Transsexualism, why is it so dispised

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aspawloski4th

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Lately there has been a certain type of thread in this forum that has been very polarizing, it’s about transgender type issues.Albeit only a few threads of this subject have been started, they turn out to be what amounts to very heated debates, with two very well defined sides. Lately nothing comes close to getting as heated as this subject or group of subjects. I’m mainly address the side that doesn’t agree with the transsexual outlook on the subject.
While there re those who mildly disagree and just agree to disagree, there is a very large contingent out there that with lots of vitrial despises anything having to do with gender issues. There is a large group who thinks they have the answers despite only reading an article here and there or not even doing that. They base what they think on conjecture not bases on any scientific type reading. Even though they read little or nothing at all they think they know enough to have the answers or know it all.
This same group doesn’t seem to care what the transgender person suffers through when trying to act like what is expected of someone of their body sexual identity. That type of suffering often leads to depression, and attempted suicide. It often leads to mental breakdown. The anti tg side seems not to care even when it’s children suffering from gender dysphoria. Counseling in a way to attempt to cure this condition often leads to worse depression than when left alone and that person more likely to attempt suicide, I know that from personal experience of acquaintances.
This type of group that thinks this way is hellbent on making those live as their sexual identity and the heck with brain gender. What I’m looking for is why!!! Now I can understand when we are talking one’s only family members, but when it’s not some one related to you, why does it bother you SO much? If I’m the neighbor across the street, if I’m a fellow parishioner, if I’m in the wait staff at the neighborhood diner,tell at your bank. What makes one so uncomfortable around transsexuals? When it’s a stranger why does one even care! Ultimately is isn’t really your business.
In the last year 2 transsexual who run a suicide prevention hotline have signed an order to purchase 2 “ghost towns” in the state of Texas.(because thats the state they live in) With hope and plans to build up a transgender friendly community, where those with those type issues can be themselves without the consequences of discrimination and societal hatred that other minority type group have experienced in the past. Because of the present poor economy things are going slow, but it’'s being worked on none the less. This project has many in waiting for it to get off the ground, me included. Many people are going to have to come to terms with that mind and body are not always congruent, that where possible people are going to fix the body to be congruent with the mind and because the opposite is not possible. Ill be happy to transition in my home town of Grand Rapids Michigan, or in the future transition in Texas. Either way I’m going to get to be the real me. Which is Catholic, right to life, amungst other things , and female what my soul is not have to pretend to be male what I never was inside. Science backs me up, and the scientific method backs me up, and what people see when I’m in Stephanie mode backs me up. Either agree to disagree or or keep to your self. I rest my case. I can accept friendly understanding people who can disagree with out being disagreeable. I’ve had enough of those who think their 10 minutes of reading on the subject trumps my 30 years of studying the subject.
 
While there re those who mildly disagree and just agree to disagree, there is a very large contingent out there that with lots of vitrial despises anything having to do with gender issues. There is a large group who thinks they have the answers despite only reading an article here and there or not even doing that. They base what they think on conjecture not bases on any scientific type reading. Even though they read little or nothing at all they think they know enough to have the answers or know it all.
Hi 👋

Although many non-Catholics might fall into the the “know-it-all” category, I wonder if the the weight and authority of the Catholic Church might incline Catholics to pass judgment before they they have investigated transgender issues. By that I mean, because the Catholic Church hasn’t okayed transsexual matters, perhaps they assume it is forbidden?
 
I think the reason why is tied in to the reasons why people care so much about whether or not other people are having sex and with whom.

A lot of people are baffled as to what gender transfolk are. (By the way, I mean no disrespect with that term - it’s what I was I told by the transfolk I’ve known) Now, personally, I only have a problem when I’m talking historically. I mean, if I’m talking about my M2F friend, but I’m talking about before transition began, do I call my friend “her” (which feels incorrect when talking about someone who, at the time, lived as a man) or do I call my friend “him” (which seems disrespectful in light of current reality)?

