Tired of debating? Let's agree on Jesus :)

[whatisthetruth]

Actually i just cut and pasted that apostles creed from a protestant website. the asterisk was connected to a note that the “catholic” in this creed meant the universal christian churcn and was in no way connected to the apostate religion of the church of rome.

In this site it said that this creed was a very ancient creed probably dating to the late first century. I am pretty sure it is a universal creed and not a Roman Catholic one.

CTA1967
Not trying to start any arguments, just pointing out a statement of yours that I disagree with: Luke 2: 21-39

Originally Posted by whatisthetruth
There was a time God sent Jesus to this world as a baby, born of a virgin, and everyone who heard about and/or saw Jesus did not believe that there he was and still is the Messiah our Lord and Saviour.

suupah, I am sorry for making a false assumption…I stand corrected thank you

suupah, I believe in the “universal” catholic church a big difference than the Roman catholic Church

And CTA thank you for the correction, you people are on your toes praise God

I should have said

There was a time God sent Jesus to this world as a baby, born of a virgin, and not everyone who heard about and/or saw Jesus did not believe that there he was and still is the Messiah our Lord and Saviour.

Sorry about that to all our believers

Isn’t it amazing how one small word can change the total meaning of a sentence?

 

[whatisthetruth]

I agree ONE God, ONE Kingdom, ONE Church…all God’s children. Thank you for this thread…a little child of God.

Thank you too for your comments too planter
God
truth

 

[planter654]

I need to ask this question about Jesus please I say this with no disrespect but wanting to know the truth and to please God.

When the messiah walked the earth 2,000 years ago the name Jesus was not in existence. Jesus was a Hebrew Israelite from teh tribe of Juda was he not? He lived with a hebrew name agiven to him from his Father. Jesus is an English name is it not? When were the gospels written after Jesus was it not also 400 yrs later this I do not also know?

The Hebrew Messiah name is YAHSHUAH, which means Yah"s Salvation ro Salvation of Yah. Yah or Yahweh is God’s name is it not? So Yahshuah means God’s Salvation. His name tells you whom hs is and what his mission is, does it not?

Act 4:12 Neither is there salvation in any other, for there is none other name under heaven given among men, whereby we must be saved.

John 2:23 Now when he was in Jerusalem at Passover in the feast day many believed in his name when they saw the miracles which he did.

John 20:31 But these are written that ye might believe that Yahshuah is the messiah, the son of Yah and that believing ye might have life through his name.

Also read John 1:12 Acts 3:16 Act 10:43

Now I ask myself can Jesus be the true name when it didn’t exist 15-17 centuries after the Messiah earthly mission

18 he that believeth on him is not condemned, but he that believeth not is condemed already, because he HATH NOT BELIEVED IN THE NAME OF THE ONLY BEGOTTEN SON OF YAHSHUAH and for God his true name is Yahweh or Yah.

If only in his name we are saved is this not important? Exspecially when it says “believe in the name” The Hebrew alphabet has no letter J in it for the Hebrew Alphabet goes by sound. The letter J was added to our Alphabet some time later it was the last letter added to our Alphabet and I forget the year.

What I also ask myself why did the Catholic Church change Jesus name? We can all say Yahshuah and God’s name Yahweh.

Is this not affending him? God chose his name? His name has meaning and it is our salvation…believe in his name, ask in his name etc. It makes so much sense to me his name “God’s Salvation”

Hebrew names have meaning like Bethehem means in hebrew " house of Bread" Manger in hebrew means “chew” something to eat. Isn’t that interesting? this is where Jesus was born and what he laid in. Very interesting.

I pray always in asking God to Teach me to know him.

God Bless…a very little child of God

 

[planter654]

Please do not judge me or call me anti or what ever for I believe and I am Catholic just want to understand. God has an lead me to this by simply asking him to teach me all that I may please him.

God Bless…a very little child of God

 

[Fidelis]

When the messiah walked the earth 2,000 years ago the name Jesus was not in existence. Jesus was a Hebrew Israelite from teh tribe of Juda was he not? He lived with a hebrew name agiven to him from his Father. Jesus is an English name is it not? When were the gospels written after Jesus was it not also 400 yrs later this I do not also know?

