To be extraordinary ministers of communion or not to be?

[John_Lilburne]

From the 2002 General Instruction of the Roman Missal (GIRM) approved for the USA, which can be accessed from romanrite.com/girm.html :
“97. The faithful, moreover, should not refuse to serve the People of God gladly whenever they are asked to perform some particular ministry or function in the celebration.”

So having been asked, to refuse to perform a particular ministry requires fairly substantial reasons.

I think it is wrong to give blessings during the communion procession. That applies whether a person is ordained or not.

Canon 1168 makes it clear that some lay people, some of the time, can give blessings: “… in accord with the norm of the liturgical books and according to the judgment of the local ordinary, some sacramentals can also be administered by lay persons who are endowned with the appropriate qualities.” (see vatican.va/archive/ENG1104/_INDEX.HTM for the Code of Canon Law). For example, the liturgical book “Book of Blessings” has an Order for the Blessing of the Sick. The instructions are: “378 The present order may be used by a priest or deacon. It may also be used by a layperson, who follows the rites and prayers designated for a lay minister. …”.
(Book of Blessings, Liturgical Press, Minnesota, 1989, ISBN 0-8146-1875-8, page 121).

On the communion-plate, the 2004 Instruction Redemptionis Sacramentum has:
“[93.] The Communion-plate for the Communion of the faithful should be retained, so as to avoid the danger of the sacred host or some fragment of it falling. [footnote 180: Cf. Missale Romanum, Institutio Generalis, n. 118.]”

But the 2002 GIRM removed the instructions for using the communion-plate that were in the 1975 GIRM, except for intinction. The 2002 GIRM has:
“287. If Communion from the chalice is carried out by intinction, each communicant, holding a communion-plate under the chin, approaches the priest, who holds a vessel with the sacred particles, a minister standing at his side and holding the chalice. The priest takes a host, dips it partly into the chalice and, showing it, says, Corpus et Sanguis Christi (The Body and Blood of Christ). The communicant responds, Amen, receives the Sacrament in the mouth from the priest, and then withdraws.”

The 1975 GIRM had, but 2002 GIRM does not have:
“117. He then takes the paten or a ciborium and goes to the communicants. If communion is given only under the form of bread, he raises the eucharistic bread slightly and shows it to each one, saying: The body of Christ. The communicants reply: Amen and, holding the communion plate under their chin receive the sacrament.”

Altar severs holding the communion plate is not mentioned in either GIRM, so it would not be following the liturgical books if they did.

I have not seen an official explanation on what should happen if some of the people are to receive communion in the hand.

 

[japhy]

Hosts used today are pretty sturdy - it is unlikely bits will just ‘break off’.

Something to keep in mind re the gold example - chemicals are used as a part of greed - the ore collected and melted together into larger sizes.

I stopped receiving in the hand because whenever I would receive from the celebrant’s larger host (the one he breaks during the Fractio), it would leave fragments in my hand. The third time that happened, I decided not to receive in the hand anymore.

And your second comment isn’t relevant to the topic.

 

[japhy]

On the communion-plate, the 2004 Instruction Redemptionis Sacramentum has:
“[93.] The Communion-plate for the Communion of the faithful should be retained, so as to avoid the danger of the sacred host or some fragment of it falling. [footnote 180: Cf. Missale Romanum, Institutio Generalis, n. 118.]”

But the 2002 GIRM removed the instructions for using the communion-plate that were in the 1975 GIRM, except for intinction. The 2002 GIRM has:
“287. If Communion from the chalice is carried out by intinction, each communicant, holding a communion-plate under the chin, approaches the priest, who holds a vessel with the sacred particles, a minister standing at his side and holding the chalice. The priest takes a host, dips it partly into the chalice and, showing it, says, Corpus et Sanguis Christi (The Body and Blood of Christ). The communicant responds, Amen, receives the Sacrament in the mouth from the priest, and then withdraws.”

The 1975 GIRM had, but 2002 GIRM does not have:
“117. He then takes the paten or a ciborium and goes to the communicants. If communion is given only under the form of bread, he raises the eucharistic bread slightly and shows it to each one, saying: The body of Christ. The communicants reply: Amen and, holding the communion plate under their chin receive the sacrament.”

Altar severs holding the communion plate is not mentioned in either GIRM, so it would not be following the liturgical books if they did.

I have not seen an official explanation on what should happen if some of the people are to receive communion in the hand.

This is one point on which the GIRM is rather confusing and ambiguous (and, if I dare say it, wrong). The paten for catching fragments has gotten lost in the latest GIRM, but the CCDDS recommends its retention. The wording (whereby each communicant holds the plate under his own chin) is bizarre and requires some manner of choreography: who hands the plate to the communicant (and why can’t that person just hold the plate for the whole time?) and what if the person who receives the plate drops it or holds it incorrectly causing it to lose all the fragments it has caught? The more it’s passed back and forth like that, the more likely it is.