But for someone who doesn’t completely accept the idea of brain gender, and especially for those who want everyone properly labeled and filed, I can imagine that it must be even more confusing. I watched a Law & Order episode where a pre-op M2F was sentenced of a crime and sent to a men’s prison, because the courts said genitals = gender. Of course, less than a week later, she was violently beaten and gang-raped. Putting her in a women’s prison would have been no better - after all, she had a penis and testicles (even if the hormones she took likely rendered them non-functioning).

When people have a black and white view of things, then anyone who upsets that is dangerous and scary.
 
Its not natural…
THAT is kinda the point…it is not entirely natural for a “male mind” to end up in a lady’s body. or the opposite. naurally if this happens to a person, they would try very hard to correct it, right? 🙂
 
So where are all the people who are opposed to transgendered people?
 
Despised is a harsh word.

I’ve read around, and I am sympathetic to gender issues. But sympathy doesn’t translate to agreement.

It’s a burden for your brain to tell you that physically you have the wrong genitals. I don’t understand why the default in this situation is that the brain is right and the body is wrong. That certainly makes no sense to me.

There are people who have been mutilated at birth by well intentioned doctors and parents who made a best guess in the physical signs were ambiguous. This is truly a tragic situation.

But, when the people in this situation equate acceptance and support with love, as in “if you love me you will support me in anything I do” , then you have set yourself up to feel unloved, even by those who love you.

I don’t know - what do you want out of this thread?
 
Not despised, just talked to death.

An awful lot of posters have exercised an awful lot of patience engaging in discussions about this issue on CAF. However, clearly some people are not satisfied with the answers and wish to change minds, and/or to have the issue supersede other issues in importance & prominence.

To oneself, one’s own problems and sufferings tend to be the most important things in the world. And if a lot of other people are experiencing similar problems, one can receive a lot of empathy and practical support. But if very few people share that situation, it is not realistic to expect that forum participants will want to open yet a fifth thread about the same topic that has already been rehashed and patiently discussed. Same for my own specialty, rare, or unique problems. If I had such specialty situations (and I have – just different ones than this topic), I would seek a specific niche support group in which I could find common ground with others – rather than seeking a conservative or mainstream forum for an extreme or (relatively) rare problem, especially if my moral viewpoint did not coincide with the forum I had already approached unsuccessfully 4 or 5 times, minimum.
 
Despised is a harsh word.

I’ve read around, and I am sympathetic to gender issues. But sympathy doesn’t translate to agreement.

It’s a burden for your brain to tell you that physically you have the wrong genitals. I don’t understand why the default in this situation is that the brain is right and the body is wrong. That certainly makes no sense to me.

There are people who have been mutilated at birth by well intentioned doctors and parents who made a best guess in the physical signs were ambiguous. This is truly a tragic situation.

But, when the people in this situation equate acceptance and support with love, as in “if you love me you will support me in anything I do” , then you have set yourself up to feel unloved, even by those who love you.

I don’t know - what do you want out of this thread?
First on the subject of the brain, its because the essence of who you care comes through the brain. For poeple the brain is the most important part of your physical being, after all we are not animals. I can agree to disagree with people, I’m not looking for support from here. What am I looking for from the thread is to find out why people loathe people like me and why they think they know more than me when they havent studied up on the subject nearly as much as I have.
 
Not despised, just talked to death.

An awful lot of posters have exercised an awful lot of patience engaging in discussions about this issue on CAF. However, clearly some people are not satisfied with the answers and wish to change minds, and/or to have the issue supersede other issues in importance & prominence.

To oneself, one’s own problems and sufferings tend to be the most important things in the world. And if a lot of other people are experiencing similar problems, one can receive a lot of empathy and practical support. But if very few people share that situation, it is not realistic to expect that forum participants will want to open yet a fifth thread about the same topic that has already been rehashed and patiently discussed. Same for my own specialty, rare, or unique problems. If I had such specialty situations (and I have – just different ones than this topic), I would seek a specific niche support group in which I could find common ground with others – rather than seeking a conservative or mainstream forum for an extreme or (relatively) rare problem, especially if my moral viewpoint did not coincide with the forum I had already approached unsuccessfully 4 or 5 times, minimum.
I can find you lots of other subjects discusses as much or more tha this one, not having to do with the faith itself, and I don’t complain about those. I get the impression from you the yo wish this subject would go away. It isn’t. I’m not looking for you’r support, I’m looking for a more chritable attitude and maybe the admition that maybe you dont have the answers on this subject because you are not as well read on it as people like me.
 
