Time for a New Spiritual (not Religious) Order?

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simpleas

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This popped up on my timeline on Facebook, the author makes some true and interesting points, but I’d like some views on it. It’s quite a long read, so here is the starter and if it interests you please continue and let me know your thoughts.
Thanks.
Speaking of a need for a Reformation makes me question whether the time has arrived for a new religious order that is in fact not tied to a particular religion but is a Spiritual Order, one that might help people of various religious faiths and none to gather around a common value and focus. I think our times call for a focus on the sacredness of the Earth and all her creatures. Therefore I propose a new order called “The Order of the Sacred Earth.” Its members may come from any and all life-styles, married, single, celibate, gay, straight and from any and all occupations so long as their work mirrored the values of honoring and supporting the Earth and her creatures. Blue collar and white collar workers would be welcomed. People of all religious traditions and none would be welcome.
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johnshelbyspong.com/2017/07/06/time-for-a-new-spiritual-not-religious-order/?email=mtstreck@gmail.com
 
It is not man who defines Spiritual, for the Spirit is God, and anything Spiritual will only ever occur under God’s predefined rules, not man’s whims. The heights that man can go without religion is the heights that man can go on his own, and that is a very small ascent.
 
  1. Who needs another Reformation?! Did the first not cause enough problems? Just because we then required a counter-reformation which helped the situation longer-term, doesn’t mean the end justifies the means.
  2. Would be more to the point if the Order worked to love God first rather than the earth and her creatures.
  3. Sounds to me like a mix of Humanism, Paganism with a dash of denominational Protestantism, and could be viewed as being an attempt to direct people away from the Catholic Church, as if ‘Catholic’ does not mean ‘universal’, and that the Church is somehow against certain people - and the article’s definitions for people are of note, too.
Would it not be a better idea to work with what we have?

There are already Catholic-initiated ecumenical multi-faith communities that exist in which people live side-by-side and contribute to the communities from proceeds gained from work. These communities have priests and religious who live on site to say Mass and provide for the needs of such communities.
 
Whenever someone mentions they’re “spiritual, but not religious”, it reminds me of a little snippet that went along the lines of, “even the fallen angels were pure spirit”.

Religion is centered on God-- and we have disagreements because different faith traditions interpret God, or what God wants/expects of us, in different ways. Spirituality is more about inner paths and values-- and so you’re going to have as many different approaches as you have people.

With religion, it’s like being on board a ship-- you have unity, and you’re basically traveling as a group. You need to choose wisely, to make sure your ship is solid and your destination is good and your captain is dependable and there’s good navigation equipment. Spirituality is more like being in a kayak… 🙂

Spirituality is already subjective enough. Why expect people to be able to successfully agree on one single way to “honor and support the Earth and her creatures”— or at least do so harmoniously?
 
The blog from which it comes is John Shelby Spong. John Shelby Spong is a former Episcopalian Bishop who left the fold of the Christian Faith by even the most liberal accounts. What is being proposed here is just a humanistic Universalist type of spiritual organization. You are welcome to do with that what you will.
 
I looked up the author who seems to be a very lost soul in need of prayers. What he proposes is the destruction of Christianity and given the fact that he doesn’t seem to believe that Jesus is the Son of God, performed miracles and is our savior, nor does he seem to have studied the Bible properly, maybe it is not surprising that he is trying to invent another religion. Well that is just my opinion. 🤷
 
This post is special to me because it’s my 200th one.

I am not a fan of spirituality. I don’t think Bishop Spong is lead by the HolySpirit. He is just to liberal to be considered a christian.

Putting together ideas from all religions is not the same as listening to God. Many argue that religions keep people from listening to themselves. Some call it Gut feeling and Mind and Heart in agreement. They are just trying to make people think that religion controls people.

The Catholic Church more than a relgion. We are The body of Christ.
 
This post is special to me because it’s my 200th one.

I am not a fan of spirituality. I don’t think Bishop Spong is lead by the HolySpirit. He is just to liberal to be considered a Christian.

Putting together ideas from all religions is not the same as listening to God. Many argue that religions keep people from listening to themselves. Some call it Gut feeling and Mind and Heart in agreement. They are just trying to make people think that religion controls people.

The Catholic Church is more than a relgion. We are The body of Christ. (According to Colossians 2 1:18)
 
This post is special to me because it’s my 200th one.

I am not a fan of Spirituality. I don’t think former Episcopalian Bishop Spong is lead by the HolySpirit. He is just to liberal to be considered a Christian.

Putting together ideas from all religions is not the same as listening to God. Many argue that religions keep people from listening to themselves. Some call it Gut feeling and Mind and Heart in agreement. They are just trying to make people think that religion controls people.

