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byfaithalone
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It’s as free as God allows it to be.
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Tomster
Guest
Please answer the question.
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Snerticus
Guest
I do not posess the answer for '2 times pi’. If I DID posess the answer, there would be nothing to work out, because I already have worked it out.
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Tomster
Guest
So are you, then, saying that God respects our free will so much that he will not stop you from sinning even though you consider yourself saved?
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Tomster
Guest
“10-4”Did I mention this was the Transubstantiation thread?
looks around for his thread police hat
Chuck
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byfaithalone
Guest
You do realize this entire chapter is about the judgement of the Jews?
yes, works are judged. But not for salvation.
Yes, reward or loss is according to works. 1 Cor 3:15
yes, works are judged. No one said otherwise. this has nothing to do with salvation.
The GreatWhite Throne Judgment is not for believers.
No argument there. But keep in mind, eternal life is NOT a reward.
For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life.
Snipping and clipping verses out of context as you have done is never a good idea.
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bobregan
Guest
Also, we have actual quotes from early Church Fathers (Ignatius of Antioch, Clement, Polycarp, Irenaus, etc.), some of whom received their teachings directly from the apostles John, Peter, Paul stating that the bread and wine truly becomes Christ’s body and blood. Nowhere, however, do we hear of an early Church Father stating no, the bread and wine are only symbolic,or spiritual, of Christ’s body and blood.
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delsydebothom
Guest
That’s sort of the point of the question. If St. Paul had been completely saved (assuming here we mean saved from sin), he would no longer sin at all. Committing a sin is proof that you aren’t, at that moment, saved from it, since it is visibly obvious at that point that you’ve committed it. Much in the same way, being bitten by a Tiger is evidence that you haven’t been completely saved from that Tiger. At the very least its evidence that you need to be saved from it again, since you decided once again to approach it–bad idea, by the way.
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byfaithalone
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Have you stopped sinning? Do you know anyone that does not sin? If your answer is no, then you are suggesting that there is no person on this earth that is saved.
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rben20
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And we have quotes from Our Lord!
byfaithalone is very ignorant of Scripture to make such a FALSE claim that there is no real presence. Jesus says THIS IS! Was the bread and wine always??? NO. HE consecrated it! and HE said for his apostles to DO THIS IN MEMORY OF ME!!
Matthew 26:26-28
“And as they were eating, Jesus took
bread, and blessed it, and brake it, and
gave it to the disciples, and said, Take,
eat; this is my body. And he took the cup,
and gave thanks, and gave it to them,
saying, Drink ye all of it; For this is my
blood of the new testament, which is
shed for many for the remission of sins.”
Mark 14:22,24
“And as they did eat, Jesus took bread,
and blessed, and brake it, and gave to
them, and said, Take, eat: this is my
body…And he said unto them, This is
my blood of the new testament, which is
shed for many.”
Luke 22:19-20
“And he took bread, and gave thanks,
and brake it, and gave unto them,
saying, This is my body which is given
for you: this do in remembrance of me.
Likewise also the cup after supper,
saying, This cup is the new testament in
my blood, which is shed for you.”
Luke 24:30-31,35
“And it came to pass, as he sat at meat
with them, he took bread, and blessed
it, and brake, and gave to them. And
their eyes were opened, and they knew
him; and he vanished out of their
sight…And they told what things were
done in the way, and how he was known
of them in breaking of bread.”
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Tomster
Guest
Thank you very much.
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Tomster
Guest
I am not suggesting it. I am telling you that, in fact, there is no one on this earth who is saved. Again, we will not know our destiny until we are judged by God. That will occur the split second after we croak. Get it?
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Cat_Herder
Guest
[BIBLEDRB]Galatians 3:28[/BIBLEDRB]
Says who? Tim LaHaye?
Says who? What part of “all men” is there not to understand?
Says who? Not Jesus Christ.
[BIBLEDRB]Mark 10:24-30[/BIBLEDRB]
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byfaithalone
Guest
Nice verse. But Romans 2 is addressing the Jews under the law who thought they were above judgment.
Care to refute me?
You aren’t well verses in the book of Revelation are you? Rev. 20 takes place AFTER the marriage supper of the Lamb.
Yes.
For the wages of sin is death, but the gift of God is eternal life in Christ Jesus our Lord.
Romans 6
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StevenFrancis
Guest
I am also no expert, but from what I understand, in “consubstantiation” they believe the presence is real, but that it leaves the materials at the conclusion of the liturgy, and returns to it’s original form. (very simplistically stated on my part, so expert explanation is welcomed). I think there are some Priests in the Anglican Church who are ordained by Catholic Apostolically succeeded Bishops, and therefore are part of an unbroken line in Holy Orders, and if those priests used the liturgical rite and intent of confecting the Holy Eucharist in Persona Christi, then it may be that they DO have transubstantiation, AND believe it. I just don’t know. Can an Anglican pipe in on this?)
In a symbolic ceremony, they are correct, in that transubstantiation does not occur. due to lack of liturgical eucharistic formula, intent, or validly ordained priests in persona Christi to confect and celebrate.
Once again correct. Anything other than the liturgical formula by a validly ordained priest will not yield a result of transubstantiation, and the bread and wine do not become the body, blood, soul and divinity of our Lord and savior.
This is a fact. All should. It is the our faith.
I’ve never seen this statistic, but it wouldn’t surprise me sadly in this age of cafeteria Catholicism. I’m not an expert in canon law, but I would think that it depends on their level of innocence and ignorance due to bad catechesis, and their level of conscious cooperation, but St. Paul reminds us that “he that eateth and drinketh unworthily, eateth and drinketh judgment to himself, not discerning the body of the Lord”, so it’s not just a shame, but a bit of a frightening shame which we must all pray to change, who love our brothers and sisters.
May God bless, keep and save us always
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byfaithalone
Guest
Whoever believes in Me HAS eternal life. I guess Jesus has no idea what He is talking about does He?
Go in Peace. Your faith has saved you. Luke 7:50 She’s alive and well, walking the earth SAVED.
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byfaithalone
Guest
Says who? Where is it stated and taught in Scripture that the saved are sinless?
Wrong. We sin because we are sinners. Salvation doesn’t change that fact, it changes us to where we no longer want to fulfill the desires of the flesh, but strive to walk in the Spirit.
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clmowry
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bobregan
Guest
As Catholics we can say we HAVE been saved (baptism), we are CURRENTLY being saved (the sacraments, avoiding mortal sin, grace), and by living Christ’s laws and commandments, we HOPE to be saved at our judgement.
But you can’t guarantee you’ve been saved. Live a life of unrepentant sin and your still guaranteed salvation because you’ve proclaimed “Jesus is Lord?” This is where “faith and reason” come in to play. Christ did say “Not all those that say ‘Lord, Lord’ will inherit the Kingdom of God.” Looks to me that this is possibly focused towards the “once saved, always saved” crowd. You can lose your salvation.
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Cat_Herder
Guest
[BIBLEDRB]Romans 2:10[/BIBLEDRB]
[BIBLEDRB]1 Corinthians 12:13[/BIBLEDRB]
[BIBLEDRB]Colossians 3:11[/BIBLEDRB]
What makes you think that Revelation is in chronological order? Why is the birth of Jesus (Ch12) depicted as being after the Lamb is shown reigning?
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