What am I looking for from the thread is to find out why people loathe people like me and why they think they know more than me when they havent studied up on the subject nearly as much as I have.
I think online forums such as this often involve people stating their opinions, no matter how much knowledge they have about a topic. Certainly I am guilty of reading a thread, then doing a bit of web-surfing, and returning to pontificate about the topic. Plus there is a matter of trust. For example, you are asking us to accept your opinions because you are more knowledgeable on this subject. But we don’t know you or your credentials, so we are more likely to trust ourselves and what we have experienced, even if it is only knowledge from a minor amount of websurfing.

As to why some people loathe transgender persons, I don’t have a clue. Do you really mean to use the word “loathe?” My understanding is that the word means “to dislike greatly and often with disgust or intolerance.” Certainly such haters are out there, but do they visit Catholic Answers Forums? If they are here, I am not sure I would want to read their uncensored words if I were transgender. It sounds like it would be a painful experience, with little chance of changing their hearts.
 
I have watched many documentaries and read journals on the topic of transsexualism/transgender disorder. What I know of it, my heart can only break for all those suffering with this, daily. How totally incredible to wake up everyday as a female, and I don’t even think about it. I just take it all for granted. :oMy prayers to anyone who is having to cope with this, and figure out the ‘next steps’ in his/her life.

I will say to you OP, though…when it comes to people’s anger or lashing out at you, if in fact, you have experienced that with this topic, or have read threads that become ‘heated,’ as you say–just always remember this…people often express anger with things they don’t understand. I believe that the Church does have a stance on this, and it’s a very compassionate one. I need to locate some information from the CCC on it, as I thought I read something recently about this.
 
First on the subject of the brain, its because the essence of who you care comes through the brain. For poeple the brain is the most important part of your physical being, after all we are not animals. I can agree to disagree with people, I’m not looking for support from here. What am I looking for from the thread is to find out why people loathe people like me and why they think they know more than me when they havent studied up on the subject nearly as much as I have.
But, the brain can have disorders. There is a whole branch of medicine that deals with disorders of the brain.

The unambiguous sign, normally, is the physical body. You can’t dispute that.

So, I don’t loathe you. I don’t know you. But, I have studied up enough to develop an objective opinion.
 
I can find you lots of other subjects discusses as much or more tha this one, not having to do with the faith itself, and I don’t complain about those.

But lots of other posters do “complain about” (and similarly repeat & beat to death) those “other subjects” too, but you didn’t ask about those other subjects. You asked about this subject, and the nature of your response merely solidifies my earlier points. You are not satisfied with the wide range of opinions you have already received. You keep fishing for new, different opinions, in the hope of getting some agreement somewhere. It’s not impossible, just unlikely, as you have heard the majority of opinions already.

Just because other posters also hammer their fave subjects to death does not make this subject any more worthy of repetitive argument.

I get the impression from you the yo wish this subject would go away.

No. You get the information from me that the subject has been investigated and discussed, and several times. Does that fact make it also acceptable that certain politicians get re-executed and re-buried almost every week on CAF? No. (Not i.m.o.) That is also just as tiresome. Been there, heard that…

I’m not looking for you’r support, I’m looking for a more chritable attitude and maybe the admition that maybe you dont have the answers on this subject because you are not as well read on it as people like me.

And I’m looking for a more realistic attitude from you, which would be the fruit of a closer and more honest reading of the threads and replies therein already published.