The Catholic Church is more than a relgion. We are The body of Christ. (According to Colossians 2 1:18)
 
This post is special to me because it’s my 200th one.

I am not a fan of spirituality. I don’t think former Episcopalian Bishop Spong is lead by the HolySpirit. He is just to liberal to be considered a Christian.

Putting together ideas from all religions is not the same as listening to God. Many argue that religions keep people from listening to themselves. Some call it Gut Feeling and Mind and Heart in Agreement. They are just trying to make people think that religion controls people.

The Catholic Church is more than a religion. We are The body of Christ. (According to Colossians 2 1:18)
 
midori said:
With religion, it’s like being on board a ship-- you have unity, and you’re basically traveling as a group. You need to choose wisely, to make sure your ship is solid and your destination is good and your captain is dependable and there’s good navigation equipment. Spirituality is more like being in a kayak… 🙂
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:D:thumbsup:
myway said:
This post is special to me because it’s my 200th one.
Click to expand...
👍
I am not a fan of spirituality. I don’t think former Episcopalian Bishop Spong is lead by the HolySpirit. He is just to liberal to be considered a Christian.
Click to expand...
Putting together ideas from all religions is not the same as listening to God. Many argue that religions keep people from listening to themselves. Some call it Gut Feeling and Mind and Heart in Agreement. They are just trying to make people think that religion controls people.
Click to expand...
The Catholic Church is more than a religion. We are The body of Christ. (According to Colossians 2 1:18)
Click to expand...
👍
 
i do not consider the earth nor its creatures sacred. it may be that the one who wrote the cited comment has a private definition of sacred.
 
i do not consider the earth nor its creatures naturally sacred. it may be that the one who wrote the cited comment has a private definition of sacred.
 
simpleas said:
This popped up on my timeline on Facebook, the author makes some true and interesting points, but I’d like some views on it. It’s quite a long read, so here is the starter and if it interests you please continue and let me know your thoughts.
Thanks.

johnshelbyspong.com/2017/07/06/time-for-a-new-spiritual-not-religious-order/?email=mtstreck@gmail.com
Click to expand...
NO:o

The position is flawed in that TRUTH can be ONLY what in reality it is: SINGULAR per defined issue

Truth
BENEDICT XVI
Benedict says: “If we omit the truth, what do we do anything for?”

Ps.145 Verses 17 to 18 “
[17] The LORD is just in all his ways, and kind in all his doings.
[18] The LORD is near to all who call upon him,
to all who call upon him in truth.

Dictionary Definition of “Truth”
  1. The true or actual state of a matter:
    conformity with fact or reality; verity: the truth of a statement
  2. a verified or indisputable fact, proposition, principle, or the like mathematical truths.
  3. the state or character of being true.
  4. actuality or actual existence.
    .5. an obvious or accepted fact; truism; platitude.
  5. honesty; integrity; truthfulness.
  6. (often initial capital letter) ideal or fundamental reality apart from and
    transcending perceived experience:
  7. agreement with a standard or original.
    9… accuracy, as of position or adjustment.
  8. Archaic. Fidelity or constancy.
TEN REALITIES of a single truth

Fr. John A. Hardon S.J.
“Truth” is the condition of grace; it is the source of grace; it is the channel of grace, it is the divinely ordained requirement of grace.”

While a new Spirituality is a good idea, if it is not fully grouned on GOD"S OWN thruth it’s fruit will rot and be rotten

Matt.7 Verses 13 to 27 "Enter by the narrow gate; for the gate is wide and the way is easy, that leads to destruction, and those who enter by it are many. For the gate is narrow and the way is hard, that leads to life, and those who find it are few.** "Beware of false prophets, who come to you in sheep’s clothing but inwardly are ravenous wolves. You will know them by their fruits. Are grapes gathered from thorns, or figs from thistles? So, every sound tree bears good fruit, but the bad tree bears evil fruit. A sound tree cannot bear evil fruit, nor can a bad tree bear good fruit. ** Every tree that does not bear good fruit is cut down and thrown into the fire. Thus you will know them by their fruits. "Not every one who says to me**, Lord, Lord,' shall enter the kingdom of heaven, but he who does the will of my Father who is in heaven**. On that day many will say to me, Lord, Lord, did we not prophesy in your name, and cast out demons in your name, and do many mighty works in your name?’ And then will I declare to them, `I never knew you; depart from me, you evildoers.’ “Every one then who hears these words of mine and does them will be like a wise man who built his house upon the rock; and the rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and beat upon that house, but it did not fall, because it had been founded on the rock. And every one who hears these words of mine and does not do them will be like a foolish man who built his house upon the sand; and the rain fell, and the floods came, and the winds blew and beat against that house, and it fell; and great was the fall of it.”

