Triangular God in relation to Time and Space

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What is the relationship of the Trinity of God to time and space? Is God the Father solely to be found outside of time? Is Christ God within time? The Holy Spirit proceeds from both of them. Does the Holy Spirit function to bridge these two realms of God’s being? Is this why Christ knows not the hour of his return? If only the Father know the hour, then what does this mean?
 
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spiritblows:
What is the relationship of the Trinity of God to time and space? Is God the Father solely to be found outside of time? Is Christ God within time? The Holy Spirit proceeds from both of them. Does the Holy Spirit function to bridge these two realms of God’s being? Is this why Christ knows not the hour of his return? If only the Father know the hour, then what does this mean?
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What difference does it make? Why are you trying to rationalise the Holy Trinity?
Science is understanding the measurable.
Faith is believing the incomprehensible.
 
Why did you respond if only to critisise my questions? These are metaphyical questions about the Trinity, time, and space, and if that isn’t an area of interest to you, then no need to scold. Everyone has different things they ponder about, okay?

Has anyone else thought about this?
 
Please to not be offended, but your question makes little sense. How can one be “outside of time” ? How is this different from “in time” ?

There are no “realms” for God’s being. He is at all times everywhere.

The Holy Trinity is not split up among anything. It is at all times one.

It’s rather impossible for us to understand these mysteries as humans.
 
Well, I beg to differ. My priest has many times mentioned in homilies that there will be an ‘end to time’ and that all of Creation will be taken to God when time ends. As far as the Trinity, it’s obvious to me that each person of the Trinity has different functions. The Holy Spirit is our helper. The Holy Spirit proceeds from both the Father and the Son. The Father seems to be more remote, therefore my supposition that he resides outside of time. The Holy Spirit seems very active in this world, so I think the Holy Spirit must be active within the framework of time and space in the physical universe.
 
Hi - Your question is extraordinarily perceptive and deep. I think you have a brilliant mind, and I applaud your contemplation of such a complex idea. I’ve heard it said (I wish I could remember the source) that God is “outside time.” Since God created the natural universe, time is - in itself - a creation of God. The scriptures say in reference to God “A thousand years in your sight is like a day” (Psalm 90:4). His idea of time is definitely not our idea of time. God created time - He is not bound by it. He is obviously very aware of how time affects us humans on earth, but He is focusing on a big picture that none of us could ever fathom, and His timing is perfect, even if we cannot understand it.

When you ask about Jesus not knowing about the time of His return - only God knows that - I think that is Jesus showing His great humility. Jesus said many times during His earthly ministry that He had not come to do His own will, but the Father’s will. If Jesus would ask the Father when the time of His Second Coming would be, the Father would, undoubtably give Jesus that information. If Jesus doesn’t have that information, then one possibility is that Jesus is demonstrating, yet again, His absolute trust in the Father and His absolute desire to do the Father’s will. He sets an amazing example for us. Jesus considers us His brothers and sisters. We, too, like our elder brother, Jesus, must show similar humility and trust of the Father.

Thanks for adding such a great thread to the forum!!
 
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spiritblows:
Why did you respond if only to critisise my questions? These are metaphyical questions about the Trinity, time, and space, and if that isn’t an area of interest to you, then no need to scold. Everyone has different things they ponder about, okay?

Has anyone else thought about this?
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I apologise if I offended you. If it is of interest you should read Theology for Beginners by F.J. Sheed. It covers many things but there are three particular sections which might interest you - The Blessed Trinity, The Three Persons, and The Human Mind and the Doctrine of the Trinity
 
That book sounds like it might be interesting. I get the feeling that the Father and the Son are parts of God that operate in different Spiritual spheres. Since we are the Body of Christ, although (name removed by moderator)erfect members, Christ operates on the physical plane. The Father must be purely a non-physical aspect of God. Somehow, it seems, the Holy Spirit is a very active aspect of God in this world. The Holy Spirit is always moving, it seems to be movement, inspiration, feelings, action, etc. It seems like the Holy Spirit is more of a verb and Christ is a noun. A verb is an action word, and the Holy Spirit seems to be God in action.
 
