Trinity is Compatible with Judaism and IMO, Islam.

[jfhh]

Trinity is Compatible with Judaism and IMO, Islam.

We need to separate Incarnation from Trinity. According to Christianity, Trinity existed long before Incarnation happened. So let’s focus on the Trinity itself. Some Christians (even a couple Catholic priests) even believe in Trinity without believing Jesus is God. But this is not a thread to debate those Christians. Please do NOT derail this thread. Check title of thread

Kabbalah is controversial. Some Jews accept it; others don’t. One who didn’t admitted that Kabbalah Judaism is compatible with Trinity
wikipedia:

Rabbi Leone di Modena, a 17th century Venetian critic of Kabbalah, wrote that if we were to accept the Kabbalah, then the Christian trinity would indeed be compatible with Judaism, as the Trinity closely resembles the Kabbalistic doctrine of the Sefirot. This critique was in response to the knowledge that some European Jews of the period addressed individual Sefirot in some of their prayers, although the practise was apparently uncommon.

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Kabbalah
en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Sephirot

If you are a Muslim you must know about the 99 names of God

en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Ninety-nine_names_of_Allah

In Sufi Islam
wikipedia:

In Sufism, the idea of the 100th name is most prominent. It has become the elusive object of mystic devotion, the symbol of God’s transcendent being. Sufis often describe their discipline as the quest to know the one-hundredth name of God and thus to merge their consciousness with the divine reality

Maybe the Trinity in some spiritual sense in a mystical way is related to this 100th name? Maybe God has revealed this 100th name to both Christians and Muslims and Jews too. Maybe God revealed it in one way to Jews through Kabbalah mysticism, in another way to Christians through Trinity mysticism – there is lots of Christian mystical writing on Trinity, including by Catholics – and in another way to Muslims, through this Sufi mysticism about the 100th name. God loves all his creatures. God’s ways are far above our own. He can have worked in unexpected ways. I think Jews, Christians, and Muslims should learn from each other. Instead of trying to convert each other, we should try to first pause, pray to God, and pray that we may be open to what He may teach through others.

And let different Muslim sects learn from each other too. I know other Muslims believe in the 100th name too besides Sufis. Let us let whatever our religion is – Christian, Jewish, Muslim – produce peace in our heart, our neighbor, and world. Then we will better understand our sacred texts and traditions. Our heart must be pure to see God, Jesus says. Our heart must be pure also to see what God wants us to hear, hear, in our hearts.

 

[Muslim_Woman]

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Salaam/peace

…We need to separate Incarnation from Trinity.

still there is a problem . Muslims don’t believe God has any son .

I know other Muslims believe in the 100th name too besides Sufis.

all the names indicate One God only. Creation is not equal to the Creator.

Let us let whatever our religion is – Christian, Jewish, Muslim – produce peace in our heart,.

Holy Quran : The Family Of 'Imran, The House Of 'Imran

Say: "O People of the Book!

come to common terms as between us and you: That we worship none but God. that we associate no partners with Him; that we erect not, from among ourselves, Lords and patrons other than God."

If then they turn back, say ye: "Bear witness that we (at least) are Muslims (bowing to God’s Will).
( 3:64)

 

[inJESUS]

Am not sure about the Kabbalah since i read Jews telling us one must be over 40 to learn Kabbalah.

Muslim Women, a whole thread was dedicated to make you understand, and after posting more than 800 posts on this forum, you still don’t understand what Son means?

 

[Silouan]

Trinity is Compatible with Judaism and IMO, Islam.

We need to separate Incarnation from Trinity. .

I would say, in principle, this is true. The real problem that Muslims have with the trinity, is in reality, the incarnation, and not really the Trinity.

Because fundamentally speaking, God is eternally with His Power (Holy Spirit) and His Wisdom (His Speech or Word). This is why in Islam Tawhid, actually means Unity of God, and not Oneness of God, the Uniting of all the different qualities of God into Oneness, this is why you you find Tawhid translated as Oneness. But linguistically it means to unite.

still there is a problem . Muslims don’t believe God has any son .

Muslim Woman, don’t get thrown off by semantics. We don’t have to use the word, “Son.” Trinity is in the Old Testament.
The Old Testament word for “son”, is The Word. You have to look at the meaning of word, not necessarily the outward form of it.

If you study fiqh, you would understand the importance of looking at the meaning of words, because, the scholars of Islam, differed alot semantically but not alot in meaning, for example, Abu Hanifa, said Iman does not increase or decrease, a position held by the Maturidis, the Asharis and the Hanbalis believe that Iman increases and decreases. From the outward prespective, it appears as if there is a difference of opinion, when in reality there isn’t because Abu Hanifa is using a different definition of iman with his statement than the Asharis and the Hanbalis are using.

• Silouan

 

[inJESUS]

I would say, in principle, this is true. The real problem that Muslims have with the trinity, is in reality, the incarnation, and not really the Trinity

.

