Transubstantiation question

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Help!!! I have a mennonite friend that has asked me this:
where does Jesus explain to His disciples how to turn the bread and wine into His Body and Blood? If it has been passed down throughout the ages, where did it come from? why can’t i find it in the Bible?
So can any preist, deacon, seminarian, anyone help me out? Br. Rich?? anyone???

Thanks!
 
It came from sacred tradition and not from the bilbe. All the disciples were there when Jesus said “This is my body”. The exact mechanics of how He did that that they imitated when they celebrated mass belong to the realm of sacred tradition.

Before there was any New Testament–the disicples passed along such things. They wrote the Bible–they didn’t wait on the Bible to tell them what to do!
 
The words of the institution of the Eucharist are clearly stated in all three synoptic Gospels, as well as by St. Paul in his letter to the Corinthians. It’s also recorded that Jesus told the Apostles: “DO THIS in memory of me.” That’s the “how to do it.”

The Acts of the Apostles records how the early Church would at first go to the Temple for the prayers, and gather in homes for the Eucharist (breaking of bread.)

When they were kicked out of the Jewish Temple, they combined both parts–readings and prayers, with the eucharistic service. Still today we have the liturgy of the word and the liturgy of the eucharist.
 
Help!!! I have a mennonite friend that has asked me this:

So can any preist, deacon, seminarian, anyone help me out? Br. Rich?? anyone???

Thanks!
where does Jesus explain to His disciples how to turn the bread and wine into His Body and Blood? If it has been passed down throughout the ages, where did it come from? why can’t i find it in the Bible?
Read 1 Cor 11:22-25.

For every one taketh before his own supper to eat. And one indeed is hungry and another is drunk.

11:22 What, have you no houses to eat and to drink in? Or despise ye the church of God and put them to shame that have not? What shall I say to you? Do I praise you? In this I praise you not.

11:23 For I have received of the Lord that which also I delivered unto you, that the Lord Jesus, the same night in which he was betrayed, took bread,

11:24 And giving thanks, broke and said: Take ye and eat: This is my body, which shall be delivered for you. This do for the commemoration of me.

11:25 In like manner also the chalice, after he had supped, saying: This chalice is the new testament in my blood. This do ye, as often as you shall drink, for the commemoration of me.

11:26 For as often as you shall eat this bread and drink the chalice, you shall shew the death of the Lord, until he come.

11:27 Therefore, whosoever shall eat this bread, or drink the chalice of the Lord unworthily, shall be guilty of the body and of the blood of the Lord.
 
Not only that, but the reasoning behind transubstantiation is given in John 6…
 
Help!!! I have a mennonite friend that has asked me this:

So can any preist, deacon, seminarian, anyone help me out? Br. Rich?? anyone???

Thanks!
Does Jesus explain how washing with water (matter) and baptizing in the name of the Father, Son, and Holy Spirit (form) washes away all of our sins? And yet we still believe that it does.

Does Jesus explain that simply because the Apostles forgive someone’s sins, they are forgiven in Heaven?

Instead, Jesus says, "Do this (poien) in memory of me (anamnesis).

poien - is used in Jewish liturgies in terms of sacrficing. It literally means “to offer up”.

anamnesis - means to make some present, not simply as a memorial as is often interpreted.

That’s how the Jews remembered the first Passover. They felt that, even today, they are present with their brothers 3000+ years ago when the angel passed over their house, because the Passover is celebrated in anamnesis.
 
Help!!! I have a mennonite friend that has asked me this:
Thanks!
**Transubstantiation: **
1215 (4th Lateran Council) The body and blood (of Jesus Christ) are in the sacrament of the altar truly contained under the species of bread and wine; the bread having been transubstantiated into the body and the wine into the blood by divine power (potestate divina).

====================

THE EUCHARIST

The synoptic gospels of Matthew, Mark, LukeAccounts of the institution of the Eucharist

John’s gospel
Theology of the Eucharist

===================

**Reflection: **
If God can create (bara (Heb) ex nihilo (Latin:) - out of nothing) (Humanity “Invents”, cannot “create”)
; what is it so difficult for God to change “bread & wine” into His “Body and Blood” ?

An Overview of the Gospel according to John – Chapter 6
1 – 15
The miracle of the loaves
Able to create and feed the people out of nothing

16 – 21
Jesus walks on the waters
Jesus the God-man has power/control over the elements
He is with us - comes to us


22 – 25, 26 – 50
[he discourse in the synagogue at Capernaum
“Bread from heaven”
FAITH in Jesus & in His teachings[Jesus is: The Way, The Truth & The Life

51 – 58
The Real Presence of Christ in the Blessed Sacrament*
Tanssubstantiation

69 – 66
The break-up of Jesus’ followers & disciples
*Note Chapter 6:66 (666 *)

67 – 71
Peter’s profession of FaithThe
True followers of Christ

continue…2
 
cont…2

The Eucharist-SOURCE AND SUMMIT OF ECCLESIAL LIFE

The belief in the “Real Presence” is usually the focus of attack by Fundamentalists on the Catholic Faith.
  • The opponents of Church recognize what Catholicism’s core devotional doctrine is.
  • The attempts to show that Fundamentalists are not always literalists. (As seen in their interpretation of the 2nd half of John Chapter 6.
Jn 6:30-31It
begins with a discussion which took place in the synagogue at Caphanaum. The Jews ask Jesus what sign he could perform and as a challenge, said that their forefathers had manna in the desert. – Could he beat that?

Jn 6:32-34
Jesus explained to them that the real bread from heaven comes from the Father. So they ask Jesus to give them this bread instead.

