Tired of hearing "We don't do that anymore"

[Margaret33]

I understand I am posting in a forum of those who are well-versed and knowledgeable about our Catholic faith… and I have many questions. I hope you won’t think me too ignorant, but I’m very confused… So many things I have come to know and understand while growing up are either wrong or obsolete in my church. For the past few years I felt this was Catholicism as a whole and am still unsure what things are truly obsolete everywhere, and what are just according to the church I attend or whom I am speaking to. Hoping you can shed some light?

1. Do any churches exist where you can go to confession when you need to, or are they all just one scheduled hour of the week to wait in line?
2. Do any Catholic churches leave their doors open during non-mass times for parishioners to come in and pray privately in a pew or light a candle? Or speak to a priest without making an appointment?
3. My church has dropped the word ‘Roman’ from all outside signs, bulletin, and any reference to ‘Catholic’ or ‘Catholic Church’. I could swear it was there just last year (please don’t think me an idiot, I’ve only been back a few years after having been away from the church for some years). Is this a decision instituted by a Pope past or present? If so, why?
4. ‘Purgatory is no longer measured in time’ and therefore ‘Indulgences are a thing of the past and have been considered obsolete in prayer and practice’.
5. If I refer to anything which took place prior to Vatican II with those who work in the church, I always feel a bit of disapproval for bringing it up and am quickly told “That was pre-Vatican II” and it is dismissed without discussion. And I suddenly feel as if I’ve said a dirty word or something without realizing it. I understand that things have changed, and I know we are not to question the Authority of the Pope or his Church, at no point have I intimated that I did. I guess I just have a certain sentimentality towards older customs, and am just wondering why it is so wrong to have any reverence for the past at least in the slightest way… what is it that I’m not getting?

I’m sure I have many more questions, so as not to inundate you with what you may consider stupid/obvious questions that any good Catholic should already know the answers to, I will hold them for now. I am trying to learn what I can as to all the changes which have taken place in the Catholic religion over the years that I’ve obviously missed, but there are so many sources and they frequently contradict each other…

Any suggestions for good resources which explain just what is/is not acceptable/recognized/practiced today would be greatly appreciated. Or at least information on what is practiced by some churches and not others… I have The Catechism of the Catholic Church, but some of what I’m told by those who work at the church contradicts what I read.

 

[the_phoenix]

Dear Margaret,

Welcome, nice to meet you!

1. Do any Catholic churches leave their doors open during non-mass times for parishioners to come in and pray privately in a pew or light a candle? Or speak to a priest without making an appointment?

My Catholic parish has a Perpetual Adoration Chapel which is always open. The doors are open publicly until 10:00 p.m., at which time you need to know a security code in order to get in. If you volunteer as a Eucharistic Adorer, you are told the code and can then visit Jesus anytime, day or night! (Which I absolutely love, being very much a night person!)

1. ‘Purgatory is no longer measured in time’ and therefore ‘Indulgences are a thing of the past and have been considered obsolete in prayer and practice’.

Purgatory is real. If you want to hear a personal witness about what happened the day my grandmother died, please feel welcome to PM me. Her name was Margaret, btw.

I have The Catechism of the Catholic Church, but some of what I’m told by those who work at the church contradicts what I read.

Whenever it comes down to a choice between trusting the local priest or trusting the Pope, the Vatican, and the Teachings of the Church, trust the Pope, the Vatican, and the Teachings of the Church. Follow the Catechism.

~~ the phoenix

 

[Pug]

and therefore ‘Indulgences are a thing of the past and have been considered obsolete in prayer and practice’.

Hardly. Recently, we had John Paul 2 proclaim an indulgence for the millenium year. If the Pope is busy making up new indulgences and promulgating them, they are are not obsolete. They’ve updated the enchiridion, too (a big list of indulgences).

Saying the rosary with the others before mass, reading the bible, saying various traditional prayers (like Look down on me good and gentle Jesus) are all indulgenced.

The big change is that they are not listed by phrases like “300 days indulgence”. Don’t worry! I love indulgences, and they are alive and kicking. However, I admit many people in the pew have forgotten about them.

