Traditional Priests for Mass

[twf]

I would like to ask Fr. Ruggero, why he “would never do” (the vetus ordo)? Just curious.
It’s the only Mass I will attend., so I’m curious as to why he feels so strongly?

God Bless

Father has explained before on these forums that he did celebrate the EF Mass under the indult for some time when asked to do so by his superiors. He did so out of obedience but is fully committed to the liturgical reforms of the 20th century and prefers to celebrate the OF.

As it is happens, my personal preference is a solemn, chanted Novus Ordo Mass…but I do appreciate and respect the Extraordinary Form and will take it in from time to time.

 

[Don_Ruggero]

Thank you Father. This bothers me as well. The Novus Ordo IS the Latin Mass; that is, the Mass of the Latin Church. You’ll hear some Latin every Sunday at our cathedral, yet the Extraordinary Form is not offered. There was at least one local parish that offered English NO Masses, Latin NO Masses, and Mass in the EF. I’m not sure if that is still the case.

You are correct, of course.

The problem is that the terminology leaves ambiguity precisely since Mass in Latin can be celebrated according to the Vetus Ordo as well as the Novus Ordo. I don’t find “Latin Mass” to be a very useful descriptor. The same is true at the other end of the spectrum with expressions such as “Mass of the Ages”…which is a term that would apply to the Divine Liturgies of the Eastern Catholic Churches. That is why my students could not use such ambiguous expressions.

 

[Don_Ruggero]

I would like to ask Fr. Ruggero, why he “would never do” (the vetus ordo)? Just curious.
It’s the only Mass I will attend., so I’m curious as to why he feels so strongly?

God Bless

It is quite straightforward.

In my younger days, I was an ardent supporter of the liturgical movement.

I greatly cherished the Council – it, and what resulted from it, are at the very core of my priestly life and identity. I consider it to be one of the greatest events in the history of the Church and it inaugurated an exceptional dynamic manifestation of the Holy Spirit in the Church. It was formative to me personally in a way that has survived the passage of time.

By God’s gracious gift and the will of my bishop, I was tasked with study in the field of liturgy all those years ago and, ultimately, was a professor of liturgy and sacraments; I taught, as well as gave lectures on, Sacrosanctum Concilium and its aftermath and implementation. I was, also, a liturgist.

As TWF mentioned, I provided the Mass and other sacraments in the vetus ordo in the indult era because the bishop determined that I was the one he wanted to entrust the task to…until such time as he removed that pastoral responsibility, at which time I happily gave him back the indult and never held it again.

In sum, I agree with the Council Fathers that there was no aspect of the liturgy that was not in need of reform and renewal…and I completely embrace the resulting reform and renewal – and vastly prefer it.

Now that I am retired, I have not the remotest thought to again offer Mass in the vetus ordo, neither publicly nor privately. Being retired, I would exercise the prerogative to decline any such request.

That said, I have helped a few of the recently ordained priests with tutelage, especially with the rubrics, so they could celebrate it; they did quite well, actually, to have not grown up with it…but their interest waned once they actually experienced offering it.

There is such a tremendous richness in every way with the liturgy in these recent decades, especially working with different cultures as I have had occasion to do in various assignments, that I have absolutely no desire to turn back to the 1962 missal…the same is true for the old breviary. What we have today is so much an improvement in comparison to what we once had that I would not even think of going back.

I do however, on occasion, use one or another rites from the vetus ordo, especially related to the sacramentals.

 

[twf]

You are correct, of course.

The problem is that the terminology leaves ambiguity precisely since Mass in Latin can be celebrated according to the Vetus Ordo as well as the Novus Ordo. I don’t find “Latin Mass” to be a very useful descriptor. The same is true at the other end of the spectrum with expressions such as “Mass of the Ages”…which is a term that would apply to the Divine Liturgies of the Eastern Catholic Churches. That is why my students could not use such ambiguous expressions.

Father, you raise a great point in regards to the expression “Mass of the Ages”. I greatly appreciate the Byzantine Divine Liturgy in particular and am troubled when I hear certain Latin Catholics, even on this forum, refer to the Extraordinary Form Roman Rite as the “most perfect” or “most beautiful” liturgy this side of heaven. I appreciate the Roman Rite in both its forms and am most comfortable / familiar with the Novus Ordo…but in terms of external beauty, both pale, at least for me, when compared with a well celebrated Divine Liturgy of St. John Chrysostom. Yet, it feels alien to me and the Roman Rite remains my spiritual home…but the beauty blows me away every time.

 

[OraLabora]

As it is happens, my personal preference is a solemn, chanted Novus Ordo Mass…

Mine too and I consider myself extraordinarily privileged to be able to experience this twice a week (on Sundays at the abbey, and on Wednesdays when I work at the abbey library, and on solemnities like Friday; the Epiphany is celebrated on the 6th of January at the abbey, it is not transferred to the Sunday).

The Mass has the propers and ordinary chanted in Latin (+Greek Kyrie, and of course Greek Improperes on Good Friday), the rest is in French plainchant, including chanted readings, preface and EP.

Recently I also had the extraordinary experience of a private Mass in the abbot’s chapel presided by a monk who is an Anglican convert and a very good friend of my wife and I; the Mass was recited in the Ordinary Form in Latin. I had the privilege of saying the reading and the responsorial psalm in Latin (in which I am competent from being a chorister in a Gregorian choir). It was for me a profoundly moving experience as the Mass was offered for me as the return of a favour by the monk in question; I gave him a lift to Montreal and took him out to lunch as he was transferring for a time to a nuns’ abbey to be their chaplain.

As someone very attached to monastic simplicity, the OF Mass when done as the Benedictines do it, has at the same time great reverence, beauty, liturgical fidelity, and a noble simplicity which moves one to contemplation (they have very appropriate moments of silence after the readings, the homily and post-communion).

 

[corsair]

Fr. Ruggero,

Thank you for your explanation. I can respect your opinion, even though I disagree with you. I am not an admirer of the council nor of the current situation in Rome.

May God Bless you this New Year.