The Hebrew Messiah name is YAHSHUAH, which means Yah"s Salvation ro Salvation of Yah. Yah or Yahweh is God’s name is it not? So Yahshuah means God’s Salvation. His name tells you whom hs is and what his mission is, does it not?

Now I ask myself can Jesus be the true name when it didn’t exist 15-17 centuries after the Messiah earthly mission

If only in his name we are saved is this not important? Exspecially when it says “believe in the name” The Hebrew alphabet has no letter J in it for the Hebrew Alphabet goes by sound. The letter J was added to our Alphabet some time later it was the last letter added to our Alphabet and I forget the year.

What I also ask myself why did the Catholic Church change Jesus name? We can all say Yahshuah and God’s name Yahweh.

Is this not affending him? God chose his name? His name has meaning and it is our salvation…believe in his name, ask in his name etc. It makes so much sense to me his name "God’s Salvation.

We render the Messiah’s name Jesus because, as heirs to Western Civilization, that is how it has come down to us through our Greek, Latin, and now English language heritage.

We all know who we are talking about when we say the name of Jesus, and we are all aware what the meaning of Jesus’ name is (it is right in the Bible). It is not disrespectful to render someone’s name in a way that is familiar to the speaker. My name is Vince. When I interact with some Spanish speakers, they sometimes call me Vicente. I do not find it disrespectful, but rather endearing. And it doesn’t change who I am.

One of the Protestant Reformers was named Jean Cauvin. We call him John Calvin, because that is the English rendering of the French. It’s not disrespectful and it doesn’t change the meaning of his name. It’s just easier and more familiar for us as English speakers.

The name of Jesus means Savior, but the pronunciation of the name has no “magic” in it that saves us. He is still the Saviour no matter how we render it.

If you wish to call Our Lord “Yahshuah,” you are welcome to do so. But no one else is required to. I love my Lord, and my Lord’s name, to me, is Jesus.

Hope that helps.

 

[Mousey]

I need to ask this question about Jesus please I say this with no disrespect but wanting to know the truth and to please God.

It is always good to seek the truth

When the messiah walked the earth 2,000 years ago the name Jesus was not in existence. Jesus was a Hebrew Israelite from teh tribe of Juda was he not? He lived with a hebrew name agiven to him from his Father. Jesus is an English name is it not?

The word Jesus is the Latin form of the Greek Iesous, which in turn is the transliteration of the Hebrew Jeshua, or Joshua, or again Jehoshua, meaning "Jehovah is salvation."link
Though the name in one form or another occurs frequently in the Old Testament, it was not borne by a person of prominence between the time of Josue, the son of Nun and Josue, the high priest in the days of Zorobabel. It was also the name of the author of Ecclesiaticus, of one of Christ’s ancestors mentioned in the genealogy, found in the Third Gospel (Luke 3:29), and one of the St. Paul’s companions (Colossians 4:11). During the Hellenizing period, Jason, a purely Greek analogon of Jesus, appears to have been adopted by many (1 Maccabees 8:17; 12:16; 14:22; 2 Maccabees 1:7; 2:24; 4:7-26; 5:5-10; Acts 17:5-9; Romans 16:21). The Greek name is connected with verb iasthai, to heal; it is therefore, not surprising that some of the Greek Fathers allied the word Jesus with same root (Eusebius, “Dem. Ev.”, IV; cf. Acts 9:34; 10:38). Though about the time of Christ the name Jesus appears to have been fairly common. It is not correct that the name did not exist.

When were the gospels written after Jesus was it not also 400 yrs later this I do not also know?

The Gospels were written in the first century.

The Hebrew Messiah name is YAHSHUAH, which means Yah"s Salvation ro Salvation of Yah. Yah or Yahweh is God’s name is it not? So Yahshuah means God’s Salvation. His name tells you whom hs is and what his mission is, does it not?

see above. As for Yah or Yahweh being God’s name you should read this Names of God

Now I ask myself can Jesus be the true name when it didn’t exist 15-17 centuries after the Messiah earthly mission

See information above. You are starting from a wrong premise. You are stating that there is a difference in names when it is the same name. Spanish pronounces the name of Jesus differently than English speakers it doesn’t change the fact that it is the same name.