 

[AJV]

1. Do any churches exist where you can go to confession when you need to, or are they all just one scheduled hour of the week to wait in line?

Yes. My parish has confession little before and during all Masses. However, we are blessed with more priests which is not the case everywhere.

1. Do any Catholic churches leave their doors open during non-mass times for parishioners to come in and pray privately in a pew or light a candle? Or speak to a priest without making an appointment?

Yes, also. I would think especially for the latter. In some places there may be security risks or something, so they may decide to keep the church closed for fear of profanation (Not alwys the case but is a possibility).

1. My church has dropped the word ‘Roman’ from all outside signs, bulletin, and any reference to ‘Catholic’ or ‘Catholic Church’. I could swear it was there just last year (please don’t think me an idiot, I’ve only been back a few years after having been away from the church for some years). Is this a decision instituted by a Pope past or present? If so, why?

No.

1. ‘Purgatory is no longer measured in time’ and therefore ‘Indulgences are a thing of the past and have been considered obsolete in prayer and practice’.

No. There is a Handbook of Indulgences, but they are no longer in “x days” or “x years” since that practise originally represented the amount of equivalent penance. They are now either “partial” (only part of the temporal punishment) or “plenary” (the whole). You gain gain indulgences for lots of things like praying for the Pope’s intentions, reciting the rosary, etc. See here, here (Code of Canon Law) and here (the Handbook- was updated a bit but that doesn’t seem to be online)

 

[Margaret33]

Thank you for the warm welcome, nice to meet you as well!

My Catholic parish has a Perpetual Adoration Chapel which is always open. The doors are open publicly until 10:00 p.m., at which time you need to know a security code in order to get in. If you volunteer as a Eucharistic Adorer, you are told the code and can then visit Jesus anytime, day or night! (Which I absolutely love, being very much a night person!)

Love this idea… Such a simple solution to the problem of Catholic churches having to protect against the robberies which caused them to close their doors in the first place … wish they would do it at mine…

Purgatory is real. If you want to hear a personal witness about what happened the day my grandmother died, please feel welcome to PM me. Her name was Margaret, btw.

It was never said purgatory was not real, they just said that it wasn’t measured in increments of time anymore and that indulgences an old concept which didn’t hold much weight anymore. I will PM you some other time you are on here, would love to talk about it…

Whenever it comes down to a choice between trusting the local priest or trusting the Pope, the Vatican, and the Teachings of the Church, trust the Pope, the Vatican, and the Teachings of the Church. Follow the Catechism.

I know this to be true, I need to remember it and stop allowing other people to pollute what I learn from reliable sources… regardless of what position they hold in the church.

Thanks again…

 

[Margaret33]

they are are not obsolete. They’ve updated the enchiridion, too (a big list of indulgences).
The big change is that they are not listed by phrases like “300 days indulgence”. Don’t worry! I love indulgences, and they are alive and kicking. However, I admit many people in the pew have forgotten about them. Okay, I understand more now… Thank you very much for your wisdom Pug

 

[Margaret33]

… they are are not obsolete. They’ve updated the enchiridion, too (a big list of indulgences).

I posted a link to one version of the enchiridion in the following thread!: forums.catholic-questions.org/showthread.php?t=132851&page=3&highlight=rosary
I would love to have a link to the more recent version if you have one…

Saying the rosary with the others before mass, reading the bible, saying various traditional prayers (like Look down on me good and gentle Jesus) are all indulgenced.

I mentioned the rosary indulgence in that thread too! Glad to know there others who think along the same wavelength

The big change is that they are not listed by phrases like “300 days indulgence”. Don’t worry! I love indulgences, and they are alive and kicking. However, I admit many people in the pew have forgotten about them.

I understand more now and am glad I joined this forum and have been able to learn from so many who know so much more… don’t know why I’m fascinated by indulgences too, I collect holy/prayer cards and always find those with the older indulgences are the most interesting… Thank you very much for your wisdom Pug

 

[Margaret33]

Yes. My parish has confession little before and during all Masses. However, we are blessed with more priests which is not the case everywhere.

