Today's gospel promoting communism?

  • Thread starter Thread starter Polak
  • Start date Start date
Status
Not open for further replies.
P

Polak

Guest
Today’s gospel talked about workers who worked less hours because they started later, being paid the same (one denarius) as those who started earlier and worked more. Those who started later and did less hours were also paid first, and only after them were those who started earlier given their wage.

While of course the intention of the passage isn’t likely to be promoting any sort of communism as we know it, I do feel this passage could easily be used by communists to support the idea of paying people the same, no matter how much work they do or what work they do.
 
Polak said:
I do feel this passage could easily be used by communists to support the idea of paying people the same, no matter how much work they do or what work they do.
Click to expand...
We can’t control whether people deliberately misinterpret something. I don’t see what could be done about it, anyway.
 
I don’t see today’s gospel being used to promote communism at all - if anything it has capitalistic themes.

The employee and employer are free to negotiate whatever wages they want.
 
Put it this way, if I was one of those workers who did a long day of work and then found out somebody joined for the last hour and not only got paid the same as me, but was paid before me, I would feel a sense of deep injustice even if I got what was agreed and so did they.

Funnily enough this actually relates to a previous thread on how one can live a righteous life and goes to heaven, while another lives a very bad life, then repents at the end and also goes to heaven. That didn’t sit well with me either.

I suppose in both cases you could say, ‘why do you care about what happens to somebody else? Don’t look at what is happening with others and just concentrate on your own life (and relationship with God in the case of the example of going to heaven)’. Still, I can’t help but feel a sense of injustice being done.
 
SuperLawyer said:
The employee and employer are free to negotiate whatever wages they want.
Click to expand...
If an employer gave two people the same exact job and paid one more than the other, it would be considered extremely discriminatory and is something they are trying to stamp out, at least in most western countries.

But it would be the employer’s right to strike whatever deal they want with each employee, right? Still doesn’t seem right though.
 
Not really. If you agreed 15 dollars for a job and found out that a few weeks later your employer offered 20 dollars to somebody else for doing the very same job, would you not feel that was a bit unfair and at least wonder why this was the case?
 
Well the only way that could seem right is if they get more based on a length or service type of deal. Otherwise it doesn’t seem fair they are getting more than you if they really are doing the same job you do.
 
Last edited:
Well could but can’t be used by communists who don’t allow any dissent.
They preach that in their utopic world there will be no money or police. Because all citizens act appropriately or else.
Let me know how it has worked out in practice. All the people who were imposed this ideology impoverished themselves to the point of selling themselves to survive.
As the other poster noted it is not about communism but rather we ought to abide by our word in all we do. If we agreed on a wage we should not be dissatisfied if the master wants to give more to whomever he pleases. And in this case Jesus is talking about HIS Father. HE can give more to whomever HE wants and we have no business arguing with HIM. Since in practice we don’t deserve anything from HIM.

Peace!
 
I don’t suppose you can elaborate more as to why somebody doing the same job as you gets paid more? Did they have more experience in a similar previous role that allowed them to negotiate a higher wage? i would imagine workers being paid different amounts for doing the same job could cause dissent after a while.
 
It might be they decided to offer people different (more improved) contracts for the role you do at some point. Companies do that sometimes, but usually when they do, they make a point of raising the contracts of the previous employees (at least over time) to eventually even it up. Sometimes they don’t though, and you could get two people doing the same job for different wages, that personally I don’t think is right, but if you’re okay with it, then I don’t suppose your employer needs to consider offering you anything more.
 
Polak said:
Put it this way, if I was one of those workers who did a long day of work and then found out somebody joined for the last hour and not only got paid the same as me, but was paid before me, I would feel a sense of deep injustice even if I got what was agreed and so did they.
Click to expand...
I get what you’re saying. This is a very shocking story.

Butt I also find it comforting the idea that God keep searching us out, even until the last moment 🙂
 
Oh sure, and I’m sure that’s one of the main points of the story.

There are many stories in the Bible where you can see why a person might be aggrieved. I often see myself in the shoes of the aggrieved and understand how they feel. In today’s gospel for example, or in the story of the prodigal son. I know the moral of the story is probably to imagine yourself in the position of those who started work later or in the shoes of the prodigal son, and be grateful that God still searches you out and gives you his love.
 
Part of Christianity has always been about living in a community and distributing money and property for there to be material equality. It doesn’t get brought up very much for obvious reasons. It was sort of taken seriously at first in the young churches but once more and more aristocrats in the Empire started being baptized those teachings in the NT epistles were diminished and they have been ever since for the past 1800 years or so, but I’m guessing at some point in the future that will be revisited in a more serious way.

Christianity isn’t anything close to communism because communism reduces people to forms of production and pulls the sacred out of life and Christianity does the opposite of that.
 
Last edited:
Polak said:
Still, I can’t help but feel a sense of injustice being done.
Click to expand...
That’s worldly justice, but the landowner in this parable sees another, higher justice. He does not want someone who is unable to find work to go hungry. The parable makes it clear that the late-day workers could not find work. The landowner intended that all who were willing to work should receive enough to put food on the table.

Today’s first reading speaks of the difference between the world’s ways and God’s ways.
For my thoughts are not your thoughts,
nor are your ways my ways, says the LORD.
As high as the heavens are above the earth,
so high are my ways above your ways
and my thoughts above your thoughts.
Click to expand...
 
The parable literally spells out why there is no injustice being done. But what is done is a charitable act. And outside of the parable that act goes from being charitable to merciful. The parable is about mercy and hope. That’s part of the “Good News”.
 
Last edited:
@(name removed by moderator)

I think it’s one of those parts of scripture people read and think “Wait, wow, they don’t really mean that do they?” except the Desert Fathers were like “Yeah, they really mean that.” mic drop

Religious orders and such since ancient times have observed a pretty egalitarian lifestyle within their communities but in theory it isn’t meant exclusively for religious. There have been different attempts with laity communities as well, which perhaps will eventually become more common. Dorothy Day and Peter Maurin did something like this with laity communities right here in the US.
 
Last edited:
  • Like
Reactions: Nik
Jesus’ use of parables was exceptionally effective. This particular one was probably his least effective because the messages it sends are beyond that he intended - i.e. that each will be welcomed into the kingdom no matter the timing. I imagine Jesus was not commenting on issues of remuneration and the distinction between hourly rates and piece rates.

And no, it says nothing about ‘communism’. One of the famous maxims of another great, but prolix, communicator, Marx, was: ‘from each according to their ability, to each according to their needs’.

The implication is that if you don’t give to the extend of your ability, not all your needs will be met.

It’s basically the opposite of the parable by Jesus.
 
TK421 said:
Part of Christianity has always been about living in a community and distributing money and property for there to be material equality. It doesn’t get brought up very much for obvious reasons. It was sort of taken seriously at first in the young churches but once more and more aristocrats in the Empire started being baptized those teachings in the NT epistles were diminished and they have been ever since for the past 1800 years or so
Click to expand...
Another example might be usury, also something the Catholic Church was very much against, but these days, since it happens so much in everyday life, they don’t speak out against it anymore.
 
SuperLawyer said:
The employee and employer are free to negotiate whatever wages they want.
Click to expand...
Not quite. Under Catholic social teaching, it is a very grave sin to mistreat or underpay employees…paying just, fair wage is the obligation of every Catholic business owner…regardless of how little the employee is “willing” to work for.
 
Status
Not open for further replies.
Back
Top