The traditional practice of having a minister by the priest holding out the communion plate is far more sane and safe.

 

[Just_1_hr_a_wk]

And your second comment isn’t relevant to the topic.

Nor is the example of mining for gold.

 

[Rose_Maniple]

I stopped receiving in the hand because whenever I would receive from the celebrant’s larger host (the one he breaks during the Fractio), it would leave fragments in my hand. The third time that happened, I decided not to receive in the hand anymore.

It’s becoming increasingly popular in Anglican parishes to use loaf bread for the Eucharist, which is a nightmare for anyone with a high-Catholic view of the Sacrament. On the one hand, it crumbles all over the place, and on the other, it is impossible to receive on the tongue. :doh2:

 

[arkenbergcn]

My whole “Gold Ore” comment was only meant to show how even the smallest particles of the host should be treated with reverence and not just ignored like so many people do. Again, yes, the pieces are small, but if you were to put them all together they would be more significant than one might think. When I posted this question I simply wanted some constructive feedback. Maybe from someone who is a EMHC or maybe even someone who has tackled this same decision. Being more of a “traditional” Catholic I like to see things done reverently during mass, which is why I am having such a hard time with this. I also think that if God is calling me to be a EMHC I definitely do not want to ignore his call. I just wish these things could be more standard so that Masses everywhere would be the same. Only if I could attend a Latin Mass every Sunday…

 

[Rose_Maniple]

Once the accidents no longer are truly visible and identifiable as the bread/wine consecrated at the mass then they are no longer the Sacrament.

Is this Catholic doctrine? It sounds rather like the “If Jesus can get into the bread, he can figure out how to get out of it” line I often hear.

 

[japhy]

And your second comment isn’t relevant to the topic.

Nor is the example of mining for gold.

I beg to differ. Let’s review:

Something to consider: Gold mines will actually use chemicals to leech out the smallest particles of gold in the raw ore. Why? Because these small pieces are still Gold and they have value. Why wouldn’t the smallest piece of the host, even if we can just barely see it still be the body and blood of Christ? These pieces are the body & blood of Christ no matter what their size and that’s why I worry about ignoring them.

arkenbergcn echoes the sentiments of St. Cyril of Jerusalem:So then after having carefully hallowed your eyes by the touch of the Holy Body, partake of it; giving heed lest you lose any portion thereof; for whatever you lose, is evidently a loss to you as it were from one of your own members. For tell me, if any one gave you grains of gold, would you not hold them with all carefulness, being on your guard against losing any of them, and suffering loss? Will you not then much more carefully keep watch, that not a crumb fall from you of what is more precious than gold and precious stones? (Catechetical Lecture XXIII, n. 21)
The point arkenbergcn was making was this: to gold miners, even the smallest fragment of gold is precious and worth going through such measures to extract from ore; likewise, we should be careful not to lose even the smallest fragment of the Precious Body, which is worth far more than a fleck of gold dust.

Of course we don’t leech the Precious Body. That’s not the point being made. The analogy was not a 1-to-1 correspondence.

 

[Just_1_hr_a_wk]

Is this Catholic doctrine? It sounds rather like the “If Jesus can get into the bread, he can figure out how to get out of it” line I often hear.

I am not familiar with any Catholic doctrine that specifies that anything that might possibly, on the off chance, even though you can’t tell what it is, have come from the Blessed Sacrament should be treated as if it is the Blessed Sacrament.

Now if one goes to communion with clean, dry hands - receives in the hand then discovers something was left after having consumed the host it is reasonable to think the “something” came from the host and it should be consumed as well.

If bits break off from a host and fall the ground they should be picked up.

If the minister distributing notes that all hosts give to the faithful were intact should that minister worry about particles falling to the ground?

 

[Just_1_hr_a_wk]

My whole “Gold Ore” comment was only meant to show how even the smallest particles of the host should be treated with reverence and not just ignored like so many people do. Again, yes, the pieces are small, but if you were to put them all together they would be more significant than one might think. When I posted this question I simply wanted some constructive feedback. Maybe from someone who is a EMHC or maybe even someone who has tackled this same decision. Being more of a “traditional” Catholic I like to see things done reverently during mass, which is why I am having such a hard time with this. I also think that if God is calling me to be a EMHC I definitely do not want to ignore his call. I just wish these things could be more standard so that Masses everywhere would be the same. Only if I could attend a Latin Mass every Sunday…

**I have been an EMHC, it is a wonderful way to serve God.

BTW, if you could attend a TLM every Sunday you would be dodging God’s call in this. Just a thought.**

 

[japhy]

Is this Catholic doctrine? It sounds rather like the “If Jesus can get into the bread, he can figure out how to get out of it” line I often hear.