If only in his name we are saved is this not important? Exspecially when it says “believe in the name” The Hebrew alphabet has no letter J in it for the Hebrew Alphabet goes by sound. The letter J was added to our Alphabet some time later it was the last letter added to our Alphabet and I forget the year.

That is why we are baptized in The name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.

Is this not affending him? God chose his name? His name has meaning and it is our salvation…believe in his name, ask in his name etc. It makes so much sense to me his name “God’s Salvation”

No it does not offend God. the Jews held Gods name in such reverence that they never pronounced it. One reason why we do not know the correct pronunciation.
Something else you should consider.
Exodus
Chapter 3

1
13
“But,” said Moses to God, “when I go to the Israelites and say to them, ‘The God of your fathers has sent me to you,’ if they ask me, ‘What is his name?’ what am I to tell them?”
14
6 God replied, “I am who am.” Then he added, “This is what you shall tell the Israelites: I AM sent me to you.”

 

[inJESUS]

Lets agree on Jesus i hear you, am in

 

[planter654]

We render the Messiah’s name Jesus because, as heirs to Western Civilization, that is how it has come down to us through our Greek, Latin, and now English language heritage.

We all know who we are talking about when we say the name of Jesus, and we are all aware what the meaning of Jesus’ name is (it is right in the Bible). It is not disrespectful to render someone’s name in a way that is familiar to the speaker. My name is Vince. When I interact with some Spanish speakers, they sometimes call me Vicente. I do not find it disrespectful, but rather endearing. And it doesn’t change who I am.

One of the Protestant Reformers was named Jean Cauvin. We call him John Calvin, because that is the English rendering of the French. It’s not disrespectful and it doesn’t change the meaning of his name. It’s just easier and more familiar for us as English speakers.

The name of Jesus means Savior, but the pronunciation of the name has no “magic” in it that saves us. He is still the Saviour no matter how we render it.

If you wish to call Our Lord “Yahshuah,” you are welcome to do so. But no one else is required to. I love my Lord, and my Lord’s name, to me, is Jesus.

Hope that helps.

Yes, it does help me understand, thank thank you very much! It might sound silly to you, but when I found out Jesus was a hebrew, must of had a Hebrew name. I was scared, I would be insulting our Lord, so I would pray saying “both” our Lord’s name. Then I wondered why we were never told, taught this in school etc. To know Jesus history that he was a Hebrew Israelite helps me understand more of him personally when walking the earth and God’s chosen people.

For instant: Jacob is now called (Israel),so God’s chosen people were Israelites. God changed his name, like Abram, Abraham, Jacob, Israel, Saul, Paul, Simeon, Peter theses are great chosen men of God. It tells me very strongly names are very important to God for he changed them. They have deep meaning and great honour that goes with their names, don’t you think?

Anyway thank you for saying it is not disrespectful for Jesus is our Savior. God does answer prayer! I ask him to teach me about him the truth, so I will not be deceived. To know all that pleases him.

Thank You very much

God BLess …a very little child of God

 

[planter654]

It is always good to seek the truth

The word Jesus is the Latin form of the Greek Iesous, which in turn is the transliteration of the Hebrew Jeshua, or Joshua, or again Jehoshua, meaning "Jehovah is salvation."link
Though the name in one form or another occurs frequently in the Old Testament, it was not borne by a person of prominence between the time of Josue, the son of Nun and Josue, the high priest in the days of Zorobabel. It was also the name of the author of Ecclesiaticus, of one of Christ’s ancestors mentioned in the genealogy, found in the Third Gospel (Luke 3:29), and one of the St. Paul’s companions (Colossians 4:11). During the Hellenizing period, Jason, a purely Greek analogon of Jesus, appears to have been adopted by many (1 Maccabees 8:17; 12:16; 14:22; 2 Maccabees 1:7; 2:24; 4:7-26; 5:5-10; Acts 17:5-9; Romans 16:21). The Greek name is connected with verb iasthai, to heal; it is therefore, not surprising that some of the Greek Fathers allied the word Jesus with same root (Eusebius, “Dem. Ev.”, IV; cf. Acts 9:34; 10:38). Though about the time of Christ the name Jesus appears to have been fairly common. It is not correct that the name did not exist.

The Gospels were written in the first century.

see above. As for Yah or Yahweh being God’s name you should read this Names of God

See information above. You are starting from a wrong premise. You are stating that there is a difference in names when it is the same name. Spanish pronounces the name of Jesus differently than English speakers it doesn’t change the fact that it is the same name.

