Trent Horn debate with James White: watch here!

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Thanks PRmerger for bringing this debate to my (and others) attention via your thread.

I’ll be checking back here from time to time to see if the debate (which I missed) is posted.

I am very interested in this.

Years ago someone else at Catholic Answers demolished Mr. White attempting to defend Eternal Security too.

The audio is no longer available from Catholic Answers, so I think Trent Horn’s (name removed by moderator)ut in this debate format will help fill this void.

God bless.

Cathoholic
 
Cathoholic said:
Thanks PRmerger for bringing this debate to my (and others) attention via your thread.
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👍
I’ll be checking back here from time to time to see if the debate (which I missed) is posted.
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I am very interested in this.
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Years ago someone else at Catholic Answers demolished Mr. White attempting to defend Eternal Security too.
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The audio is no longer available from Catholic Answers, so I think Trent Horn’s (name removed by moderator)ut in this debate format will help fill this void.
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God bless.
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Cathoholic
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I wonder if there was a poster here a few years ago, now banned, who was actually James White.
 
PRmerger said:
Indeed.

And it was a great debate point when Trent offered some other Protestant theologians, whom White acknowledged were indeed familiar with Leviticus, who disagreed with White’s personal interpretation of Hebrews.

Now, this, I didn’t see. I didn’t see him being snide.

And this surprised me, because I’ve seen his online persona–and he is indeed the master of snark.

But I was pleasantly surprised to see him being very respectful in person during the debate.
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He said it like half jokingly but I took it as a snide remark because I know his true feelings on the Catholic Church - he thinks we are apostate preaching another gospel and going to hell. So for him to make the comment about fellow protestants being basically Catholic, that is insulting to them based on his own personal feelings about the Church.

But yeah, overall he was well behaved. Better than his Sungenis debates.
 
MT1926 said:
I hope I am not going to far off topic, this might actually be a good thread to start some day.

But my question goes with your remark above “if you aren’t scholarly on the book of Leviticus.”

I thought one of the big premises of Sola Scriptura was anyone could pick up the Bible, read it for themselves and teach themselves God’s revelation?

If that weren’t true wouldn’t your only course of action be to either go to a Church which was 2000 years old or read the writings of the Church fathers to aid you in your interpretation?
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Unfortunately Horn didn’t hit him with that because it is a contradictory position to hold…

Time constraints though…
 
I wonder if there was a poster here a few years ago, now banned, who was actually James White.
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You may be right on this PRmerger.

I seem to remember Karl Keating discussing that (maybe in “This Rock” magazine?) years ago.

The guy posing on this site (again if my memory serves me correct) called himself “Orthopedo”.

I think that WAS James White.

Karl also explained how he knew it was Mr. White, but I didn’t make an effort to recall the details on that either.
 
Cathoholic said:
You may be right on this PRmerger.

I seem to remember Karl Keating discussing that (maybe in “This Rock” magazine?) years ago.

The guy posing on this site (again if my memory serves me correct) called himself “Orthopedo”.

I think that WAS James White.

Karl also explained how he knew it was Mr. White, but I didn’t make an effort to recall the details on that either.
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Hmmm. That’s not who I was thinking of.

:hmmm:
 
Karl said “Orthopedo” had other aliases too but “Orthopedo” is the only name sticking in my brain right now.
 
Lenten_ashes said:
I’m gonna actively look for a upload because I would like to hear it again. Maybe I just missed his rational as to why he applies this method.

Basically, those passages like John 15 where Jesus describes pruning, he is saying that is describing what happens to the unregenerate, not saved people. And these are just warning type passages for people to understand what happens to the fake Christians.

But Horn rightfully maintained that in order to be cut off or severed you must first be adjoined.

To me he is just practicing typical Sola Scriptura. Which means I place certain scriptures above others based on my own theological presuppositions.
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In dialoging a few months back with an OSAS fan of White on these forums, I pressed the person on Jesus’ “remain in me” statement. I asked who is Jesus talking to if once in Christ, you cannot walk away? For the damned, how can they remain somewhere they’ve never been? And in his belief, since a person cannot be in Christ, and then walk away, Christ cannot be talking to believers either. So who was Christ talking to?

His answer was bizarre. He said the answer to your question is “we say yes Lord.”
 
Hello all!
I am curious. Has Trent Horn said anything about the debate? Has he been on the radio or anything? I ask because I am still waiting for the video of the debate to be posted so I can watch all of it this time. The only movement I’ve seen on this subject is Dr. White’s Accurately Evaluating Debates. This to me seemed like he was more disappointed in people on his side.
So 3 questions:
  1. Has anyone seen the debate posted!?
  2. What do you think about James’ evaluation?
  3. Has Trent gone on radio, video, podcast… etc to talk about the debate?
    Thanks!!
 