As long as the accidents of bread and wine remain, they are the Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity of Jesus Christ. Once the accidents are no longer present, the Real Presence is no longer. Otherwise, we’d be desecrating the Lord’s Precious Body and Blood when we go to the bathroom.

If there are fragments of the Host that are not to be consumed, they are to be dissolved in water until the appearance of bread is gone; similarly, when the Precious Blood is spilled on a hard surface, it is to be diluted with water until the appearance of wine is no more.

 

[Just_1_hr_a_wk]

As long as the accidents of bread and wine remain, they are the Body, Blood, Soul, and Divinity of Jesus Christ. Once the accidents are no longer present, the Real Presence is no longer. Otherwise, we’d be desecrating the Lord’s Precious Body and Blood when we go to the bathroom.

If there are fragments of the Host that are not to be consumed, they are to be dissolved in water until the appearance of bread is gone; similarly, when the Precious Blood is spilled on a hard surface, it is to be diluted with water until the appearance of wine is no more.

The question always comes up - how small a ‘fragment’/particle retains the appearance of bread.

 

[japhy]

If the minister distributing notes that all hosts give to the faithful were intact should that minister worry about particles falling to the ground?

But the minister isn’t the only person who should be paying attention… the communicant should pay attention too. I’ve seen people receive in the hand and wipe their hands on their jeans right after. (I’ve also seen people receive from the cup and then wipe their lips with the back of their hand.)

If you could attend a TLM every Sunday you would be dodging God’s call in this. Just a thought.

I don’t think he said he’s certain he’s being called by God to this extraordinary ministry. He’s still discerning it through prayer and discussion.

 

[PatienceAndLove]

The question always comes up - how small a ‘fragment’/particle retains the appearance of bread.

Your skin flakes all day long. No matter how small that skin flake it, it is still you.

 

[Just_1_hr_a_wk]

Your skin flakes all day long. No matter how small that skin flake it, it is still you.

Some of these comments get very tiresome.

 

[Just_1_hr_a_wk]

But the minister isn’t the only person who should be paying attention… the communicant should pay attention too. I’ve seen people receive in the hand and wipe their hands on their jeans right after. (I’ve also seen people receive from the cup and then wipe their lips with the back of their hand.)

I don’t think he said he’s certain he’s being called by God to this extraordinary ministry. He’s still discerning it through prayer and discussion.

**So now (bit further on from where I picked up this post I think) we have someone saying we flake off bits of skin all day.

What if the ‘dust’ or ‘particles’ some get so worried about are actually their own skin that happen to flake off just when they were receiving communion.

There comes a point where some of this tips into the dark area of scruples.**

 

[PatienceAndLove]

**So now (bit further on from where I picked up this post I think) we have someone saying we flake off bits of skin all day.

What if the ‘dust’ or ‘particles’ some get so worried about are actually their own skin that happen to flake off just when they were receiving communion.

There comes a point where some of this tips into the dark area of scruples.**

This is why patens are preferred and churches should be hardwood/stone and not carpeted. Then the host particles can be properly taken care of in the sacrarium.

I think the fact that some of us sit and mull over these things is very telling.

 

[PatienceAndLove]

Some of these comments get very tiresome.

Why are they tiresome?

“A person is a person no matter how small” -Horton

That pertains to Jesus too. The consecrated host remains consecrated for all eternity and every little bit of it, no matter how small it is, is the Body, Blood, Soul and Divinity of Our Lord Jesus Christ- hence the uproar and concern.

 

[Brendan]

**
BTW, if you could attend a TLM every Sunday you would be dodging God’s call in this. Just a thought.**

I think you missed St. Monica’s first post. It was the pastor that called, not God. It’s not good to confuse the two.

 

[Brendan]

This is one point on which the GIRM is rather confusing and ambiguous (and, if I dare say it, wrong). The paten for catching fragments has gotten lost in the latest GIRM, but the CCDDS recommends its retention. The wording (whereby each communicant holds the plate under his own chin) is bizarre and requires some manner of choreography: who hands the plate to the communicant (and why can’t that person just hold the plate for the whole time?) and what if the person who receives the plate drops it or holds it incorrectly causing it to lose all the fragments it has caught? The more it’s passed back and forth like that, the more likely it is.

The traditional practice of having a minister by the priest holding out the communion plate is far more sane and safe.

Redemptionis Sacramentum is clearer on the need for a paten

1. The Communion-plate for the Communion of the faithful should be retained, so as to avoid the danger of the sacred host or some fragment of it falling.