Because fundamentally speaking, God is eternally with His Power (Holy Spirit) and His Wisdom (His Speech or Word). This is why in Islam Tawhid, actually means Unity of God, and not Oneness of God, the Uniting of all the different qualities of God into Oneness, this is why you you find Tawhid translated as Oneness. But linguistically it means to unite.indeed.

 

[Muslim_Woman]

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Salaam/peace

Silouan: Trinity is in the Old Testament.

–pl. post the verse where Trinity is mentioned.

inJESUS:…you still don’t understand what Son means?

well , it’s the Christians who give a special meaning & status to son Jesus (p) & ignore many other sons of God in OT.

They make this son so special that he is now equal to God .

They ignore the fact that son was used to described many others like Adam (p) is son of God.

 

[inJESUS]

well , it’s the Christians who give a special meaning & status to son Jesus (p) & ignore many other sons of God in OT.

They make this son so special that he is now equal to God .

They ignore the fact that son was used to described many others like Adam (p) is son of God. Jesus being the Son, in Christian theology refers to the WORD of God, eternal, uncreated. It has nothing to do with “partners”, “women” or “marriage” and we acknowledge that many are called sons of God in the OT and NT for we are as well called sons of God.

 

[inJESUS]

http://theislampath.com/smf/Smileys/default/salam.gif

Salaam/peace

Silouan: Trinity is in the Old Testament.

–pl. post the verse where Trinity is mentioned.

.

the word Trinity is mentioned nowhere in the whole Bible just as the word Tawhid is not found in the Quran. What you will find in the Bible is the Eternal and Uncreated Spirit of God, the Eternal and Uncreated Word of God.

References to the Holy spirit in OT and NT, the Eternal and Uncreated and Omnipresent Spirit:

Gen. 1:2 And the earth was without form, and void; and darkness was upon the face of the deep. And the **Spirit **of God moved upon the face of the waters.

By the **word **of the Lord were the heavens made,
and all their hosts by the **breath **(spirit) of His mouth” (Psalm 33.6).

"Where can I go from your Spirit? Where can I flee your presence? If I go up to the heavens, you are there; if I make my bed in the depths, you are there. If I rise on the wings of the dawn, if I settle on the far side of the sea, even there your hand will guide me, your right hand will hold me fast." (Psalm 139:7-10)

“When you send your Spirit, they are created, and you renew the face of the earth.” (Psalm 104:30)

But as for me, I am **filled **with power, with the Spirit of the Lord, and with justice and might, to declare to Jacob his transgression, to Israel his sin." (Micah 3:8)

“Then Peter said, 'Ananias, how is it that Satan has so filled your heart that you **have lied to the Holy Spirit **and have kept for yourself some of the money you received for the land…You have not lied to men but to God.”
Acts 5:3-4

1 Cor. 12:3 Wherefore I give you to understand, that no man speaking by the Spirit of God calleth Jesus accursed: and that no man can say that Jesus is the Lord, but by the Holy Ghost.

From OT and NT, the Holy Spirit is not a creature. The Holy Spirit exists before creation, the Holy Spirit creates, the holy Spirit is Omnipresent, the Holy Spirit fills humans.

Regarding the Son/Word/Wisdom, since the Bible uses them interchangeable:

By the **word **of the Lord were the heavens made,
and all their hosts by the **breath **(spirit) of His mouth” (Psalm 33.6).

Proverbs 8:22-30 The LORD possessed me (Wisdom) in the beginning of his way, before his works of old. I was set up from everlasting, from the beginning, or ever the earth was. When there were no depths, I was brought forth; when there were no fountains abounding with water. Before the mountains were settled, before the hills was I brought forth: While as yet he had not made the earth, nor the fields, nor the highest part of the dust of the world. When he prepared the heavens, I was there: when he set a compass upon the face of the depth: When he established the clouds above: when he strengthened the fountains of the deep: When he gave to the sea his decree, that the waters should not pass his commandment: when he appointed the foundations of the earth: Then I was by him, as one brought up with him: and I was daily his delight, rejoicing always before him…

John 1:1-3** In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God**. The same was in the beginning with God. All things were made by him; and without him was not any thing made that was made.

.
Wisdom of Solomon 9:9 With you (God) is Wisdom, who knows your works and was present when you made the world

John 1:11 He came unto his own, and his own received him not. (1:11)
1 Enoch 42:2 Wisdom went forth to make her dwelling among the children of men, and found no dwelling place.

John 14:15 If you love me, you will obey what I command.
Wisdom of Solomon 16:18 And love of Wisdom is the keeping of her laws, and giving heed to her laws is assurance of immortality.

This is how the Bible reveals the Holy Trinity, the Tawhid of the Father, his Spirit and His Word , inseperable for “whatever the Father does, the Son does likewise.” and " i and the Father are One", revelations on the tongue of different prophets in different times, fully revealed in the person of Jesus Christ, the Word in Flesh who incarnated throu Mary without a biological father.