That is why we are baptized in The name of the Father and of the Son and of the Holy Spirit.

No it does not offend God. the Jews held Gods name in such reverence that they never pronounced it. One reason why we do not know the correct pronunciation.
Something else you should consider.
Exodus
Chapter 3

1
13
“But,” said Moses to God, “when I go to the Israelites and say to them, ‘The God of your fathers has sent me to you,’ if they ask me, ‘What is his name?’ what am I to tell them?”
14
6 God replied, “I am who am.” Then he added, “This is what you shall tell the Israelites: I AM sent me to you.”

God Bless and thank you very much for your answer to me, also done so in kindness. a very little child of God.

 

[planter654]

We render the Messiah’s name Jesus because, as heirs to Western Civilization, that is how it has come down to us through our Greek, Latin, and now English language heritage.

We all know who we are talking about when we say the name of Jesus, and we are all aware what the meaning of Jesus’ name is (it is right in the Bible). It is not disrespectful to render someone’s name in a way that is familiar to the speaker. My name is Vince. When I interact with some Spanish speakers, they sometimes call me Vicente. I do not find it disrespectful, but rather endearing. And it doesn’t change who I am.

One of the Protestant Reformers was named Jean Cauvin. We call him John Calvin, because that is the English rendering of the French. It’s not disrespectful and it doesn’t change the meaning of his name. It’s just easier and more familiar for us as English speakers.

The name of Jesus means Savior, but the pronunciation of the name has no “magic” in it that saves us. He is still the Saviour no matter how we render it.

If you wish to call Our Lord “Yahshuah,” you are welcome to do so. But no one else is required to. I love my Lord, and my Lord’s name, to me, is Jesus.

Hope that helps.

Thankk you for your answer God Bless

 

[Isa_Almisry]

Actually i just cut and pasted that apostles creed from a protestant website. the asterisk was connected to a note that the “catholic” in this creed meant the universal christian churcn and was in no way connected to the apostate religion of the church of rome.

In this site it said that this creed was a very ancient creed probably dating to the late first century. I am pretty sure it is a universal creed and not a Roman Catholic one.

Yes and no.

Back in my Lutheran days I remember that the Book of Concord I had mentioned in passing that the Orthodox had never heard of the Apostles Creed.

However, it conforms with Orthodoxy, so no problem, so much so that the Western Rite Orthodox have it (we don’t let them have liturgical texts that differs from Orthodox beliefs, or leave them in doubt).

For purposes of comparison:
Original:
Credo in Deum Patrem omnipotentem, Creatorem caeli et terrae. Et in Iesum Christum, Filium Eius unicum, Dominum nostrum, qui conceptus est de Spiritu Sancto, natus ex Maria Virgine, passus sub Pontio Pilato, crucifixus, mortuus, et sepultus, descendit ad ínferos, tertia die resurrexit a mortuis, ascendit ad caelos, sedet ad dexteram Dei Patris omnipotentis, inde venturus est iudicare vivos et mortuos. Credo in Spiritum Sanctum, sanctam Ecclesiam catholicam, sanctorum communionem, remissionem peccatorum, carnis resurrectionem, vitam aeternam. Amen.

Latin, from the Vatican website:

I believe in God the Father almighty,
Creator of heaven and earth.
And in Jesus Christ, His only Son,
our Lord, Who was conceived by the Holy Spirit,
born of the Virgin Mary,
suffered under Pontius Pilate,
was crucified, died, and was buried.
He descended into hell; the third day
He rose again from the dead;
He ascended into heaven, and sits at
the right hand of God the Father
almighty, from thence He shall come
to judge the living and the dead.
I believe in the Holy Spirit,
the holy Catholic Church,
the communion of saints,
the forgiveness of sins,
the resurrection of the body
and life everlasting.
Amen.

Western Orthodox Rite (St. Andrew Service Book)

I believe in God the Father almighty,
Maker of heaven and earth;
And in Jesus Christ, His only Son our Lord:
Who was conceived by the Holy Ghost,
born of the Virgin Mary,
suffered under Pontius Pilate,
was crucified, died, and was buried;
He descended into hell; the third day
He rose again from the dead;
He ascended into heaven, and sitteth at
the right hand of God the Father
Almighty; from thence He shall come
to judge the living and the dead.
I believe in the Holy Ghost,
the Holy Catholic Church,
the Communion of Saints,
the forgiveness of sins,
the resurrection of the body
and the life everlasting.
Amen.