That makes sense… we only have one so I should have made the connection.

Yes, also. I would think especially for the latter. In some places there may be security risks or something, so they may decide to keep the church closed for fear of profanation (Not alwys the case but is a possibility).

Glad to know there still are some out there! I truly miss the ability to go and say a prayer in a moment of need, or light a candle for my mother when I want to. Guess that’s just a trade off of modern society and it’s many ills… so sad that crime has to change things so sacred.

Regarding the loss of the word ‘Roman’… Shall I just take this as my church’s way of illustrating it is not traditional? Or does it mean more than that you think? Any opinions you may have would be of interest.

here, here (Code of Canon Law) and here (the Handbook- was updated a bit but that doesn’t seem to be online)

Thank you for posting this! I had a link to the Enchiridion of Indugences that I posted in another forum, and was hoping there was a more recent version available and you’ve answered that question. Also, so so grateful for the link to ‘Code of Canon Law’… love that this is available online and you’ve given me a wealth of learning in this one link alone… Bless you and hope to speak with you again,

Margaret

 

[Pug]

Margaret,

The *translation *of the 1999 edition of the enchiridion was not online yet, when I last looked. You can read the decree about it here in English, or you can read the enchiridion in the Latin original here. It is the fourth edition.

I know what you mean about those older prayer cards. One of my favorites is the Anima Christi (Soul of Christ…).

 

[MTD]

1. Do any churches exist where you can go to confession when you need to, or are they all just one scheduled hour of the week to wait in line?

The availability of confession depends on the number of priests, how necessary they regard the sacrament, and the number of penitents. My parish has confessions twice a day on weekdays and Saturdays and four times on the first Sunday of the month. But it’s also true that we do have several priests, they value confession, and the parishioners make frequent use of confession.

As to going to confession when you need to: I’m sure any priest would be willing to set up an appointment for you to confess.

1. Do any Catholic churches leave their doors open during non-mass times for parishioners to come in and pray privately in a pew or light a candle? Or speak to a priest without making an appointment?

I think it depends on the area and the frequency of parishioners stopping by. My parish locks the front doors but leaves the side open during the day between Masses. Of course, part of the reason is because there’s adoration of the Blessed Sacrament from after the noon Mass to 7:30 PM.

1. My church has dropped the word ‘Roman’ from all outside signs, bulletin, and any reference to ‘Catholic’ or ‘Catholic Church’. I could swear it was there just last year (please don’t think me an idiot, I’ve only been back a few years after having been away from the church for some years). Is this a decision instituted by a Pope past or present? If so, why?

No, it’s not a decision of the Pope. The newest instruction on the Mass is entitled General Instruction of the Roman Missal.

1. ‘Purgatory is no longer measured in time’ and therefore ‘Indulgences are a thing of the past and have been considered obsolete in prayer and practice’.

Purgatory never was measured in time. The “300 days,” etc. you see attached to old prayers was supposed to be figurative language. Today, in order to avoid confusion, the term “partial indulgence” is used instead of “indulgence of n days/years.”

1. If I refer to anything which took place prior to Vatican II with those who work in the church, I always feel a bit of disapproval for bringing it up and am quickly told “That was pre-Vatican II” and it is dismissed without discussion. And I suddenly feel as if I’ve said a dirty word or something without realizing it. I understand that things have changed, and I know we are not to question the Authority of the Pope or his Church, at no point have I intimated that I did. I guess I just have a certain sentimentality towards older customs, and am just wondering why it is so wrong to have any reverence for the past at least in the slightest way… what is it that I’m not getting?

The Church started 2000 years ago, not 40. Those who dismiss anything pre-Vatican II are forgetting that. You will not find the Pope dismissing everything pre-Vatican II!

Any suggestions for good resources which explain just what is/is not acceptable/recognized/practiced today would be greatly appreciated.

EWTN is a great resource. Completely reliable and faithful to the teachings and disciplines of the Church.