Well, I’m certainly learning new terms here… “physical plane” ? I just can’t see how you separate so many things so easily. For example, one of the big issues in the early church was whether Jesus was man of God, or to what extent he was each. Half man half God? God on Tuesdays and Fridays, man on the others? No, the answer the church resolved on was that Jesus was both fully man and fully God, at all times. I can accept this, in fact to me no other answer seems appropriate, but I certainly can’t understand it. The physical world we live in, comes from and is part of the other that is often beyond our ability to comprehend. I have trouble with the view that it is a “plane”

As for the nature of time … Jesus mentions many times in the Bible that if you believe in him, you will have “eternal life” and “live forever”. These would mean nothing if time had an end. So I don’t think time will just stop, but if we get to Heaven, we will not be bound by time and see it for what it really is. The very nature of time will change. Perhaps this is what your priest meant when he said “stop”, for the role time plays in our being as we live on earth will stop. No, God is not bound by time, just as He is not bound by space. He always was, is, and forever will be.
 
The life of the Trinity is God’s own internal life, and would be so even in the absence of any creation whatsoever. The Trinity is God in His essence.

God does exist “outside of time” and “outside of space” for time and space are his creations. They are both limitations. When you are in one place you can’t be in another. When you are in one time, you are not in another.

This doesn’t apply to God. God possesses all of his existence in an eternal “now.” That is the meaning of eternity. There is no past or future, only now.

We possess our existence only a moment at a time. God possesses his existence all at once. All times and places are here and now to him.
 
Perhaps this gets down to wording, as its hard to express what I mean in these kinds of discussions with the limitations of language.

When you say a person can only be in one time, what does that mean? What is “person” ? For example, I was alive yesterday, so I exist on October 11, 2005. But that is no longer me, since I am now typing on a forum on October 12, 2005. Does October 13th exist? Well, God’s already there. Am I? What am I doing? Or do I have to wait to get there?

However, I believe it comes down to what God is and what we are, not the differences between our space and time.

In that way, space and time do not limit us, but rather the nature of our existence.
 
I never said that ‘God’ was limited by time. What I’m talking about it ‘God the Father’, "God the Son’ and ‘God the Holy Spirit’. I believe that the ‘Father’ aspect of God most likely exists entirely outside of time, which is why he is so remote from humanity.

Remember, God has three persons, each with different characteristics, yet all of them part of the Trinine God.
 
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spiritblows:
I never said that ‘God’ was limited by time. What I’m talking about it ‘God the Father’, "God the Son’ and ‘God the Holy Spirit’. I believe that the ‘Father’ aspect of God most likely exists entirely outside of time, which is why he is so remote from humanity.

Remember, God has three persons, each with different characteristics, yet all of them part of the Trinine God.
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I think you’ve hit on why we call it the “Mystery of the Incarnation”.

I for one would not say that God the Father is remote from us. I would phrase that to say that to us, God the Father seems remote. But I think your reasoning for why God the Father seems remote is valid.

God the Son has ‘always’ (there’s that messy limited time language again) been with God and of God but at the ‘time’ he became man he did adopt some of the limits of time and space but he still maintained his divinity. Hence the mystery.

This whole discussion is one of the reasons I think the study of higher math and physics is important for theologians.
 
Hello all,
Thanks for the interesting responses. SMHW, you’ve touched upon the limitations of our human minds and of language, which will never allow us to fully comprehend these mysteries. I agree with you about physics and higher math. Albert Einstein used to ponder spiritual matters quite a bit, I’m told.

The structure of the physical universe probably mirrors spiritual realities, I think. Take, for instances, the marvelous complexities of the human body and the individual cells that make it up. Perhaps the Holy Spirit is like the nervous system, bringing messages to the body from the brain. And, what about the endrocrine system, with hormonal messengers that control so many events neccessary for the maintainance of the body! How does this compare with the Body of Christ? And, when the Church on Earth is sick, or in conflict, see how the Body suffers! When the Church has strife within, it turns on itsself, much the same way the human body can with autoimmune diseases.

And, how beautiful will be the resurrected Body of Christ when all is made perfect in Christ!
 
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