 

[Fidelis]

Thankk you for your answer God Bless

You are welcome.

 

[suupah]

suupah, I believe in the “universal” catholic church a big difference than the Roman catholic Church

Well that depends on how you look at it. That “catholic” (little “c”) church had many branches that were in unity. there was one in Rome. it just so happens that the one in Rome still exists. So you could say it is one of the surviving original “catholic” (little “c”) churches along with many orthodox churches.

 

[DebChris]

My ears and heart are open…please share

“Now let your servant go in peace because my eyes have seen your salvation.”—Simeon at the Presentation of Our Lord Jesus Christ (Luke, ch. 2). In accord with Jewish Law and Tradition, the first born son was to be dedicated to the Lord as ransom and in remembrance of the Passover and the Firstborn slain of Egypt.
The 4th Joyful Mystery of the Rosary is the Presentation. As I recite the Hail Mary, I add the word “Redeemer” after the fruit of your womb, Jesus________" for this reason.

Actually i just cut and pasted that apostles creed from a protestant website. the asterisk was connected to a note that the “catholic” in this creed meant the universal christian churcn and was in no way connected to the apostate religion of the church of rome.

In this site it said that this creed was a very ancient creed probably dating to the late first century. I am pretty sure it is a universal creed and not a Roman Catholic one.

The Nicene Creed is recited at Mass every Sunday. This same prayer is recited in the Luthern, Prebysterian and other mainstream non-Catholic churches as well.
Jesus Christ taught his disciples the Our Father which is universally prayed among the Christian churches. The Presbyterians say, “and forgive us our debts as we forgive our debtors.” while many, including Catholics say “forgive us our trespasses…” A common practice among the Jews and early Christians was to add a codicil at the end of a prayer. The Bible ends the Our Father with with “and lead us not into temptation but deliver us from evil.” This is common practice for Catholics during daily prayer while non-Catholics add, “for thine is the Kingdom, the Power and the Glory.” Catholics add this during the Mass with a small prayer between. It is added during eucumenical prayer meetings and is how I pray the Our Father at the end of Charismatic Prayer meetings and when I pray the Liturgy of the Hours.

 

[Isa_Almisry]

Well that depends on how you look at it. That “catholic” (little “c”) church had many branches that were in unity. there was one in Rome. it just so happens that the one in Rome still exists. So you could say it is one of the surviving original “catholic” (little “c”) churches along with many orthodox churches.

Orthodox Catholic Churches, still in communion.

 

[whatisthetruth]

Originally Posted by whatisthetruth
suupah, I believe in the “universal” catholic church a big difference than the Roman catholic Church

Well that depends on how you look at it. That “catholic” (little “c”) church had many branches that were in unity. there was one in Rome. it just so happens that the one in Rome still exists. So you could say it is one of the surviving original “catholic” (little “c”) churches along with many orthodox churches.

Suupah, I am afraid you took my quote from another thread

On this thread, we are talking about the letter c, not a small c but a capital C in

Jesus Christ

Friends, enjoy the following and may
God :blessyou all

youtube.com/watch?v=8M4_IlbaZHA

A beautiful Jesus painting to the song “Above All”

 

[suupah]

Suupah, I am afraid you took my quote from another thread

On this thread, we are talking about the letter c, not a small c but a capital C in

Jesus Christ

Friends, enjoy the following and may
God :blessyou all

youtube.com/watch?v=8M4_IlbaZHA

A beautiful Jesus painting to the song “Above All”

I forgot that Christ was separate from the church. my bad

 

[whatisthetruth]

Hi suupah,

I am confused by the comment you made…

suupah

I forgot that Christ was separate from the church. my bad

Were you being sarcastic? I hope not.

If you were not being sarcastic than I can only see one other way you meant by that comment…

That you believe, Christ is separate from any church that does not follow the teachings of the Roman Catholic faith.

Am I correct? Please correct me if I am wrong.