I have The Catechism of the Catholic Church, but some of what I’m told by those who work at the church contradicts what I read.

Do not trust anything anyone says that is contrary to the Catechism. Unfortunately, today there are many misinformed Catholics, as well as some who do not agree with the Church and actively oppose some of her teachings/disciplines. But the latter are forgetting that Christ said to His apostles, “He that heareth you, heareth me; and he that despiseth you, despiseth me; and he that despiseth me, despiseth him that sent me.” (Luke 10:16) This same promise also applies to their successors, the Pope and the bishops in union with him.

Maria

 

[Margaret33]

Margaret,

The *translation *of the 1999 edition of the enchiridion was not online yet, when I last looked. You can read the decree about it here in English, or you can read the enchiridion in the Latin original here. It is the fourth edition.

I know what you mean about those older prayer cards. One of my favorites is the Anima Christi (Soul of Christ…).

Thank you for the link! I’m having a hard time coming up with one favorite … but I seem to definitely be developing a Marian affinity as of late

 

[Margaret33]

As to going to confession when you need to: I’m sure any priest would be willing to set up an appointment for you to confess.

Yes, I have been told this at my local church. It’s just not the same I guess, but I’ll survive

No, it’s not a decision of the Pope. The newest instruction on the Mass is entitled General Instruction of the Roman Missal.

Thank you.

The Church started 2000 years ago, not 40. Those who dismiss anything pre-Vatican II are forgetting that.

Perfectly expresses how I feel about the issue, you put it into words, thank you again.

As to EWTN… Such an obvious choice I overlooked … !
Used to watch it a lot, but haven’t in a while… time to get cable again - how pathetic am I? lol

Do not trust anything anyone says that is contrary to the Catechism. Unfortunately, today there are many misinformed Catholics, as well as some who do not agree with the Church and actively oppose some of her teachings/disciplines. But the latter are forgetting that Christ said to His apostles, “He that heareth you, heareth me; and he that despiseth you, despiseth me; and he that despiseth me, despiseth him that sent me.” (Luke 10:16) This same promise also applies to their successors, the Pope and the bishops in union with him.

Maria

Lesson learned… Point well taken… Thank you Maria!!

 

[Pug]

Thank you for the link! I’m having a hard time coming up with one favorite … but I seem to definitely be developing a Marian affinity as of late

You know, this may sound silly, but my favorite Marian prayer is one of the oldest ones known, the Sub Tuum. Do you know that one? There are other good ones, especially the Hail Holy Queen. The English version of that is so, oh, poetic and moving.

Here is a link to a good picture and the text of the Sub Tuum.

 

[jamannor]

1. I just graduated from Michigan Tech, and the school parish always allowed us to visit all hours of the night. It was very nice, especially the library which was always quieter then the library. But this is also the upper peninsula of Michigan too, I left my car keys in my car a lot too.

 

[blessedtoo]

1. Do any churches exist where you can go to confession when you need to, or are they all just one scheduled hour of the week to wait in line?

Margaret, Welcome!
I too am a revert, back 4 years after a 27 year absence. I feel your pain!

The first Parish I attended had Confession once every TWO WEEKS for 1 hour! You can imagine my shock. Churches in my city generally have it once a week, on Saturday afternoon. However, I have made appointments quite often and priests are always available for that when needed.

1. Do any Catholic churches leave their doors open during non-mass times for parishioners to come in and pray privately in a pew or light a candle? Or speak to a priest without making an appointment?

The only Church in this whole city that keeps the doors unlocked is the Cathedral. Otherwise, they are all locked. Those few that offer perpetual Adoration usually give you a code for the chapel. But to just drop in and speak to a priest, well, good luck with that, my friend!

1. My church has dropped the word ‘Roman’ from all outside signs, bulletin, and any reference to ‘Catholic’ or ‘Catholic Church’. I could swear it was there just last year (please don’t think me an idiot, I’ve only been back a few years after having been away from the church for some years). Is this a decision instituted by a Pope past or present? If so, why?

Good Lord, I can’t remember the last time I saw a Church that identified as Roman Catholic. Out here, we have “Catholic Communities”. Draw your own conclusions.