I no longer watch these types of debates not because I don’t think the Catholic side has anything substantial it’s because normally I see the other side attack the character instead of a position and even when they do at attack a position It’s usually the same argument in spite of the fact they’ve already been refuted. I have a temper so I find it best not to give into that temper
 
Sr_Brando said:
Hello all!
I am curious. Has Trent Horn said anything about the debate? Has he been on the radio or anything? I ask because I am still waiting for the video of the debate to be posted so I can watch all of it this time. The only movement I’ve seen on this subject is Dr. White’s Accurately Evaluating Debates. This to me seemed like he was more disappointed in people on his side.
So 3 questions:
  1. Has anyone seen the debate posted!?
  2. What do you think about James’ evaluation?
  3. Has Trent gone on radio, video, podcast… etc to talk about the debate?
    Thanks!!
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He has not commented on it to my knowledge.

Still no upload on youtube

I missed the Q&A and was looking forward to seeing that. hope they upload already, not sure what the hold up is.
 
Former friend and colleague of White by the name Sam Shamoun saying he lost the debate. Check out his Facebook page for more,

Also commenting recently on White getting too chummy with Muslims.

It’s been said that White’s podcast on evaluating debates was damage control.

Personally I thought it was a fairly even debate. Horn missed a few opportunities, imo… that’s why I want to see the Q&A that i missed.
 
cllewismd said:
Congratulations to Trent Horn. He did a marvelous job. I have watched several of Dr. White’s debates, lectures, podcasts, etc. I have never seen him challenged at this level. Being a former Baptist, I was sensitive to the context of where this debate was happening. I don’t think the people that put this debate on were expecting quite this outcome. Very well represented. Our Catholic faith, I mean.
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Patrick Madrid destroyed James White in the debate on Sola Scriptura back in the 90’s. I think even the most die-hard White loyalists would concede this.

However, I would like to encourage folks to watch James White crush agnostic/atheist Bart Ehrman in a debate on the reliability of the NT:

youtube.com/watch?v=moHInA9fAsI

youtube.com/watch?v=K2Mp4v8VQwQ

I have to admit, I have new respect for White after viewing this because Ehrman is a serious NT scholar with all the heavyweight bona fides.
 
Randy_Carson said:
Patrick Madrid destroyed James White in the debate on Sola Scriptura back in the 90’s. I think even the most die-hard White loyalists would concede this.

However, I would like to encourage folks to watch James White crush agnostic/atheist Bart Ehrman in a debate on the reliability of the NT:

youtube.com/watch?v=moHInA9fAsI

youtube.com/watch?v=K2Mp4v8VQwQ

I have to admit, I have new respect for White after viewing this because Ehrman is a serious NT scholar with all the heavyweight bona fides.
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White is the best debator i have seen on the protestant side. Like in another galaxy from Slick and the others.
 
Lenten_ashes said:
White is the best debator i have seen on the protestant side. Like in another galaxy from Slick and the others.
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Agreed, James White is a great debater. I’ve watched a few of his rounds and I pray hard that he realizes the Truth and joins our side.

Matt Slick tries to intimidate his opponents and says things to try to rattle people to throw them off their game, which is why he’s so easily defeated by many people who debate him. If you don’t let him get to you, you win.

James White is a very intelligent dude, and doesn’t base his arguments on emotion. He uses the facts he finds to the best of his ability to make a solid case for his side. I also find him funny, because he knows when it’s OK to take a jab at his opponent and when it’s not OK. I could totally see him as the kind of guy who would rip you apart in a debate, then meet you a Chili’s for a beer and nachos afterwards and only talk about the ball game on TV and not what just happened in the debate. As someone who likes the art of debate, I enjoy watching him perform. But again, I just wish he were on our side.
 
ShanPO said:
Agreed, James White is a great debater. I’ve watched a few of his rounds and I pray hard that he realizes the Truth and joins our side.

Matt Slick tries to intimidate his opponents and says things to try to rattle people to throw them off their game, which is why he’s so easily defeated by many people who debate him. If you don’t let him get to you, you win.

James White is a very intelligent dude, and doesn’t base his arguments on emotion. He uses the facts he finds to the best of his ability to make a solid case for his side. I also find him funny, because he knows when it’s OK to take a jab at his opponent and when it’s not OK. I could totally see him as the kind of guy who would rip you apart in a debate, then meet you a Chili’s for a beer and nachos afterwards and only talk about the ball game on TV and not what just happened in the debate. As someone who likes the art of debate, I enjoy watching him perform. But again, I just wish he were on our side.
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Agreed. He would be a valuable asset if this ever happened. I honestly don’t know how someone with that amount of formal education and level of intellect can be a Calvinist - I understand maybe protestant as you cant fathom some Church teaching, but not Calvinism, that is a horrible belief system that contradicts the bible, 2000 years of Church teaching and common sense.

Thing is, his sister Patty is a Catholic convert and to make matters worse, some on the Catholic side have taken jabs at him for this, so I think at this point it has become personal.
 
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