Jn 6:35-42
Jesus replied, “I am the bread of life…” At this point the Jews understood him to be speaking metaphorically

TAKING JESUS AT HIS WORD

Jn 6:43-51
Jesus first repeated what he said, then summarized: “ 51. I am the living bread which came down from heaven; if any one eats of this bread, he will live for ever; and the bread which I shall give for the life of the world is my flesh."

Jn 6:52
The Jews, with a “show-me” kind of attitude, asked, “How can this man give us his flesh to eat?” – His listeners were dazed because they now understood Jesus literally – and correctly.

Jn 6:53Jesus repeated his words, but with even greater emphasis.

Jn 6:54-57
Jesus then introduced the statement about drinking His blood.

NO CORRECTIONS NEEDED – THERE WERE NO “MISUNDERSTANDINGS”

Jn 6:58-59
Notice that Jesus did not make any attempt to soften what he said. He did not attempt to correct “misunderstandings”, for there were none. His listeners understood him perfectly well.

They no longer thought he was speaking metaphorically. If they had, if they mistook what he said, why no correction?

On other occasions whenever there was confusion, Jesus explained just what he meant. (e.g. Nicodemus: about being born again ; The Samaritan woman at the well: about living waters; Lazarus: not ‘asleep’ but is ‘dead’.) Here, when misunderstanding would be fatal, there was no effort to correct. Instead, he repeated himself.

Jn 6:60
We read that many of his disciples cannot accept Jesus at His word!

Jn 6:61-63
Mind you, these were his disciples – the people who were used to his remarkable ways. He warned them not to think carnally, but spiritually

Jn 6:64-65
He knew that some did not believe, including the one who was to betray him. (It is here, in the rejection of the Eucharist, that Judas fell away.)

Jn 6:66
Resulting from their disbelief, even many of his disciples left, and they did not follow Jesus any longer.

Jn 6:67-71
This is the only record we have of any of Jesus’ followers forsaking him for purely doctrinal reasons. If it had all been a misunderstanding, if they erred in taking a metaphor in literal sense, why didn’t Jesus call them back and straighten things out? Both the Jews who were suspicious of him, and his disciples, who had accepted everything up to this point, would have remained had he told them that “eating his Body and drinking his Blood” meant no more than a figure or a token. But Jesus did not correct these first protesters – Jesus meant literally what he said.

Jesus said several times that he was the bread that came down from heaven; and specifically 4 times he said they would have “to eat my flesh and drink my blood (cf Jn 6:53-56)

John 6 was an extended promise of what would be instituted at the Last Supper – and it was a promise that could not be more explicit. Or so it would seem to a Roman Catholic – But fundamentalists would interpret this differently.

cont…3
 
cont…3

MERELY FIGURATIVE ?

*Fundamentalists say that in John chapter 6, Jesus was not talking about physical but spiritual food and drink. They quote John 6:35 where Jesus said to them, “I am the bread of life; he who comes to me shall not hunger, and he who believes in me shall never thirst.”

They calim that coming to him is bread, having faith in him is drink. Thus, eating his flesh and blood merely means believing in Christ

But there is a problem with that intrepetation. *

Fr John O’Brien in his book “The Faith of Millions” explains:
“The phrase ‘to eat the flesh and drink the blood, when used figuratively among the Jews, as among the Arabs of today, meant to inflict upon a person some serious injury, especially by calumny or by false accusation. To interprete the phrase figuratively then would be to make our Lord promise life everlasting to the culprit for slandering and hating him, which would reduce the whole passage to utter nonsense.” (Is 9:20, Is 49:26, Mic 3:3)

*Fundamentalist writers who comment on John 6 also assert one can show Christ was speaking only metaphorically by comparing verses like John 10:9 (“I am the door”) and John 15:1 (“I am the true vine”).

The problem is that there is not really a connection to John 6:35: “I am the bread of life.”

“I am the door” and “I am the vine” make sense as metaphors because Christ is like a door – we go to heaven through him – and he is also like a vine – we get our spiritual sap through him.

But Christ takes John 6:35 far beyond a mere metaphor. He excludes any symbolism by saying: “For my flesh is food indeed, and my blood is drink indeed.” (Jn 6:55) He continues: “As the living Father sent me, and I live because of the Father, so he who eats me will live because of me.” (Jn 6:57)

The Greek word used for “eats” is very blunt and has the sense of “gnaws”. This is not the language of metaphor.

John uses the word sarx (flesh) instead of soma (body) when speaking of the word’s becoming human and when speaking of the eucharistic bread of life (6:51). Soma means a body tangible to sense, while sarx implies human nature in its completeness.*

WHY DO FUNDAMENTALISTS REJECT THE PLAIN, LITERAL INTERPRETATION OF JOHN 6 ?
  • Code:
    For them, Catholic sacraments are out because they imply spiritual reality – grace being conveyed by means of matter.
  • Code:
    This seems a violation of the divine plan.  For fundamentalists, matter is not to be use, but overcome or avoided, and one can speculate that if Fundamentalists are asked by the Creator, their opinion of how to effect humanity’s salvation, they would have advised Him to adopt a different approach.
  • Code:
    How cleaner things would be if spirit never dirtied itself with matter!
  • Code:
    But God, quite literally, loves matter – and He love it so much that he came to us under the appearance of bread and wine.
therealpresence.org/eucharst/mir/a3.html

End
 
I searched for “Transubstantiation” and found this thread. From the link you gave (previous post) and from there was able to find this article:
catholic.net/rcc/Periodicals/Homiletic/Jan98/transubstantiation.html

I had read that or a similar article before and was looking for it. Thank You!

It is fascinating when we think of the distinction between the accidents of matter and its substance. It would seem that our human understanding of matter itself is so limited that there is no basis to doubt transubstantiation as an article of faith. In fact, it seems that people need to doubt their assumptions of reality to begin with!
 
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