To Protestants

[Flying_Bison]

With a sincere and contrite heart I ask all protestants to seriously remain open to the Catholic faith.

All too often when discussing the faith, Protestants outright reject the Catholic position without seriously considering it.

But what is the Catholic Position? The Catholic position is that all Christians are to be of one body and one church that Jesus founded. Jesus’ Church is given the teaching authority through the ages. This Church was founded by Jesus and continued by the Apostles and lead by the Holy Spirit. Jesus breathed on the Apostles and said that he would be with them until the end of the Age. The bible clearly shows that the early Christians had a developed heirarchy with Presbyters, Bishops, and Deacons to protect and support the faith. The council of Jerusalem shows that the heirarchy had authority in order to protect the faith that Jesus had entrusted to his apostles.

It seems that all to often Protestantism is based on relativism. One is ones own teaching authority. Each one is the sole interpreter of Scripture and what Jesus wants. Often the Rhetoric is said that “I follow Jesus,” but in actuallity one is following one’s interpretation of what the Bible says. Jesus entrusted teacing to his Church, which was clearly visible to the first Christians. History and scripture shows how all Christians were part of the visible Church. All others were heretics, which comes from a word meaning self-thought. The last few centuries are a testament to the Catholic Position. Protestantism is fractured and continually changing. The Catholic Church has stayed true to its doctorines for 2000 years.

Most Protestants are good people, trying to be good Christians, but I ask them to attempt to investigate the Catholic faith and whole-heartedly attempt to make Christ’s Church one again.

God Bless

 

[ALLFORHIM]

It seems that all to often Protestantism is based on relativism. One is ones own teaching authority. Each one is the sole interpreter of Scripture and what Jesus wants. Often the Rhetoric is said that “I follow Jesus,” but in actuallity one is following one’s interpretation of what the Bible says. Jesus entrusted teacing to his Church, which was clearly visible to the first Christians. History and scripture shows how all Christians were part of the visible Church. All others were heretics, which comes from a word meaning self-thought. The last few centuries are a testament to the Catholic Position. Protestantism is fractured and continually changing. The Catholic Church has stayed true to its doctorines for 2000 years.

Hi,

Just some friendly advice from a non-catholic christian. The rest of your post was fine but I think, in the future it will be better received without the comment I quoted. With the above quote I believe you may turn people off.

Just my :twocents:

 

[Flying_Bison]

“the time is coming when people will not endure sound teaching, but having itching ears will accumulate for themselves teachers to suit their ouwn liknings.” (2 Tim 4:3)

“The one who descended is also the one who ascended far above all the heavens, that he might fill all things. And he gave some as apostles, others as prophets, others as evangelists, others as pastors and teachers, to equip the holy ones for the work of ministry, for building up the body of Christ, until we all attain to the unity of faith and knowledge of the Son of God, to mature manhood to the extent of the full stature of Christ,
so that we may no longer be infants, tossed by waves and swept along by every wind of teaching” (Eph 4; 11-14)

Paul calls the Church the “Pillar and Foundation of truth” (1 Tim 3:15)

"Moreover, we (Apostles) possess the prophetic message that is altogether reliable. You will do well to be attentive to it, as to a lamp shining in a dark place, until day dawns and the morning star rises in your hearts. Know this first of all, that there is no prophecy of scripture that is a matter of personal interpretation, for no prophecy ever came through human will; but rather human beings moved by the holy Spirit spoke under the influence of God. There were also false prophets among the people, just as there will be false teachers among you, who will introduce destructive heresies and even deny the Master who ransomed them, bringing swift destruction on themselves. Many will follow their licentious ways, and because of them the way of truth will be reviled. "(2 Pet 1:19-2:2)

I ask that those outside of the Catholic “universal” Church reflect on these words.

Here is an excellent essay on the Catholic Position of Authority.