AMEN, pray about it!

GBY

Partick
 
simpleas said:
This popped up on my timeline on Facebook, the author makes some true and interesting points, but I’d like some views on it. It’s quite a long read, so here is the starter and if it interests you please continue and let me know your thoughts.
Thanks.

johnshelbyspong.com/2017/07/06/time-for-a-new-spiritual-not-religious-order/?email=mtstreck@gmail.com
Click to expand...
Hard to know what to say other than that I like his honesty, inasmuch as the above doesn’t claim that he’s still part of the Christian religion
 
Avila123 said:
I looked up the author who seems to be a very lost soul in need of prayers. What he proposes is the destruction of Christianity and given the fact that he doesn’t seem to believe that Jesus is the Son of God, performed miracles and is our savior, nor does he seem to have studied the Bible properly, maybe it is not surprising that he is trying to invent another religion. Well that is just my opinion. 🤷
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The Rev. Dr. Matthew Fox is definitely in need of prayers and so are his followers who wish to change Catholicism. However, it seems to me, in the above article, post 1, he is following Genesis 1: 28 usccb.org/bible/genesis/1
28.
“God blessed them and God said to them: Be fertile and multiply; fill the earth and subdue it.* Have dominion over the fish of the sea, the birds of the air, and all the living things that crawl on the earth.”

Regarding the provided quote and link in post 1, I am interested in how one picks out the theme of destroying Christianity. What is he saying? What is the foundation for a new religion?
 
On the other hand, Rev. Dr. Fox asks the question “What then would bind them together as a community?” That simple question hints that a new kind of religion is coming down the road. That simple question/paragraph is the beginning of something new, that is, “a new stage in religious history …” We are now reading about a possible new Non-Catholic Religion.
 
I read this mediation and thought it was appropriate to this thread as Fr Rohr speaks about Rebuilding Christianity “From the Bottom Up”
I don’t know if this means destroying the Church as some people think it would, it would obviously cause some kind of break, because what progressive thinking does is change the mind set.

Have read, please share your thought :

Contemplation Gives Power to the People

Thursday, July 13, 2017

If religious teachers told their parishioners about contemplation, where individuals can experience the mercy of God for themselves, they would not be so dependent upon the clergy. Although this codependency is not engineered maliciously, it does create job security. We all have a hard time doing things that essentially work ourselves out of a job or make ourselves unnecessary. Sin management does hold the flock together, but soon we realize that there is little maturity, or even love, in a flock that is glued together in this way. The passive, passive-dependent, and passive-aggressive nature of the church is rather obvious to many of us who have worked on the inside.

The very emergence of the monks, the early Desert Fathers and Mothers, is an unexpected and surprising third-century movement because there is nothing in Jesus’ teaching to suggest there should be different levels of discipleship in his vision. We are all equally called to follow Jesus, but we created our own caste system; some people were supposed to “get it” and take it seriously, and some were just along for the ride. The very term layperson implies someone who doesn’t know anything. We were left with the professionals and the amateurs. But we were all meant to be professional disciples.
Could meditation or contemplative prayer be the very thing that has the power to both democratize and mature Christianity?

Meditation does not require education; it does not need a hierarchy of decision makers; it does not argue about gender issues in leadership or liturgy; nor does it demand licensed officials for sacraments. Meditation does not need preachers and bishops; it does not have moralistic membership requirements. Meditation lives and thrives with dedicated pray-ers who have every chance of becoming healers in their world, each according to his or her gift. And let’s be very honest, Jesus talked a lot more about praying and healing than anything else.

Christians who meditate are self-initiating. Since we no longer have formal rites of passage in our cultures, we need contemplation to change us. Faithfulness to contemplative practice can achieve the same radical inner renewal as sacraments and formal initiation rites. Contemplation addresses the root, the underlying place, where illusion and ego are generated. It touches the unconscious, where most of our wounds and need for healing lie. With meditation or contemplation, I think we have every likelihood of producing actual elders for the next generation, and not just elderly people.

Gateway to Silence:
Build on the positive; build on love.
 
simpleas said:
I read this mediation and thought it was appropriate to this thread as Fr Rohr speaks about Rebuilding Christianity “From the Bottom Up”
I don’t know if this means destroying the Church as some people think it would, it would obviously cause some kind of break, because what progressive thinking does is change the mind set.
Click to expand...
When observing the prospect of new non-Catholic religions which is described by “Rebuilding Christianity”, I wonder where is the proper interest in progressing thinking mentioned by Simpleas.

Here is one way this meditation initiates progressive thinking or the popular emerging Christianity principle applied to current Catholicism.
“Could meditation or contemplative prayer be the very thing that has the power to both democratize and mature Christianity?”
 
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