Tradition is Dead

[Teflon93]

Teflon93;2452866:

Why do you say that?

Because the church of the Early Church Fathers is the Catholic Church.

Is this a good time to plug Alex Jones’ great book, “No Price Too High: A Pentecostal Preacher Becomes Catholic”?

Now-DEACON Jones engaged in a six-month study of the Early Church Fathers with his Detroit congregation. The result? 54 Catholic converts.

It is very difficult for non-Catholics to survive knowledge of history. My wife and I didn’t.

 

[guanophore]

guanophore;2452913:

Because the church of the Early Church Fathers is the Catholic Church.

Is this a good time to plug Alex Jones’ great book, “No Price Too High: A Pentecostal Preacher Becomes Catholic”?

Now-DEACON Jones engaged in a six-month study of the Early Church Fathers with his Detroit congregation. The result? 54 Catholic converts.

It is very difficult for non-Catholics to survive knowledge of history. My wife and I didn’t.

Why would anyone want to persist without knowledge?

 

[Bishopite]

tabcom;2452669:

Here’s the problem with debating with us Catholics:

The word “baptize” means what the Church tells us it means.

It’s not our own personal research (or yours!) of ancient Greek that defines the word for us, it is the Church’s Traditions that defines the word for us.

You see that’s really nuts. If you really believe God is in control of truth, if you really believe that the Holy Spirit would guide His church throughout the ages in John 14 and 16, if you really believe Jesus said the gates of hell would NOT prevail against “the church” meaning His Church (Mt 16:15-19), then you would have to be honest enough to recognize that NOWHERE in the early church and NOWHERE anywhere until well after the reformation, did anyone omit baptism. Virtually all Protestants baptize in water and the Trinity and whether you think the word was somehow manipulated by the boogyman Catholic church is something you have to create in order to follow the non-Tradition of Christian teaching. The Quakers, Omish, Shakers, Salvation Army et al churches who omit baptism did so post reformation when Tradition was gradually peeled away and the truth was torn apart under the banner of sola scriptura.

 

[Bishopite]

tabcom;2452669:

Here’s the problem with debating with us Catholics:

The word “baptize” means what the Church tells us it means.

It’s not our own personal research (or yours!) of ancient Greek that defines the word for us, it is the Church’s Traditions that defines the word for us.

Exactly! If we drop what has always been practiced (baptism via water) then we create our own version of truth. Jesus said we must be born of “water” and the Spirit. Water has always been the correct matter by which one is baptized into the covenant family of God.

 

[Bishopite]

Originally Posted by tabcom
The original greek word for ‘legal claims’ is the word dogma.

My question is, since the dogma, or rituals have been done away with, would Paul preach water baptism, going to confession, taking communion, celebrating Christmas, and all the rest, if he were alive today?

Why do you keep saying “the dogma” instead of just “dogma?” Dogma is plural not singular.

 

[lak611]

My question to tabcom is this: What did Paul baptise with, if not water? Paul did indeed baptise. From the NASB:

1Co 1:16 Now I did baptize also the household of Stephanas; beyond that, I do not know whether I baptized any other.

Also, why would Paul baptise anyone if he did not believe that baptism was necessary?