Traditional Latin Mass vs NO

[Saxum]

Or perhaps, certain posters, rather than acting like a petulant child whose eating all the cookies as soon as mother leaves him

I’m not the one complaining about anything - least of all about an abbreviation that has been used since 1970 and is acceptable to everybody. The problem ‘certain posters’ have is that they want to be the language police and dictate what is acceptable and what is not.

 

[Xanthippe_Voorhees]

Xanthippe_Voorhees:

Or perhaps, certain posters, rather than acting like a petulant child whose eating all the cookies as soon as mother leaves him

I’m not the one complaining about anything - least of all about an abbreviation that has been used since 1970 and is acceptable to everybody. The problem ‘certain posters’ have is that they want to be the language police and dictate what is acceptable and what is not.

Or, we can recognize that it’s more than once (quite frequently, actually) been used as a term ment to offend and divide. It is given insidious connotations. That’s not language police, that’s the history of this very board.

 

[Saxum]

That’s not language police, that’s the history of this very board.

I wasn’t aware of this. I’m friendly with many priests from several dioceses and orders and the all use the abbreviation ‘NO.’ It’s standard terminology along with the inaccurate name ‘Tridentine Mass.’

 

[pnewton]

It is classic propaganda. You may be okay with it. However, it still literal says the Novus Ordo is no Mass. If you want to be a propagandist, then use it. If you want to be lazy, there is still OF. Finally, it can always be typed out.

Back when I was younger and cigarettes were advertised, Winston use the slogan, “Winston tastes good like a cigarette should.” This was grammatically incorrect, but their research showed that using the word “like” made the product more desirable.

To the OP, I am glad that this option was available for you. I know we all have different personalities that affect how we are most comfortable in our worship. Too often people just have to adapt and deal with something that is not really a good fit for them spiritually. We should allow God to use this to teach us when this happens. But it is nice when we find a really good fit.

 

[Saxum]

It is classic propaganda. You may be okay with it. However, it still literal says the Novus Ordo is no Mass.

This is not correct; this is your interpretation of an abbreviation. EVERY Catholic knows that the Novus Ordo is a Mass - a true, and licit Mass. I attend it 6 days per week. Don’t read something that isn’t there.

 

[pnewton]

This is not correct; this is your interpretation of an abbreviation.

I did not “interpret” the abbreviation. I am only pointing out that it is also the word “no”, and adjective that negates the noun. Now my opinion could be denied, that we have a subconscious mind that can be influenced indirectly. This may not be an opinion you hold. But English is what it is.

There is a reason why proper English uses periods as a punctuation for abbreviations. I know that is a strange concept on the internet, but that is also part of the reason why intellectual discussion on the internet is so hard to come by.

 

[ProVobis]

In Latin too. For example, Q.E.D. etc. e.g. i.e. Maybe N.O. or N.O.M. is not a bad idea.

 

[R_H_Benson]

I did not “interpret” the abbreviation. I am only pointing out that it is also the word “no”, and adjective that negates the noun. Now my opinion could be denied, that we have a subconscious mind that can be influenced indirectly. This may not be an opinion you hold. But English is what it is.

There is a reason why proper English uses periods as a punctuation for abbreviations. I know that is a strange concept on the internet, but that is also part of the reason why intellectual discussion on the internet is so hard to come by.

is this for real?

 

[pianistclare]

Isn’t it still against forum rules to pit one form over another?

This is a tiresome topic. And it’s against forum rules.

 

[pnewton]

You are welcome to check on the science yourself if you don’t believe me.

 

[NiceIsAsNiceDoes]

Different strokes for different folks. I am very glad what you found is working for you, but please don’t put down those who feel NO is where they are most able to have their spiritual needs met. I am sure Jesus cracked jokes and spoke about pop culture issues of his day. It isnt a right or wrong issue. It is just different, and so good that the Catholic Church recognizes that one size doesn’t fit all with respect to this issue.

 

[R_H_Benson]

I am sure Jesus cracked jokes and spoke about pop culture issues of his day.

Not as He offered Himself on the Cross.

 

[EricF]

Some years ago I read a church history book that said it was Constantine who instituted Latin as the official language of the church because Rome spoke Latin. In other words, the “vernacular” of the time. Up until then Mass was said in Greek. That was years ago that I read it. I will have to look it up again to see if there is any official imprimatur statements for that book. Edit: “History of the Catholic Church - From the Apostolic Age to the third Millenium” by James Hitchcock. I could not find any sort of imprimatur attached to this work, so I don’t know about the veracity.

 

[NiceIsAsNiceDoes]

I doubt any priests are doing that during the consecration. During the homily, sure.

 

[R_H_Benson]

Neither did Our Lord crack any jokes or speak about pop culture issues of His day 10-15 minutes before He offered Himself on the Cross.

(The homily can be an exception)

 

[NiceIsAsNiceDoes]

Neither did Our Lord crack any jokes or speak about pop culture issues of His day 10-15 minutes before He offered Himself on the Cross.

(The homily can be an exception)

I thought we were supposed to celebrate mass (?) . I guess “celebrate” doesn’t mean the same thing to everyone. I don’t think an entertaining homily detracts in any way from the solemnity of the consecration.

 

[felsguy]

I am not very cool with priests making jokes, mentioning sports games, etc., when it comes to the Mass

I can respect that you have a preference for the TLM. However I have a bit of news for you. Back in the day (1940s and 1950s) during many a “sermon” as they were call then, one could hear a joke or a reference to some sports event. Your correlation of the somberness of today’s homilies to the form of the Mass strikes me as a false one.

 

[Duesenberg]

No its not. Before the full reform of the liturgy, Rome referred to the changes as the Novus Ordo. It’s a historical term that is still acceptable to use.

No. That’s not accurate. The Holy See termed (but never officially named) the OF Mass the “novus ordo” decades ago, back when it actually was a new Mass. Just as 1968 Fords were once “new Fords!” The use of “NO”/“novus ordo” is simply wrong in this day and age, particuarly after Pope Benedict XVI specifically asked us to use the OF and EF Mass monikers, realizing how pejorative the NO/novus ordo labels are.

Anyone using “NO” or “novus ordo” these days is in my experience, someone making a very subtle statement to denigrate the OF Mass. If they didn’t have this need/desire, I suspect they would simply follow Pope Benedict XVI’s request. Instead they choose to be rude. That’s my take at least.

I suppose I could start using “AFCVM” (Ancient First Century Vernacular Mass) instead of OF Mass and “ML16CML” (Much Later 16th Century Mass in Latin) instead of EF Mass. Not only would it be more accurate than the NO/“novus ordo” label, it certainly wouldn’t be any more offensive.

 

[Duesenberg]

I can respect that you have a preference for the TLM. However I have a bit of news for you. Back in the day (1940s and 1950s) during many a “sermon” as they were call then, one could hear a joke or a reference to some sports event. Your correlation of the somberness of today’s homilies to the form of the Mass strikes me as a false one.

Low Masses were also burned through in 10-20 minutes even on Sundays to get people in and out while MANY focused on praying the Rosary DURING the Mass. Talk about BAD FORM!

 

[Duesenberg]

This is not correct; this is your interpretation of an abbreviation. EVERY Catholic knows that the Novus Ordo is a Mass - a true, and licit Mass. I attend it 6 days per week. Don’t read something that isn’t there.

Not by a long shot. That’s a confusing/pejorative label.