You seem to seek “official” acceptance. If so, you won’t get that informally from posters – myself or anyone – including folks you consider “well-read.” If you want acceptance from the clergy, the catechism, the Vatican, etc., you’ll have to seek it there. It’s weird to try to get it in this subterranean way. Or, alternatively, if it’s social, not religious acceptance you seek, you should seek that acceptance in the appropriate quarters: like-minded or like-affected people. And if you want spiritual acceptance, you don’t need to search us out for that. You have it in Christ Jesus, who died for you.
 
Hi 👋

Although many non-Catholics might fall into the the “know-it-all” category, I wonder if the the weight and authority of the Catholic Church might incline Catholics to pass judgment before they they have investigated transgender issues. By that I mean, because the Catholic Church hasn’t okayed transsexual matters, perhaps they assume it is forbidden?
I believe that your suspicion may be right on.
The CC has not “come out” with anything in support of TS issues. NOT PUBLICLY:confused:
No, the Vatican sends a “SECRET” document to the bishops. The document states that in “extreem” cases, there would not be a moral issue. The document is in rersponse to a priest having SRS.
I’m really curious as to why this document was sent “secretly”??? I am also very curious as to what else was contained in the document, and plan on speeking to my parish priest to see if it’s possible to find out more about this document.
This document is so secret, that you would be hard pressed to find a parish priest that knows about it.
My gut feeling is that they are afraid that if it’s made publicly known, it would be regarded as a defacto OK from the CC to have SRS.
 
Despised is a harsh word.

I’ve read around, and I am sympathetic to gender issues. But sympathy doesn’t translate to agreement.

It’s a burden for your brain to tell you that physically you have the wrong genitals. I don’t understand why the default in this situation is that the brain is right and the body is wrong. That certainly makes no sense to me.

There are people who have been mutilated at birth by well intentioned doctors and parents who made a best guess in the physical signs were ambiguous. This is truly a tragic situation.

But, when the people in this situation equate acceptance and support with love, as in “if you love me you will support me in anything I do” , then you have set yourself up to feel unloved, even by those who love you.

I don’t know - what do you want out of this thread?
Paul,
Just think about it for a moment. In the past, when a baby was born with ambiguous genitals, the doctor and or parerents would pick the infants sex and the child would be raised accordingly. This proved to be a complete disaster. Children were raised as little girls. Dresses, makeup, etc. Now if the “body” is correct, then all should have been just fine. It wasn’t!! They were boys!!! As soon as they figured out what had happened to them, if they didn’t commit suicide, they reverted back to what they were to begin with. Your identity is not in your body, it is in your mind. In you spirit.
Thankfully, todays practice to to let the child mature and let him/her make the determination.😉
 
I have watched many documentaries and read journals on the topic of transsexualism/transgender disorder. What I know of it, my heart can only break for all those suffering with this, daily. How totally incredible to wake up everyday as a female, and I don’t even think about it. I just take it all for granted. :oMy prayers to anyone who is having to cope with this, and figure out the ‘next steps’ in his/her life.

I will say to you OP, though…when it comes to people’s anger or lashing out at you, if in fact, you have experienced that with this topic, or have read threads that become ‘heated,’ as you say–just always remember this…people often express anger with things they don’t understand. I believe that the Church does have a stance on this, and it’s a very compassionate one. I need to locate some information from the CCC on it, as I thought I read something recently about this.
Hi:)
Thank you for your “Christian” attitude and for your prayers.

As for “people often express anger with things they don’t understand.”, I agree with you. However, let’s not forget all the ignorant people that hate blacks, jews, gays, and just about any minority. Some of those people post on CAF, pretending to be conservative voices in support of the CC.

And “I believe that the Church does have a stance on this, and it’s a very compassionate one.” I very much disagree. As I state in a previous post, The Church released a “secret” document to the bishops. I would be glad to point you in the direction to get that info. Also resources to the person that heavily influenced the churches stance. There you will see the picture of a man that has no problem using self serving tactics to further his personal agenda, no matter who it hurts. Heck, we really are a very small minority.
 
Ultimately is isn’t really your business.
Exactly!

And the fact that some want to make it “my business” tells me this isn’t really about tolerance, it’s about promoting a point of view which I may or may not, for any number of reasons, accept as valid.
 
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