go anywhere… marriage is a long way down the road.

However, that did not by any means exclude the possibility of vibrant and close *friendships *with people of both genders.

 

[Kamaduck]

At 16, I had no wish to date simply because I saw the futility of making a romantic, emotional relationship when you can’t go anywhere… marriage is a long way down the road.

I’m pretty sure I just have an antisocial streak.

Really, though, I don’t think romantic relationships would be “futile”… I just think they would be terribly inconvenient and uncomfortable. That doesn’t strike me as the best reason.

 

[dshix]

Wow, I don’t think you could have been more condescending here. How rude it is to extrapolate your extraordinary life onto everyone else’s, and judge us because our kids messed up royally. Excuse me, Queen of Life and Parenting! I’ll just crawl off into a corner here and accept that my son was a loser because he fell head over heels with a girl who treated him to all sorts of attractive attention!

:nope::tsktsk:

I’m so glad for your daughter’s boyfriend, what a great experience that must be. We tried to do everything we could to encourage a relationship like that but I guess according to you, we’re losers and our son is a loser because he fell for a girl who wasn’t like your daughter. Goodie for everyone in your life. Yay for you.

:clapping:

That’s the thing - I can see your point of view, but instead of giving parents like me the benefit of the doubt, we’re now losers and our kids are losers and are under our thumb and we don’t have any confidence in them.

Everyone here is trying to do the very best for their children that they know now. You might want to keep that mind from now on.

Thanks for bringing that up. I’m so used to Cat speaking in a condescending, proud way that I didn’t even think to mention it!!