[

God Bless
Ryan](Sola Scriptura and Private Judgment)

 

[Flying_Bison]

Hi,

Just some friendly advice from a non-catholic christian. The rest of your post was fine but I think, in the future it will be better received without the comment I quoted. With the above quote I believe you may turn people off.

Just my :twocents:

I apologize. I did not mean to be combative. If I may ask where did I go wrong. I do not claim to be an expert on all forms of Protestantism.

 

[ALLFORHIM]

I apologize. I did not mean to be combative. If I may ask where did I go wrong. I do not claim to be an expert on all forms of Protestantism.

It is just things we have all heard before that’s all. If you want us to keep our minds open just teach about your faith without telling us what is wrong with ours. I know that is difficult–as it is with me as well.

I prefer to write about the truth as I see it without putting the CC down and let people decide for themselves. That is all we can do.

When you start telling a person why their beliefs are not right–they automatically get defensive and turn off.

Just write why you think the CC is right and when someone comes at you(which Im sure they will )just know when to walk away. That is what I do. You cant force someone to have an open mind.

Just keep it positive and stick to what the CC believes

P.S. No need to apologize I was not offended. I feel you are sincere and just wanted to save you some grief.

 

[Curious]

To Flying Bison,

The whole process of changing major religions (Christianity, Islam, Judaism, Hindu, etc) - it usually boggles my mind to hear of converts from any one to any other because what we’re raised with can be so firmly ingrained in us. Now switching around among the different sects of Christianity is probably not as huge a life change, but even so, to many Protestants, especially Southern-fried fundamentalists like me, Catholicism can seem extremely foreign, daunting, and even repugnant.

My process of study has taken a long time. I was practically on the verge of RCIA until my life got so busy I had barely the time to say “hello” to God much less do serious religious study. I’ve had lots of misconceptions cleared up, questions answered, and my own beliefs have changed somewhat as a result of my studying.

Conversion takes time. Sometimes people seek and study with all their heart and still do not convert, for a variety of reasons. Know that there are probably more people on this forum like me, who read and flirt and scratch their heads, wrestle with scripture, apologetics, and the incredible strength of the beliefs that have been hammered into them for a long, long, time. All this swirling around in one’s brain can be tiring…and fun.

Know the attraction, the mystery, and the pull the Catholic Church has on some. And know that it will probably always repel others, until Jesus’ prayer is answered and we are all finally one.

In Christ,
Curious

 

[Daniel_Marsh]

Feel free to send me any of the following books free of charge, so that I may learn more about christian faith,

Word Study Greek-English New Testament by Paul McReynolds

Theological Dictionary of the Old Testament, Volummes 1-15 set Edited By: G. Johannes Botterweck, Helmer Ringgren, Heinz-Josef Fabry

Theological Lexicon Set of the New Testament Edited By: Ceslas Spicq

Analytical Key to the Old Testament on CD-ROM or 4 volume set By: John Joseph Owens

Theological Lexicon of the Old Testament Biddle, Mark E.; Jenni, Ernst

14 Volume Set of the Soncino Bible

The Complete Parallel Bible with the Apocryphal / Deuterocanonical Books

Ancient Traditions of the Virgin Mary’s Dormition and Assumption by Shoemaker, Stephen

The Lord’s Anointed: Interpretation of Old Testament Messianic Textsedited by R.S. Hess, G.J. Wenham, P.E. Satterhwaite eds

New Interpreter’s Study Bible Hardcover New Revised Standard Version with Apocrypha

 

[Flying_Bison]

Really don’t know how to answer the last post. I am not a library or an organization for evagelization. I am simply Catholic who has seen the historical and theological truth in the Catholuic Church.
I just want people to look at the Catholic faith honestly and without hard hearts.
I also pray for Christian unity.

So, about the books. I am not really the guy to ask.

 

[JoeyWarren]

I just want people to look at the Catholic faith honestly and without hard hearts.

That is a tall order.

