Traditionalists and Judaism

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St. James,
How odd since none of the ones I have ever known have done so. And no synagogue I have ever visited has done so. They disagree with us, but that is not hatred. Please answer my questions. Do you deny Vatican II, John Paul II, that the holocaust occured etc.?
 
Gratias Grace:
I think that we as THE Catholic Church shall respect what has been said by the pope (JPII) about jews as our elder brothers.

It is not a matter about who betrayed Jesus (the jew Judas) and who was it that wanted him crusified (some jews). Jesus himself has said: **"For if you forgive others their trespasses, your heavenly Father will also forgive you; 15but if you do not forgive others, neither will your Father forgive your trespasses” (Mat 6:14). **The same is in the prayer Our Father: ”---- And forgive us our debts, As we also have forgiven our debtors …”

Our job is not to hate, but to love and forgive.

If people want to disagree with zionism, that is something else. That has to do with not wanting a BIG-ISRAEL at the expense of the palestinians. Some People want that, but that is not in agreeement with the ”Roadmap for Peace” that USA, EU, UN and Russland all agree about. (I know this forum is not about the Middle-East).

What I want to say is that anti-zionism and anti-semetism is two differnt ”things”. Anti-zionism is to be against a BIG state named Israel. Anti-semetism is to be against jews generally (even if they are secular jews).

**It is not right for christians to hate. This the traditional catholics also have to understand. **

When it comes to other religions. The cathechism is clear about that . Every religion (even the nature-religions) have some longing for God (our God)! (CCC 839-848).

What is happening now, especially in Europe, and that can also be a reality in USA if nobody stops it, is that more and more people don’t feel ashamed when they use almost the same anti-jewish propaganda that was used against jews before WWII and the gaschambers.

IT IS NOT CATHOLIC TO BE A PART OF A MOVEMENT THAT WILL DESTROY JEWS ONLY BECAUSE THEY ARE JEWS!

G.Grace
Destroy Judaism[and Islam,Protestantism,Hinduism,et cetera] but not Jews[ethnic Jews].

Yes, other religions have a longing for the True God, but does that mean they are n the CHurch???
 
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cestusdei:
St. James,
Please answer my questions. Do you deny Vatican II, John Paul II, that the holocaust occured etc.?
I have no intentions of submitting to the inquisitions of those who are poorly educated on, or seek to exonerate Judaism–the religion of the Pharisees.

My purpose here is to expose the truth about Judaism–truths that were known and taught by the church for nearly 2000 years.
 
In other words you know if you fess up to what you really believe you would be banned. I accept all that the magisterium teaches. Why don’t you?
 
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cestusdei:
In other words you know if you fess up to what you really believe you would be banned.
If it pleases you to believe these things, very well.

But the truth is that I don’t take you or your slanderous accusations seriously and I refuse to be distracted by them. I am staying focused on the points which I wish to make.
 
St. James, the Pope has said this, do you accept it with submission of intellect and will?

"Yes, once again, through myself, the Church, in the words of the well-known Declaration Nostra Aetate (no. 4), “deplores the hatred, persecutions and displays of anti-Semitism directed against the Jews at any time and by anyone;” I repeat: “by anyone.”

I would like once more to express a word of abhorrence for the genocide decreed against the Jewish people during the last War, which led to the holocaust of millions of innocent victims.

When I visited on June 7, 1979 the concentration camp at Auschwitz and prayed for the many victims from various nations, I paused in particular before the memorial stone with the inscription in Hebrew and thus manifested the sentiments of my heart: “This inscription stirs the memory of the People whose sons and daughters were destined to total extermination. This People has its origin in Abraham, who is our father in faith” (cf. Rom 4:12), as Paul of Tarsus expressed it. Precisely this people, which received from God the commandment: “Thou shalt not kill,” has experienced in itself to a particular degree what killing means. Before this inscription it is not permissible for anyone to pass by with indifference" (Insegnamenti, 1979, p. 1484). The Jewish community of Rome too paid a high price in blood. And it was surely a significant gesture that in those dark years of racial persecution the doors of our religious houses, of our churches, of the Roman Seminary, of buildings belonging to the Holy See and of Vatican City itself were thrown open to offer refuge and safety to so many Jews of Rome being hunted by their persecutors.
  1. Today’s visit is meant to make a decisive contribution to the consolidation of the good relations between our two communities, in imitation of the example of so many men and women who have worked and who are still working today, on both sides, to overcome old prejudices and to secure ever wider and fuller recognition of that “bond” and that “common spiritual patrimony” that exists between Jews and Christians.
This is the hope expressed in the fourth paragraph of the Council’s Declaration Nostra Aetate, which I have just mentioned, on the relationship of the Church to non-Christian religions. The decisive turning-point in relations between the Catholic Church and Judaism, and with individual Jews, was occasioned by this brief but incisive paragraph.

We are all aware that, among the riches of this paragraph no. 4 of Nostra Aetate, three points are especially relevant. I would like to underline them here, before you, in this truly unique circumstance. The first is that the Church of Christ discovers her “bond” with Judaism by “searching into her own mystery” (cf. Nostra Aetate, ibid.) The Jewish religion is not “extrinsic” to us, but in a certain way is “intrinsic” to our own religion. With Judaism therefore we have a relationship which we do not have with any other religion. You are our dearly beloved brothers and, in a certain way, it could be said that you are our elder brothers.

The second point noted by the Council is that no ancestral or collective blame can be imputed to the Jews as a people for “what happened in Christ’s passion” (cf. Nostra Aetate, ibid.) Not indiscriminately to the Jews of that time, nor to those who came afterwards, nor to those of today. So any alleged theological justification for discriminatory measures or, worse still, for acts of persecution is unfounded. The Lord will judge each one “according to his own works,” Jews and Christians alike (cf. Rom 2:6)

The third point that I would like to emphasize in the Council’s Declaration is a consequence of the second. Notwithstanding the Church’s awareness of her own identity, it is not lawful to say that the Jews are “repudiated or cursed,” as it this were taught or could be deduced from the Sacred Scriptures of the Old or the New Testament (cf. Nostra Aetate, ibid.). Indeed, the Council had already said in this same text of Nostra Aetate, but also in the Dogmatic Constitution Lumen Gentium, no. 16, referring to Saint Paul in the Letter to the Romans (11:28-29), that the Jews are beloved of God, who has called them with an irrevocable calling."
 
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