Tired

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FluteLoop

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I’m really tired and at the end of my rope.

My marriage is 22 years old, 2 children, both grown.

I left the Catholic church as a teen. I’ve attended community churches of various non denominational kinds. I married 22 years ago, another former Catholic, who also attended non denom churches. We were married in a civil ceremony.

Our marriage has been rocky for the last few years. I married way too young. Since returning to trying to be Catholic, I have discovered my marriage lacked form to be valid. My husband would be willing to have our marriage blessed but this is my problem, and I can’t find any examples of my situation anywhere, and I’m too afraid to broach the topic with my own priest.

As far as it being a ‘simple’ matter to have it blessed and be valid…
I simply DO NOT WANT TO! Its INVALID.

The kids are grown, I have fulfilled my obligations to them as far as making a home and caring for them. They are married, they have their own homes.

I am currently seperated but not divorced. I DO NOT WANT to remain married to this man. I feel nothing for him, and felt nothing but relief at the idea that there is no valid marriage.

I do not want to validate this mistake with a blessing.

He sees this as selfish and further evidence of the Church’s “corruption” since they aren’t supporting his marriage. He is very adamant about reconciliation.

He was a former Catholic and didn’t follow the marriage laws either, so I don’t see him as an innocent party.

Do I have a moral obligation to have a terrible marriage that I want out of, blessed, just because it was a civil marriage and we had children?

Thanks
 
I know it would be difficult for you to discuss the situation with your priest, but for your own peace of mind you need to discuss it with a priest, whatever the outcome may be. Perhaps seek out someone from a different parish?

If you’re separated and have no desire to reconcile, then seek a divorce, and don’t convalidate!

No priest with an ounce of sense or respect for the sacrament of marriage would consent to convalidate if you were separated anyway - any more than he would marry a couple who had no intention of ever living together. It would make a mockery of the vows you two pronounced in front of him.
 
If it wasn’t a Sacrament, and clearly it wasn’t, you’re not obliged to marry this man.

Marriage isn’t undertaken simply because one person wants it, both must want it. Clearly you don’t.

Your husband’s claim that the Church is corrupt for not supporting this marriage is odd considering there are a lot of people out there who wish the Church was less adamant regarding the sacredness of it when a Sacrament. The Church is simply saying it wasn’t a valid marriage and it still wouldn’t be valid if you felt forced to marry because of this man’s will.
 
flute loop,
unless your adult children have voiced clear indications that they wish you were free of the pains and destruction of your civil but invalid marriage, then i think you have an obligation to your children to try to salvage your marriage.

not according to your thinking, not according to his thinking, but to try and salvage your relationship according to the mind of God. can you create something the Lord will be pleased to bless? you can tell him there’s no ‘together’ unless he’s interested in creating a union that the Lord would be pleased to bless.

try retrovaille. really desperate situations have found new ground from which to begin again. if you can save it, then have your renewed relationship blessed as a sacramental marriage if not, t leave with a sad heart, but clear conscience.

there’s a lot to be said for the mysterious graces of the sacrament helping people be married.

finding the happy flaw (invalidity) and running with it seems like a terrible blow to your kids and a huge hurdle for them to overcome in their own faith journeys if they want you to reconcile.

i know a gal who was raised catholic, but left the church when her dad walked out of the invalid marriage. she said, 'my father divorced my mother and remarried in the CHURCH!! with the Church’s blessing, he did this. I will never be catholic again."

i saved this poor gal’s email. it reminds me to pray for her regularly. her pain is palpable and terribly real.

unless your kids have been begging you to leave for decades, try it again for the sake of their faith.
 
monicatholic said:
flute loop,
unless your adult children have voiced clear indications that they wish you were free of the pains and destruction of your civil but invalid marriage, then i think you have an obligation to your children to try to salvage your marriage.

not according to your thinking, not according to his thinking, but to try and salvage your relationship according to the mind of God. can you create something the Lord will be pleased to bless? you can tell him there’s no ‘together’ unless he’s interested in creating a union that the Lord would be pleased to bless.

try retrovaille. really desperate situations have found new ground from which to begin again. if you can save it, then have your renewed relationship blessed as a sacramental marriage if not, t leave with a sad heart, but clear conscience.

there’s a lot to be said for the mysterious graces of the sacrament helping people be married.

finding the happy flaw (invalidity) and running with it seems like a terrible blow to your kids and a huge hurdle for them to overcome in their own faith journeys if they want you to reconcile.

i know a gal who was raised catholic, but left the church when her dad walked out of the invalid marriage. she said, 'my father divorced my mother and remarried in the CHURCH!! with the Church’s blessing, he did this. I will never be catholic again."

i saved this poor gal’s email. it reminds me to pray for her regularly. her pain is palpable and terribly real.

unless your kids have been begging you to leave for decades, try it again for the sake of their faith.
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Retrouvaille is a wonderful program, from what I’ve heard.