I also pray for Christian unity.

I wonder if that is even possible. After debating non-catholics at other forums, I see unity to be a prayer request to St Jude…Patron Saint of Lost Causes. Their are too many Viral and Feral Anti-catholics abroad making attempts to discredit us as Christiains. But that makes the fight that much more challenging.

 

[AMDG1]

My own observation to the original post: both sides are guilty. I’ve seen plenty of zealous Catholic posts bashing protestant beliefs and vice versa. I don’t think either side is without fault.

For anyone who is passionate about their beliefs - that’s great, but we all need to remember that the true christian way is to be respectful of each other and stick to explaining or debating our beliefs dispassionately and in the spirit of dialogue and understanding.

Pax

 

[O.S.Luke]

My own observation to the original post: both sides are guilty. I’ve seen plenty of zealous Catholic posts bashing protestant beliefs and vice versa. I don’t think either side is without fault.

For anyone who is passionate about their beliefs - that’s great, but we all need to remember that the true christian way is to be respectful of each other and stick to explaining or debating our beliefs dispassionately and in the spirit of dialogue and understanding.

Pax

Well said.

 

[LutheranDK]

With a sincere and contrite heart I ask all protestants to seriously remain open to the Catholic faith.

All too often when discussing the faith, Protestants outright reject the Catholic position without seriously considering it.

But what is the Catholic Position? The Catholic position is that all Christians are to be of one body and one church that Jesus founded. Jesus’ Church is given the teaching authority through the ages. This Church was founded by Jesus and continued by the Apostles and lead by the Holy Spirit. Jesus breathed on the Apostles and said that he would be with them until the end of the Age. The bible clearly shows that the early Christians had a developed heirarchy with Presbyters, Bishops, and Deacons to protect and support the faith. The council of Jerusalem shows that the heirarchy had authority in order to protect the faith that Jesus had entrusted to his apostles.

It seems that all to often Protestantism is based on relativism. One is ones own teaching authority. Each one is the sole interpreter of Scripture and what Jesus wants. Often the Rhetoric is said that “I follow Jesus,” but in actuallity one is following one’s interpretation of what the Bible says. Jesus entrusted teacing to his Church, which was clearly visible to the first Christians. History and scripture shows how all Christians were part of the visible Church. All others were heretics, which comes from a word meaning self-thought. The last few centuries are a testament to the Catholic Position. Protestantism is fractured and continually changing. The Catholic Church has stayed true to its doctorines for 2000 years.

Most Protestants are good people, trying to be good Christians, but I ask them to attempt to investigate the Catholic faith and whole-heartedly attempt to make Christ’s Church one again.

God Bless

I actually did what you request. I had a crisis, when I got a Catholic friend who I often discussed with.
And it only strengthened me in my belief that the Lutheran reformation was painfully neccessary.

As for the “protestantism is relativism”-argument; I say that it is at least partially untrue. Take the Lutheran church, for instance. There is not a single trace of “I’ll design my own faith”. The Lutheran confessions are very specific about doctrine, and leaves no room for you or I to design our own variety.

The basis of your arguments seem to be the Catholic church’s teaching about itself. I say that such a line of reasoning is invalid. Think about it: Would you convert to Lutheranism, simply because I told you that Martin Luther was right?
No, you would, rightfully, want some proof, reasoning that was’t circular. As do I

Finally: It pains me that Christ’s church (and now I speak of the Church of ALL believers, regardless of denomination) is not one.
I think I know a bit of what Luther must have felt when the true meaning of the Reformation hit him: I cannot convert (back, in Luther’s case) to the Catholic church, no matter how much I might want to, because its teachings is not scriptural, but quite the contrary.

“Here I stand. I cannot do otherwise. God help me, Amen”

 

[Roman_Catholic_1]

I cannot convert (back, in Luther’s case) to the Catholic church, no matter how much I might want to, because its teachings is not scriptural, but quite the contrary.