If I am right, I agree with you that we have a disagreement on what Jesus’ church is and /or the church that God wants.

I do not believe that Jesus is separate from all the churches not of the RC faith.

That is why I opened this thread, to agree on Jesus and who He is, not to debate one what His church is

If by chance you were being sarcastic, I am sorry it got to the point where you felt the need for sarcasm.

Suupah, I like your signature…

My substance is faith in God!

I am sorry for this question but…

does your faith in God allow sarcasm when communicating with other people when discussing and expressing our differences?

I have given you nothing but respect when responding to you.

Lets review and see how we got to this point.

To my opening thread comments you said

suupah
Lets not reinvent the wheel. here is what we can all agree on

then you quoted the The Apostles Creedwith an inserted asterisk

I believe in the Holy Spirit, the holy *****catholic church,

Then I replied,

Unfortunately, your statement “here is what we can all agree on” is not true of how all people believe today. That belief only applies to RC’s belief. Then suupah, you quoted the The Apostles Creed with your very subtle “I am right… you are wrong attitude”

It is great that you believe in what the Apostles Creed says as I do. I believe everything it says except what is implied in the the one line I quoted.

“I believe in the Holy Spirit, the holy (Jesus Christ) catholic (universal) church”
not
"I believe in the Holy Spirit, the holy (Roman) catholic church

Then you replied

Actually i just cut and pasted that apostles creed from a protestant website.

Too which I replied

suupah, **I am sorry **for making a false assumption…I stand corrected thank you
suupah, I believe in the “universal” catholic church (is) a big difference than the Roman catholic Church

Then you replied quoting me first

I believe in the “universal” catholic church a big difference than the Roman catholic Church

Well that depends on how you look at it. That “catholic” (little “c”) church had many branches that were in unity. there was one in Rome. it just so happens that the one in Rome still exists. So you could say it is one of the surviving original “catholic” (little “c”) churches along with many orthodox churches

Then I replied

Suupah, I am afraid you took my quote from another thread

Which I want to apologize to you Suupah, I did post that on this thread

On this thread, we are talking about the letter c, not a small c but a capital C in Jesus Christ

The reason I said that is I did not want this thread to turn into a debate on whether or not the little c RC church is Jesus’ one and only church.

I wanted to encourage the topic on the big C in Jesus Christ and who He is.

Then you made the comment.

I forgot that Christ was separate from the church. my bad

I hope you answered my concern I addressed above to you.

Just to let you know, I believe Jesus Christ loves everyone and wants to be the most important part of everyone’s life. It is up to us as individuals to realize that and to live our lives trusting Him in His word and opening our hearts to Him and receive the love and gracious gift He has for us.

please enjoy these videos

Open the eyes to my heart Lord

Who am I

Then their are the unbelievers we are trying to reach, Which I hope we believers are praying that God will open their hearts.

Suupah, did you by chance view and listen to the following which is another one of my favorites?

Jesus Painting**
A beautiful Jesus painting to the song “Above All”

God Suupah and your family in 2008

truth**

 

[suupah]

Hi suupah,

Just to let you know, I believe Jesus Christ loves everyone and wants to be the most important part of everyone’s life. It is up to us as individuals to realize that and to live our lives trusting Him in His word and opening our hearts to Him and receive the love and gracious gift He has for us.

This is true. what is in question is exactly what trusting him and being obedient to him means.

The only thing we can agree on is what Jesus did and who he was. What we can’t agree on is what it means and what he wants us to do.

As for my comment earlier, I forgot that in evangelical circles Christ and churches are considered separate. It is just Christ and individuals within many churches that make up his body. He has an invisible body. In catholic circles his body is visible and is the church.

I think i am done with this thread

cheers

 

[psyche23]

Whatisthetruth you wrote:

Wow, 55 viewers and only 2 replies, I am surprised. I guess we rather debate our differences than try to find common ground… mainly our Lord and Saviour Jesus Christ

(sorry, I can’t figure out how to use those quote boxes)

I’d say I look at these forums as mainly teaching tools to learn from each other. Whether through debate or searching for commonalities. It is just easier to find something to say when debating (friendly of course) because you can only comment so much on how alike we all are and how we all should agree. It is of course admirable to look for similarities, just harder to comment on. Please don’t judge the number of replies to be our disagreement with your intentions.