I don’t see where her children - all grown - should really have any say in this. Perhaps some serious education with regard to Catholic marriage laws, and the reasons behind them, is in order to prevent the kind of reaction the daughter you cited in your post had.
 
my parents divorced when i was adult.

though i had seen it coming, my other siblings were years in tailspins. it devastated them.

should they have a say? their very sense of origin and resulting identity can be profoundly affected.

the gal of whom i spoke had a thorough cognitive understanding of the cannon law involved. her heart, on the other hand, had no such understanding.

we should avoid giving our kids scandal. we should avoid, if possible, traumatizing their world.

the OPs kids may have no such perspective. they may be campaigning for their mom’s relief for a long time. but i suggested she should consider them. i still think so.
 
monicatholic said:
my parents divorced when i was adult.

though i had seen it coming, my other siblings were years in tailspins. it devastated them.

should they have a say? their very sense of origin and resulting identity can be profoundly affected.

the gal of whom i spoke had a thorough cognitive understanding of the cannon law involved. her heart, on the other hand, had no such understanding.

we should avoid giving our kids scandal. we should avoid, if possible, traumatizing their world.

the OPs kids may have no such perspective. they may be campaigning for their mom’s relief for a long time. but i suggested she should consider them. i still think so.
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Clearly your own sad experience is coloring your opinion here - understandable. However, this is not a valid, sacramental marriage, and the fact is that the OP has options. Perhaps by the grace of God she will have a change of heart, but love cannot be forced. We don’t know what she has endured.

I think the greater scandal would be having a marriage blessed when she could not honestly make the necessary vows.
 
However, this is not a valid, sacramental marriage, and the fact is that the OP has options. Perhaps by the grace of God she will have a change of heart, but love cannot be forced.
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not according to your thinking, not according to his thinking, but to try and salvage your relationship according to the mind of God. can you create something the Lord will be pleased to bless? you can tell him there’s no ‘together’ unless he’s interested in creating a union that the Lord would be pleased to bless.
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i stand by my suggestions. that you would advise differently is your option.
 
I find myself agreeing with monicatholic. Even as a grown woman, with children of my own, I would find the end of my parent’s marriage devastating.
It would strike me at the very heart of me, as a product of both.
It would throw my whole up bringing into disarray, and make a nonsense of the importance marriage that they had previously instilled. It would unravel me in a sense.
Perhaps your children would not feel like this, but I know that just because you reach 18, you don’t become immune from hurt.
 
apricot_yogurt said:
I find myself agreeing with monicatholic. Even as a grown woman, with children of my own, I would find the end of my parent’s marriage devastating.
It would strike me at the very heart of me, as a product of both.
It would throw my whole up bringing into disarray, and make a nonsense of the importance marriage that they had previously instilled. It would unravel me in a sense.
Perhaps your children would not feel like this, but I know that just because you reach 18, you don’t become immune from hurt.
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What about the (surely equal) devastation to your parents of staying in a rotten sham of a so-called marriage? Doesn’t that strike at their very hearts?

What about the fact that you’re allegedly grown-up and therefore, while of course not immune from hurt, at least able to work through the pain of your parents’ breakup, as an adult does with such events, and as you no doubt would the breakup of your own marriage? Would you return the favour and stay in your marriage for your parents’ sake, even if you knew they would be devastated by your breakup?

I’m trying very hard not to get angry here, but it sounds like you think your parents welfare (I don’t just speak of happiness, there’s more to it than that) and THEIR hurt matters naught compared to yours.
 
Hi,

My marriage I regard as invalid from the start. Although we married in the Catholic Church, he wasn’t a Catholic. But I say it was invalid because he didn’t love Christ, nor did I at that stage, even though I was a Catholic. Bad marriage from start. Later I married Christ in my heart when I went through a conversion after my husband and I separated. I now know had we both been married to Christ in our hearts it probably would have worked, however maybe we weren’t meant to stay together. I prayed for guidance from Christ before I left because marriage was hell but I was Catholic and wasn’t sure what I was meant to do. Something happened and I left very quickly. The flip side though of my story was I ended up vowing to stick with God and not marry again. I’ve decided to work for Christ. I felt guilty I left, but it was actually better for my children in the end because they weren’t subjected to the stress and anger that they had to live with while their dad and I were together. Although it was hard for them at first, and harder for my youngest; she felt she didn’t have a family anymore, they managed with some counselling to cope and things are working out. It is a hard choice to make. So the only thing I can suggest is pray to Christ for guidance on what you are meant to do. I do know prayers can pull marriages together, however I didn’t think to pray for my marriage, I actually prayed to get out of it, and sometimes I wonder had I prayed more for it to work it might have, but then I will never know, but I do know staying single afterwards has given me the opportunity to grow so much more in my relationship with Christ, which I couldn’t do when I was married as everything had to be for my husband, there was no room for Christ. Christ gave me an out, but I think the reason for that was to get me to come back to him (finally have a spiritual marriage) and to now work for him. Christ has his reasons. Pray to him to guide you, maybe not rush your decision either way, and he will assist you in what you are to do.