You need to back up statements such as this. This is not the thread to do so, but please find one which discusses where you think the Catholic Church’s teachings are not scriptural.

On a side note with Lutheran teaching on the Real Presence and Baptism, I can’t help but hear in my mind a Fundamentalist Christian, when asked to convert to the Lutheran Church stating;

“I cannot convert to the Luther Church, no matter how much I want to, because its teachings is not scriptural, but quite the contrary.”

God bless

 

[Randy_Carson]

I think I know a bit of what Luther must have felt when the true meaning of the Reformation hit him: I cannot convert (back, in Luther’s case) to the Catholic church, no matter how much I might want to, because its teachings is not scriptural, but quite the contrary.

This assertion comes as a bit of a surprise to those of us who were Protestant and converted to the Catholic Church precisely because its teachings are scriptural.

Perhaps you would be so kind as to pick an example or two of the Church’s teaching which you feel are contradictory to scripture and post them in separate threads so that we can analyze them in some detail together with you.

Thanks in advance. :tiphat:

 

[Kitty_Chan]

I still think that most of the differences are preception and we are closer than we all know. Hopefully and this has been said by another that it wont take a persecution for us to get on one side of the street.

But there are differences in all the religions, (snow flakes all) even catholic has what is it the orthodox? Babylon had one language and God did away with it. satan when reforming his religions made many, so he wouldnt be toppled so easily. I sometimes wonder if its because he like to compete with God.

Because even though protestants are apparentely protesting, they still at the core believe the same thing as the catholics. SDA is quite clear about that as a note. Sunday worshippers we all are it was a interesting observation at least.

Hope Im not stomping on toes just the way I see it, one may not be as we see it, but how God reads our hearts.

 

[kedera]

And all the Flying Bison wanted was to ask for people to keep an open heart! I’m Southern-Fried, and Baptist too! It is very easy to be defensive over our beliefs, and rightfully we should. What use is flimsey conviction right !? I am considering converting to Catholicism for a number of reasons, mostly because I have prayed…a lot, for guidance. I have been able, through God’s grace, to keep an opened heart and mind on many issues, and it has thus far been a truly incredible experiance.
Anyhow, Bison, just to respond to your request, as a Southern Baptist born, 20 something girl…I’ll continue to seek God’s will for my life, wherever that may lead (and it’s looking like the RCC). Also, I have recently taken up a habit to challenge my Protestant friends, on the “Why do we belive THIS way?” issue, and I find that most of them don’t know…and they want to know.

 

[StacieAdy]

It is just things we have all heard before that’s all. If you want us to keep our minds open just teach about your faith without telling us what is wrong with ours. I know that is difficult–as it is with me as well.

Yes, exactly. I have no problem keeping an open mind or heart towards Catholicism. But when a Catholic starts to attack my beliefs, it immediately turns me away from ever wanting to be a Catholic. I have no problem at all, hearing about Catholic beliefs and why those beliefs are there. But don’t start telling us Protestants how “lost” we are. (I’ve seen Protestants attacking Catholics too, so I’m not trying to be one-sided here.)

 

[brosam]

All too often when discussing the faith, Protestants outright reject the Catholic position without seriously considering it.

Honestly? I don’t seriously consider it because there are just too many Unbiblical teachings.

It seems that all to often Protestantism is based on relativism. One is ones own teaching authority.
Each one is the sole interpreter of Scripture and what Jesus wants. Often the Rhetoric is said that “I follow Jesus,” but in actuallity one is following one’s interpretation of what the Bible says.

All of a sudden, the chorus of Simon and Garfunkle’s “The Boxer” comes to mind.

Most Protestants are good people, trying to be good Christians, but I ask them to attempt to investigate the Catholic faith and whole-heartedly attempt to make Christ’s Church one again.

And are you equally open minded about Biblical Christianity? Or is your call to “openmindedness” only one way?