1. If I refer to anything which took place prior to Vatican II with those who work in the church, I always feel a bit of disapproval for bringing it up and am quickly told “That was pre-Vatican II” and it is dismissed without discussion. And I suddenly feel as if I’ve said a dirty word or something without realizing it. I understand that things have changed, and I know we are not to question the Authority of the Pope or his Church, at no point have I intimated that I did. I guess I just have a certain sentimentality towards older customs, and am just wondering why it is so wrong to have any reverence for the past at least in the slightest way… what is it that I’m not getting?

Gosh, hope I’m not sounding too negative but you’d best prepare yourself for feeling very lonely. Those of us who long for the traditions and customs of our beloved Church are, for the most part, considered “kooky”. When I go to daily Mass early for the Rosary, it’s me and 7 octogenarians clinging to our beads and prayer cards. We are out here (and you’ll find us on these forums) but it can be lonely.

 

[Rolltide]

1. My church has dropped the word ‘Roman’ from all outside signs, bulletin, and any reference to ‘Catholic’ or ‘Catholic Church’. I could swear it was there just last year (please don’t think me an idiot, I’ve only been back a few years after having been away from the church for some years). Is this a decision instituted by a Pope past or present? If so, why?

Another reason for this is because the term is a bit of a misnomer, actually. Although it has been used for ages, there is not only a “Roman” (or Latin) branch of the Catholic Church, but 22 other “Eastern” Catholic Churches in communion with the pope. Some feel the term “Roman Catholic” focuses too heavily on one branch of the church, when all are equal. The word “Catholic” simply means “Universal”, so the Roman part isn’t really necessary. Nevertheless, there has been no official change regarding this.

 

[Margaret33]

You know, this may sound silly, but my favorite Marian prayer is one of the oldest ones known, the Sub Tuum. Do you know that one? There are other good ones, especially the Hail Holy Queen. The English version of that is so, oh, poetic and moving.

Here is a link to a good picture and the text of the Sub Tuum.

Admittedly I do not know the first you mention (at least not by name) and I will check it out, thank you! I carry a laminated version of the Hail Holy Queen in the zipper compartment of my purse, so that should tell you how much I adore it

 

[Margaret33]

I left my car keys in my car a lot too.

lol… I’m good at that trick too!

 

[Margaret33]

Margaret, Welcome!
I too am a revert, back 4 years after a 27 year absence. I feel your pain!

Not as many years away, but we’ve been back about the same amount of years almost… strange how fast all these changes took place and how far left behind I feel and you must as well!

And I thought an hour a week was too strict… once every two weeks is even worse…

But to just drop in and speak to a priest, well, good luck with that, my friend!

Yeah, an idea which time has surely left behind…

Good Lord, I can’t remember the last time I saw a Church that identified as Roman Catholic. Out here, we have “Catholic Communities”. Draw your own conclusions.

Gosh, hope I’m not sounding too negative but you’d best prepare yourself for feeling very lonely. Those of us who long for the traditions and customs of our beloved Church are, for the most part, considered “kooky”. When I go to daily Mass early for the Rosary, it’s me and 7 octogenarians clinging to our beads and prayer cards. We are out here (and you’ll find us on these forums) but it can be lonely.

No, not negative really, just answering me honestly… and I do appreciate knowing I’m not the only one who feels this way. I was beginning to feel like everything I’d remembered from my childhood was remembered wrong or something… or that I was the only one left who felt some traditions were worth holding onto…

Gosh it make me feel old! But maybe that’s the whole point, lol…

 

[Margaret33]

Some feel the term “Roman Catholic” focuses too heavily on one branch of the church, when all are equal. The word “Catholic” simply means “Universal”, so the Roman part isn’t really necessary.

Well I’m sorry, I just don’t agree with that. But then again that’s probably why I chose to speak in a Traditional forum… To me ‘Roman’, just like the Vatican, is the heart and soul of the Catholic Church. I don’t want to argue the point, you are perfectly entitled to your opinion.