To believe? - help me to understand

[Mijoy2]

I so hesitated to create a thread for this quick and probably (to some) obvious and easy question but it is very important to me to get others thoughts.

I did look this up in various dictionaries but am still confused to the definitive answer. i.e accept as true; take to be true; Neither of these mention degree.

How do we define belief? Evangelicals use the word in very much a binary fashion. i.e. if you believe in Jesus and that He died for your sins you WILL be saved. This sounds pretty black and white. But is it? What is *believe *or *belief? *

#1 Does the term imply that you are certain beyond any reasonable doubt?

#2 Or does the term mean you subscribe to the possibily to the extent where you are more certain then not?

#3 Or does it simply mean you subscribe to the possibility?

If the answer is not #1 then are we not all agnostics? Doesn’t #2
and #3 imply a certain degree of doubt? Is #1 the only acceptable answer if one is to state he believes in God? Are #2 and #3 acceptable to God in a non-offensive way? My intellect tells me (and that statement alone implies much fallability ) that to hold to #1 shows a lack of integrity. I also find it to be a prideful position. The atheist has some good arguments. I just hope we believe (ahhem) that we have better arguments.

I need to know the answer to this most fundemental question to answer the fundementall question of whether I believe in God. Therefore you can see the importance of this to me.

Thanks much,
–Mike

 

[Anonymous_1]

interesting question.

We are all on a faith journey. Hopefully, it will be progressive. We are hopefully moving from disbelief to belief, and from belief to a greater belief. From fear to faith to trust…
So yes I believe there are varying levels of belief.

You can believe something, and it be unquestionably true. I think what you are questioning are matters of faith. While faith is a type of belief, belief is not always faith.

There are countless rationaly palatable arguments that show that Gods exitence is not only reasonable, but also probable and likley. However, there are plenty of objections. And they may very well be good logical objections. But no logical argument or objection from an atheist can stand against experience. That is why it is so important to have a personal relationship with God. If you have experienced His Love and Mercy and Goodness and Faithfulness, how can anyone persuade you otherwise?

Furthermore, while I concede that there are probally plenty of palatable objections to the existence of God, I do not adhere to them not soley on intellectual or rational grounds but on that which i can not prove.

in the words of Saint Paul

The mssage of the cross is foolishness to those who are perishing, but to us who are being saved it is the power of God. For it is written:
“I will destroy the wisdom of the wise,
and the learning of the learned I will set aside.”

Where is the wise one? Where is the scribe? Where is the debater of this age? Has not God made the wisdom of the world foolish? For since in the wisdom of God the world did not come to know God through wisdom, it was the will of God through the follishness of the proclamation to save thsoe who have faith.

It is harsh but true. For all those who are sincerley seeking truth, even through reason, I believe they will find it. I think some of them have other issues that need to be resolved first though. And im not hating, I hope i do not seem uncharitable, I love them and pray for them and pray and hope they come to faith.

Hope this is what you were looking for.

 

[1ke]

The catechism responds to this very question of what it means “to believe”:

26 We begin our profession of faith by saying: “I believe” or “We believe”. Before expounding the Church’s faith, as confessed in the Creed, celebrated in the liturgy and lived in observance of God’s commandments and in prayer, we must first ask what “to believe” means. Faith is man’s response to God, who reveals himself and gives himself to man, at the same time bringing man a superabundant light as he searches for the ultimate meaning of his life. Thus we shall consider first that search (Chapter One), then the divine Revelation by which God comes to meet man (Chapter Two), and finally the response of faith (Chapter Three).

christusrex.org/www1/CDHN/profess.html#PROFESSION

and

christusrex.org/www1/CDHN/part1.html

 

[dcdurel]

Evangelicals get their religion from Luther and Calvin, not the Bible. Jesus requires that not only do we believe that He is God but that we believe EVERYTHING He teaches through His Church AND that we must obey Him.

The idea that all we have to do is believe that Jesus died for our sins is the the rationalistic, un biblical, idea of men who don’t want to face the fact that they will end up in hell for giving into sin and not repenting.

 

[Anonymous_1]

1ke:

The catechism responds to this very question of what it means “to believe”:

26 We begin our profession of faith by saying: “I believe” or “We believe”. Before expounding the Church’s faith, as confessed in the Creed, celebrated in the liturgy and lived in observance of God’s commandments and in prayer, we must first ask what “to believe” means. Faith is man’s response to God, who reveals himself and gives himself to man, at the same time bringing man a superabundant light as he searches for the ultimate meaning of his life. Thus we shall consider first that search (Chapter One), then the divine Revelation by which God comes to meet man (Chapter Two), and finally the response of faith (Chapter Three).

christusrex.org/www1/CDHN/profess.html#PROFESSION

and

christusrex.org/www1/CDHN/part1.html

^better answer than mine^

 

[hurst]

Mijoy2:

What is *believe *or *belief? *

There are certainly “levels” of belief, but we must seek for a perfect belief, in which we rely totally on God.

Scripture has some things to say on the matter:

Mark 9:23 And immediately the father of the boy crying out, with tears said: I do believe, Lord: help my unbelief.

The above shows that there is a progress to be made in believing.

Yet, one must not waver if he expects to be heard:

Mark 11:23 Amen I say to you, that whosoever shall say to this mountain, Be thou removed and be cast into the sea, and shall not stagger in his heart, but believe, that whatsoever he saith shall be done; it shall be done unto him.

Luke 8:13 Now they upon the rock, are they who when they hear, receive the word with joy: and these have no roots; for they believe for a while, and in time of temptation, they fall away.

James 1:5 But if any of you want wisdom, let him ask of God, who giveth to all men abundantly, and upbraideth not; and it shall be given him. 6 But let him ask in faith, nothing wavering. For he that wavereth is like a wave of the sea, which is moved and carried about by the wind. 7 Therefore let not that man think that he shall receive any thing of the Lord.

So the term itself doesn’t necessarily imply 100% certainty. But the kind of belief and faith we are called to have is one of constancy. Since to believe is to give, then we are in control of how much and how strong we give what we have. Yet, we should ask for help to grow and strengthen in faith.

Mijoy2:

I need to know the answer to this most fundemental question to answer the fundementall question of whether I believe in God.

To know God exists as the Creator does not require faith. One can be quite certain of this. If you are not certain there is a God, then you should spend some time thinking and reading about it, because the Church teaches that it can be known with certainty by the natural light of reason (Ott, p. 13). But if one cannot think their way to this certainty, they can still choose to believe there is a God anyway.

Once we realize there is certainly a God, then we decide whether to put our trust in Him, and serve Him with all He has given us. Isn’t it the fair thing to do, give Him pleasure in what He has created? To do as He wishes, in preference to our own?

In doing this, we will realize the truth that God is already giving Himself to us, and we are able to believe the Gospel that He sent His Son (His Word) into the world for us.

You see, in giving up our self-serving joy to serve God, we lose our joy for a time until we are proven, after which we share in God’s Joy. It is a Joy not our own, and is more a part of us the more we give up our own joy.

hurst