God bless in whichever way you are guided, and may you continue to grow in your relationship with Christ.
 
when two Catholics approach their pastor about convalidating their marriage they must undergo the same marriage preparation and counselling as any other couple, adapted to their situation (length of time of the relationship, children etc). and will certainly not be allowed to convalidate if there is not assurance that they intend to fulfill the conditions for the sacrament, or that the relationship will continue at all. OP needs to get over the non-issue of “embarrasment” and talk to her priest, that’s what he is there for.
 
monicatholic said:
flute loop,
unless your adult children have voiced clear indications that they wish you were free of the pains and destruction of your civil but invalid marriage, then i think you have an obligation to your children to try to salvage your marriage.

.
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disagree
your children have no (name removed by moderator)ut in this decision. talk to your priest.
 
FluteLoop said:
He sees this as selfish and further evidence of the Church’s “corruption” since they aren’t supporting his marriage.
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That’s his problem, not yours.
FluteLoop said:
Do I have a moral obligation to have a terrible marriage that I want out of, blessed, just because it was a civil marriage and we had children?
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No. You don’t.

Moreover, convalidation requires the giving and receiving of consent. If you cannot truly consent to this marriage and all that the vows represent-- and clearly you do not believe you can-- then you would be unable to convalidate.

Don’t convalidate for your children’s “sake”-- that is nonsense. Don’t convalidate because your husband has an attitude. Don’t convalidate for any reason other than you love your husband with your whole heart and intend a marriage til death.

If you can’t do that, then don’t convalidate and move forward with civil divorce.
 
OP i am sorry for your situation and will pray for you.

I understand you are returning to the church after sometime away, Welcome back…

I have one issue with your post…

"and felt nothing but relief at the idea that there is no valid marriage. "

Don’t use the church as the reason for ending this marriage. I understand it isn’t valid in the church, but you did marry (civil) this man, raise two children with him for 22 years. Too then one day say I am returning to the church and our marriage is no longer valid, in my opinion is wrong.

I am sure there are other reasons for you feelings, but the church should never be used as a weapon…

If you don’t love this man, and wish to end it fine. Please speak with your Priest about what your going thru.

But don’t use the Catholic Church as your reason for doing so, please

just my two cents…
 
1ke said:
That’s his problem, not yours.

No. You don’t.

Moreover, convalidation requires the giving and receiving of consent. If you cannot truly consent to this marriage and all that the vows represent-- and clearly you do not believe you can-- then you would be unable to convalidate.

Don’t convalidate for your children’s “sake”-- that is nonsense. Don’t convalidate because your husband has an attitude. Don’t convalidate for any reason other than you love your husband with your whole heart and intend a marriage til death.

If you can’t do that, then don’t convalidate and move forward with civil divorce.
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Words of wisdom. Sad situation, but that’s the reality.
 
23eagle23 said:
OP i am sorry for your situation and will pray for you.

I understand you are returning to the church after sometime away, Welcome back…

I have one issue with your post…

"and felt nothing but relief at the idea that there is no valid marriage. "

Don’t use the church as the reason for ending this marriage. I understand it isn’t valid in the church, but you did marry (civil) this man, raise two children with him for 22 years. Too then one day say I am returning to the church and our marriage is no longer valid, in my opinion is wrong.

I am sure there are other reasons for you feelings, but the church should never be used as a weapon…

If you don’t love this man, and wish to end it fine. Please speak with your Priest about what your going thru.

But don’t use the Catholic Church as your reason for doing so, please

just my two cents…
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I hardly the OP is “using the church as a weapon”. She simply discovered that hers was never considered a valid sacramental marriage anyway, and is, given the situation, relieved to discover that.

Speaking with her priest is, indeed, a good idea.
 
Don’t convalidate for your children’s “sake”-- that is nonsense.
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It is nonsense. Good thing nobody has, in fact, suggested this.
 
Thanks for the link,

WOW, I am shocked…

Learn something ever day…
 
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